FL vs neck vs nothing

[lastborn]

I'm going to try paper patching for my marlin 1895 45/70. I have a Lyman neck sizing die and a FL sizing die. I have read everything from NO sizing at all to neck sizing only to FL sizing. Which is correct? Also, I will be using the NOE 460350 and the Ranch Dog TLC-460425 -- do I patch without the gas check? Patch with the gas check? Going to use pure lead and size to .454 and use 9lb onion skin. If I can get the hang of it with decent results I plan on trying it with the thuddy thuddy and the .35
Thanks
Any and all tips, advice, and recommendations appreciated!!!

[6.5 mike]

With a lever gun you may need to lightly neck size to keep your boolits from moving durning recoil. Not sure how hard you plan on pushing the load. Or perhaps a light crimp, just enough to be able to see it.

No gas check needed, the paper does the same job. I have wrapped some with checks on only cuz they where already there, .

If your finial size is 0.460 ish, you should be good with what you have figured. I would make a couple of dummy rounds to check cycling & feeding from the magazine. Also to check the OAL for chambering.

[Nobade]

I don't know about yours but my 1895CB has a pretty snug chamber, and doesn't let the brass expand much. For PP ammo I don't resize the cases at all, just load it up and use the Lyman taper crimp die to keep the boolits from falling out. I can turn them by hand but not pull them out after doing that. The powder charge keeps them from telescoping back into the case. I do shoot PP ammo single loaded though, haven't tried running any through the magazine. The throat is very short and there isn't much patch sticking out of the case, but the Ranch Dog 455-290 45 Colt boolit shoots awesome patched up to .460".

Yours should work well too, you've got the right paper and sizes in mind. No need for the gas check, and any alloy from pure lead to ACWW should work well.

[pdawg_shooter]

For working loads I size. For accuracy loads (plinking or load testing) I bell, seat and crimp. These are single loaded in the rifle and not fed from a magazine.

[CJR]

I used to assume all rifle chambers were cut to SAAMI dimensions. Then I started measuring them and what a surprise. It seems the rifle manufacturers chamber their rifles the way they want to. Some free-bore them, I assume to lower pressures and liabilities.

In my view, the first step is to always measure the chamber to see what you've got to work with. Then you can apply the proper technique to get accuracy. That appears to me to be a better approach than just applying rules to an unmeasured chamber.

Best regards,

CJR

[Nobade]

I used to assume all rifle chambers were cut to SAAMI dimensions. Then I started measuring them and what a surprise. It seems the rifle manufacturers chamber their rifles the way they want to. Some free-bore them, I assume to lower pressures and liabilities.

In my view, the first step is to always measure the chamber to see what you've got to work with. Then you can apply the proper technique to get accuracy. That appears to me to be a better approach than just applying rules to an unmeasured chamber.

Best regards,

CJR

You're right on with that!
I have several rifles that don't need the brass resized at all. But others that require it. Just depends on the relationship of the case neck, throat, and bore diameter. One thing that is useful for bottleneck cases is the Lee collet die. You can control the sized to diameter to a point by how tight you make the die in the press. Sometimes it's just enough to be perfect for PPCB.

[303Guy]

If you happen to have or know someone who has a lathe, it's pretty easy to make a neck sizer die for minimal sizing.

[geargnasher]

You're right on with that!
I have several rifles that don't need the brass resized at all. But others that require it. Just depends on the relationship of the case neck, throat, and bore diameter. One thing that is useful for bottleneck cases is the Lee collet die. You can control the sized to diameter to a point by how tight you make the die in the press. Sometimes it's just enough to be perfect for PPCB.

You said a mouthfull there!

THOSE relationships are the determining factors in lots of things, like boolit size, patched size, case headstamp, or whether you need to give up and get a new barrel! RE. our conversation about the philosophies of chamber/throat design and fitting fixed ammunition for best accuracy with PPCBs.

Gear

[303Guy]

I find the thick compressible printer paper useful for a 'tight' fit in my 303's. Almost finger fitting with a little help from the press and they are tight enough to withstand magazine feeding and not get stuck in the throat on extracting an unfired round but still give a snug fit in the throat. I'm not sure the it's the best paper for accuracy though it does require a smaller casting.