45 Colt Ruger Only Question.

[Michael J. Spangler]

Hi guys.
I've been reading a lot about 45 colt. I just got my first 45 colt firearm this weekend. A ruger Blackhawk with a 5.5" barrel.
In reading tons of articles on load data I read something that emphasized the use of heavy bullets. I was reading till about 1 am this morning and read a cool article. In the article it gave an explanation of why with max ruger only load the 300 grain bullet only had a 70 fps or so advantage over the 360.

Now I can't for the life of me find the article or remember the reason.

Has anyone read this? Or maybe someone has some insight into it.
Damn full moon, can't sleep but can't remember what I read the night before. ; )

Thanks guys.

[M-Tecs]

Any of these what you are looking for?

http://www.customsixguns.com/writing...ht_bullets.htm
http://www.realguns.com/archives/121.htm
http://www.realguns.com/loads/45coltr.htm

[RobS]

I don't know about the article but Asking for safety measures as you pursue Ruger/TC only 45 Colt loads, do you have the Ruger Large frame BH? There are two different New Model Blackhawks these days. I have a new model Flat Top BH that is build off of the smaller frame with a smaller cylinder etc same as the new model BH Vaquero's. These two smaller frame revolvers are good for around 20K but not on up into the upper 20K and 30K area. I also own a Ruger Bisley 5.5 and there is definitely a difference between the two.

[osteodoc08]

I love my 45 Colts. If you can't get it done with a ruger only loading in 45Colt, you really need a rifle.

[C. Latch]

Or maybe someone has some insight into it.

Take a long, hard look at what you plan on shooting with your .45, versus how much you like recoil.

Personally, I want a bullet to pass through a critter, doing damage along the way, and only exiting with enough speed left to ensure the exit. For deer-sized game I'm thinking anything over about 260 grains is wasted in a flat point and anything over 300 is wasted in a hollowpoint. For elk, I think you could change those numbers to 300 and 325. For bear defense where you have to take whatever shot angle(s) you can get, I still wouldn't go over 325 with a flat point.

Maybe, just maybe, a 360 would make sense on bison or moose. Unless you really want to kill moose and plow your garden with the same shot, you don't need a 360.

(this opinion worth what it cost you)

[Michael J. Spangler]

Thanks guys. I'll check those articles.
I'm not planning on loading 360 grain bullets but the article piqued my interest and I totally forgot the reason why. Hahaha.

I do in fact have a large frame Blackhawk capable of the heavy loads. Again I don't intend to do much heavy loading but I do plan on a 300 grain bullet for some fun from time to time either light or heavy loads.

[DrCaveman]

Best i can do is paraphrase some other stuff ive read/heard, since my lil' 45 colt can only handle the older BP pressure loads...

45 colt supposedly maxes out at around 350 for practical accuracy and safety. Has to do with barrel twist vs case capacity and max safe pressures. Basically i think you cant get a heavier bullet going fast enough to stabilize for long-range accuracy within (even ruger-only) safe pressures. [feel free to correct this if someone has a contradictory experience]

That said, IF i had a bomb-proof 45 colt, id probably try to get a 300-325 cooking at 12-1400 fps, and try to find accuracy. Ive messed with heavier and faster in my 460, and im pretty sure it is more than needed for any situation i am likely to encounter. Ive even settled on a 340 grain load going about 1500 as my practical max in the 460 s&w. Thats why i bought the little 45, because i decided a 255 gr at 750 fps is still enough punch for my needs.

Have fun with that blackhawk. The lee 300 flat nose pushed at 1200 is a force to be reckoned with

[DougGuy]

You reach a point of diminishing return with every caliber eventually. Several factors cause this but it basically comes down to laws of physics. As boolit weights increase, velocities slow down. To keep velocities up, powder must increase. As this happens, pressure increases dramatically until it becomes dangerous to proceed farther. Most sensible shooters will read enough and educate themselves enough to know better than to push this "point of diminishing return" because it cannot be exceeded with any degree of safety.

In the .45 Colt that point is about 340gr and boolit weights beyond this are futile and unnecessary as energy and velocity fall off rather quickly. It's very simple. If you want a .45 caliber boolit to do more, you have to put more cartridge behind it and stronger thicker steel around it. In other words, use a bigger gun.

