Brown (AKA cocoa) gunpowder

[Hang Fire]

Has anyone ever used brown (AKA cocoa) gunpowder? In the late 1800s it was starting to be used in the worlds navies and for artillery, then smokeless came on the scene and brown was gone.

As I understand it, brown was made with partially carbonized wheat straw, was slower burning and produced considerably higher velocities with less fouling and smoke.

[powderburnerr]

never heard of that , but it will be interesting to see what comes up , sounds like a powder company might have started up in the prarie states and didnt want to ship wood for charcoal, so came up with a new sourse, cool

[Hang Fire]

I think it was the Germans who started using it.

Not really that much information is given through Google.

http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy-a...iw=960&bih=459

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&sa=X&ei...iw=960&bih=459

[Chicken Thief]

The constituents of cocoa powder are: Saltpetre 79%, Charcoal 18% and Sulphur 3%. The charcoal was now made from straw carbonised by steam.

http://www.victorianshipmodels.com/c...gunpowder.html

[cajun shooter]

The Brown Powder was made and used in the US. It was found to be not as good as the black and production was stopped. Later David

[Hang Fire]

The Brown Powder was made and used in the US. It was found to be not as good as the black and production was stopped. Later David

Do you have provenance that was the reason it was dropped? My understanding was the brown was supplanted by smokeless.

[cdet69]

I thought it was a pre smokeless powder?

[Ed in North Texas]

http://www.victorianshipmodels.com/c...gunpowder.html

Thanks for that link, it was a very informative article on the progression from round shot muzzle loading cannon through to modern smokeless. It would appear that the development of Cocoa, and later Slow Burning Cocoa (SBC), was driven specifically by the need for large Naval guns firing projectiles intended to penetrate armor. With the reports of powder smoke interfering with visual sighting of ships at the Battle of Jutland in WW I, it seems obvious that the main batteries of both sides were using the SBC at that time.

[cajun shooter]

Hang Fire, I don't understand your chest out stance but just look it up and make up your own mind. If it's different from mine then so be it. You have a nice Day Now.
Yes it was made as an improvement for black during the time of Transition.

[13Echo]

According to T. L. Davis in "The Chemistry of Powder and Explosives" cocoa powder was made as "--- single perforated hexagonal or octagonal prisms which resembled pieces of milk chocolate. A partially burned brown charcoal made from rye straw was used. This had colloidal properties and flowed under pressure, cementing the grains together, and made it possible to manufacture powders which were slow burning because they contained little sulfur or sometimes even none." It was the most successful form of black powder used in long range guns (artillery) but came late and was quickly replaced with smokeless propellants. It was also apparently much more sensitive to friction than standard BP with "samples -- reported to have inflamed from shaking in a canvas bag." It did see use in the Spanish American War.

Jerry Liles

[Hang Fire]

Hang Fire, I don't understand your chest out stance but just look it up and make up your own mind. If it's different from mine then so be it. You have a nice Day Now.
Yes it was made as an improvement for black during the time of Transition.

You made a statement which contradicted what I had read and stated. If you had a link to provenance as opposed to my understanding, I wanted to read it, as there will always different opinions, but not different facts.

Methinks you misunderstood, or you chose your chest out stance retort for other reasons.

[Hang Fire]

According to T. L. Davis in "The Chemistry of Powder and Explosives" cocoa powder was made as "--- single perforated hexagonal or octagonal prisms which resembled pieces of milk chocolate. A partially burned brown charcoal made from rye straw was used. This had colloidal properties and flowed under pressure, cementing the grains together, and made it possible to manufacture powders which were slow burning because they contained little sulfur or sometimes even none." It was the most successful form of black powder used in long range guns (artillery) but came late and was quickly replaced with smokeless propellants. It was also apparently much more sensitive to friction than standard BP with "samples -- reported to have inflamed from shaking in a canvas bag." It did see use in the Spanish American War.

Jerry Liles

Thanks for the information, that would explain it's short use life. And don't think I would want a powder horn full of it on my hip when could get a big bang from shaking.