How do these look

[161]

[Haggway]

Look better than my first attempt.

[docone31]

I might snip half the tail, and crush the rest up to the base.
When I final size mine, the ram crushes the tail up.

[geargnasher]

You wrapped them backwards!

Actually, looking closer, I think you might have better luck if you flipped the patch over and started rolling the pointy end of the patch on the front end of the boolit instead of the base end, in other words place the patch on your board so the tip is touching just in front of that front band. Lay the boolit across the patch so enough of the tip of the patch sticks out from under it that you can flip it up with your thumb and stick it to the boolit, then begin rolling the boolit taking care to keep the patch and boolit square. When you twist, the twist will be going in the direction of the patch splice, instead of away from it. Think rubbing a cat's fur backwards, if I'm thinking right that's what's happening when you twist the tail, it pulls the last lap at the base back away from the splice point a bit and is leaving a little gap between patch ends.

One other trick I discovered that works with most papers is that after the patch is dried, you can re-twist the tail a bit, and it stays twisted better. It's almost like aluminum foil after drying, holds it's shape after reforming. Then trim and mash it in a base-first sizer. If it gets a little lube on the base when you size, so much the better.

The best part is when you stuff 'em in a case and send 'em downrange in a cloud of confetti!!

Have fun,

Gear

[161]

OK talk me through this.

I take the boolit point the nose to the right in front of me. Then take the point of the patch under the boolit, starting the long end of the patch to the right towards the nose. I've been rolling it away from me. When finished I twist the tail with my left hand towards me or clockwise if your looking at the base of the boolit.

[rays308]

Not trying to steel the thread but the picture shows the lines of the notebook paper very well and I'm wondering if they are going the right way for the grain of the paper? I've read that the direction of the grain may make a difference.

Also, could it be that the patch is just a little short? Like the template could be just a little longer or is a little gap ok?

161,
Please don't think I'm critisizing. I am learning also. I think the roll looks great.
The patch looks good and tight.
I got dishpan fingers before I got one looking that good.

[geargnasher]

OK talk me through this.

I take the boolit point the nose to the right in front of me. Then take the point of the patch under the boolit, starting the long end of the patch to the right towards the nose. I've been rolling it away from me. When finished I twist the tail with my left hand towards me or clockwise if your looking at the base of the boolit.

Never mind , you got it right. It just looked like you wrapped the patch counter-clockwise from the base and twisted it clockwise, but I see the lapped side better now that you described how you put it on.

Gear

[saint_iverson]

Curious, paper patching a bullet with a lube groove? Practice or??

[docone31]

I only use the ones with a lube groove.
They work well for me.

[geargnasher]

Curious, paper patching a bullet with a lube groove? Practice or??

I've learned from the good folks here that it's the way to go when using smokeless powder, cores that are a thousandth or two over bore diameter, and wet-applied patches that end up being a thousandth or two over groove diameter. Totally different concept than when shooting black powder with dead-soft lead and patches that are applied either dry or wet.

I sling these cast from wheel weights out to 400 yards in a Shiloh 45/90 Winchester after I size them .459" in a Lyman 450 with some heat and just enough lube pressure to leave a thin film of Felix lube on the paper but not fill the grooves:



Gear

[303Guy]

I've found that with a little practice which involves rolling between finger and spongy rolling pad that the patch can be made to conform very nicely to the contour of the grooves. Not sure that it matters but they do look nice that way.

I think (dangerous , I know) that those samples are good to go with a little snipping of the twisted tail bit. (I have made like perfect patches that shoot like poo!) If they fit the throat reasonably well and have the right powder and load they'll work fine. Of course, there will always be room for improvement, which is what keeps us at it. It's all in the fun! (I've been slack lately and have made no progress at all! )

[161]

Not trying to steel the thread but the picture shows the lines of the notebook paper very well and I'm wondering if they are going the right way for the grain of the paper? I've read that the direction of the grain may make a difference.

Also, could it be that the patch is just a little short? Like the template could be just a little longer or is a little gap ok?

161,
Please don't think I'm critisizing. I am learning also. I think the roll looks great.
The patch looks good and tight.
I got dishpan fingers before I got one looking that good.

No problem, Good questions.
161

[saint_iverson]

So you are just PP to increase diameter to better fill the lands within the rifling?

[303Guy]

saint_iverson, the paper patch forms a jacket with bearing properties that carries the boolit through the bore. It does indeed increase the diameter to fill the bore but then the casting is made smaller to accommodate it. It has the advantage of been able to grip the case neck with less neck tension so the casting doesn't get deformed on seating. They can also be made fatter so no neck sizing is required which also provides a neat fit in the throat.

[6.5 mike]

Unless you have a custom smooth sided mould made for the size needed most use lube grooved moulds. Lyman did make 2 .30 caliber pp'ing moulds, both were a loverin style with muliti grooves, I guess the help grip the paper.

Tom at accurate moulds has both smooth & what looks like tumble lube grooved models for pp'ing.

[161]

Got my LEE .457 sizer and opened it up to .460. The pics are a Suter's Choice 405gr. on the left and one of my LEE 405 gr. on the right. Sized .452 two wraps note book paper and sized .460. The target is 50 yards off the hood of my truck with an open sighted Guide Gun. 15 gr. of Unique. I shot some 2400 and RX7 at 1600-1700 FPS but they were about 3 inches. What do ya think?

[softpoint]

Got my LEE .457 sizer and opened it up to .460. The pics are a Suter's Choice 405gr. on the left and one of my LEE 405 gr. on the right. Sized .452 two wraps note book paper and sized .460. The target is 50 yards off the hood of my truck with an open sighted Guide Gun. 15 gr. of Unique. I shot some 2400 and RX7 at 1600-1700 FPS but they were about 3 inches. What do ya think?

Should work on anything you point them at! I use a 340 grain Lee, It casts right at .457, and just wrap 2 wraps of tracing paper, run through a 460 sizer. I use pure lead, and get about 1950 fps. with RL7. Killed 2 whitetails with this load this past season. They never took even 1 step after being hit.

[161]

I wish the 15 gr. of Unique didn't shoot so far to the left. I have some wrapped with trace paper also just need time to shoot.

[nanuk]

the couple points I have read and tried to remember...

wrap the patch so the pointy end of the patch is UNDER the wraps, at the front, and OVER the wraps at the base, as it is the most fragile.

find the grain. take a two strips, and the one that droops more is the one cut in the direction you want.

find a paper that is thick/thin enough that two wraps gives you what you need.

boolit 0.001-0.0015 over BORE, patched to 0.001-0.002 over groove MINIMUM. Use the fattest that will slide into a fired case, and still chamber.

Pdawg recommends using the powder that fills the case and gets you the speed you want. He finds that is the most accurate most of the time.

make sure the bore is Totally Free of ANY/ALL copper fouling.

spring is just around the corner, I hope to get my stuff together to bring it all together.

I've got a few toys to play with.

if this works as well for me as for others, I won't be needing to use a J-word again.

Last year I wrapped a few things, then tossed them into my Carryall for work and let them roll around to be battered as Nature would have it....

so far, NO patches have come off, and none are damaged enough that if they had been sized to fit, could not be loaded and shot.
this included some cast, some J-words, some broken drill bit, a pencil....

[Boondocker]

Dang it why did I even come to this thread. Just what I need more experimenting to try. Nice groups there 161, now I got to study up and try this stuff!