In a short barreled .45 Colt pistol, the 300gr boolit is about as much fun as most people can hope for. It can be accurate to a given distance, it can be driven to a lethal velocity, and it's recoil can be managed with a little experience. All the while there is still enough headroom to not beat the gun to death in short order.

70f/s might not sound like much of an advantage, but that's just on paper. I would say that of the heavy for caliber boolits readily available for the .45 Colt, the 300gr RF boolit is near or at the top of the list for many on this forum as far as enjoyment in shooting, hunting, casting, and loading. There are a whole lot more advantages to this boolit than just 70 feet per second.

[Michael J. Spangler]

I totally a green with the diminishing returns.
It just seems like with that large of a jump in weight the velocity should have dropped more than what it did.
Like I stated in the op. There was an article that explained why the 45 colt shined and was able to maintain its velocity with the heavy weight bullet and stay within the same pressure limits.

Damned if I can find the article again though.

[101VooDoo]

Here's an excellent article on reloading for the flattop Blackhawk 45s. I know you have the standard Blackhawk, but there's lots of good info here:

http://buffalobore.net/HandloaderDecJan2012.pdf

[canyon-ghost]

You reach a point of diminishing return with every caliber eventually. Several factors cause this but it basically comes down to laws of physics. As boolit weights increase, velocities slow down. To keep velocities up, powder must increase. As this happens, pressure increases dramatically until it becomes dangerous to proceed farther. Most sensible shooters will read enough and educate themselves enough to know better than to push this "point of diminishing return" because it cannot be exceeded with any degree of safety.

Well said, very well said. Even in small calibers, there is a point where light, fast bullets are better than heavy ones. It does happen without recoil being a factor too.

[MT Gianni]

I have really enjoyed shooting the 454424 in mine. Runs about 250 gr.

[LAH]

The lee 300 flat nose pushed at 1200 is a force to be reckoned with

On both ends.

[Michael J. Spangler]

I shot some 255s over 18 grains of 2400 last night.
Not bad at all. I really hate the ruger hard plastic grips. They have a mean sharp edge that hurts when you shoot.
In comparison the worn grips on my friends vaquero was a pleasure to shoot.

[Michael J. Spangler]

From the Ross Seyfried article.

"These loads also point out an interesting facet
of the .45 and other big-bore revolvers. That is, it is easier to
drive big bullets than small ones. All three loads are loaded to the
same pressure level, and the diminutive 260-grain bullet only exceeds
the spectacular 325-grain LBT by 50 fps."

This is what I'm taking about. I could have sworn there was an article that had explained this a bit though.

[starmac]

Could it be that the bigger bullet needing more pressure to get moving is utilizing the powder better than a lighter bullet? Just a thought.

[Changeling]

I shot some 255s over 18 grains of 2400 last night.
Not bad at all. I really hate the ruger hard plastic grips. They have a mean sharp edge that hurts when you shoot.
In comparison the worn grips on my friends vaquero was a pleasure to shoot.

MS those standard Ruger grips bothered me to. I started using "Packmar" (.44 Mag) grips and the recoil was a lot friendlier. I also have a set for my Ruger .45Colt, but haven't used them yet.
There is another brand that a lot of people here use and come on a lot of revolvers now from the factory, but the name excapes me at the moment. Beware the finger grove grips untill you try them. You can't really reposition your hand with them, a turn off for many!

[C. Latch]

Hornady's Ruger-only .45 data seems to disagree.

It shows a 325-grain bullet at ~1266' FPS with a maximum charge. I suspect one could push harder, based on the pressures Hornady shows, so let's say 1300'.

The also show 1455' with a 250-grain jacketed bullet. One could easily beat that by 100' with a 260-grain lead slug, so we're talking 1550' or so.

I've never pushed my 260's past 1450' or so, but it was easy to get them there, and I think I had plenty of room to keep going up.

[ddixie884]

Linebaugh goes pretty deep on heavier weight bullets being easier to get ME with than lighter slugs. Go to Handloads.com search for his .45 article. Never mind me, M-tech has a link above.

[jaydub in wi]

From the Ross Seyfried article.

"These loads also point out an interesting facet
of the .45 and other big-bore revolvers. That is, it is easier to
drive big bullets than small ones. All three loads are loaded to the
same pressure level, and the diminutive 260-grain bullet only exceeds
the spectacular 325-grain LBT by 50 fps."

This is what I'm taking about. I could have sworn there was an article that had explained this a bit though.

I think he may have been referring to factory ammo.IIRC