Bull Plate: Substitute again

[btroj]

What is the big deal. You guys know what to buy and where to but it. Send money to Bullshop and get the lube.

So Gear had some analyzed to find out exactly what it is. Call it personal curiosity. If you need to know so bad then buy some and have it analyzed.

I do not understand this notion that we have a "right" to know what it is.

Dan is a one man shop. He does this to supplement his income. Ever think that many of us here find taking care of ones family to be a nable cause? Ever think we don't want to go elsewhere for lube out of respect for a man and his family?

[MGySgt]

Good reply btroj! Actually one of the best!

[Herb3]

Originally Posted by geargnasher

The only reason I sought the formula was because I wanted a guaranteed lifetime supply for not only sprue plate lube, but for boolit lube as well, and it takes a lot of Bullplate to make Speed Green

I know I am new here and I do not want to start a flame war but the above quote is why people are pushing to find out what Bullplate is. We all want a guaranteed lifetime supply just like Gear. I have one bottle of Bullplate that I ordered earlier this year while the Bull Shop still had internet access and it works great but I do not have enough to make some Speed Green because has Gear has said it takes a lot of BullPlate to make the lube. Others here have said just get it from the Bull Shop and don't worry about what it is because Dan needs the support but from what I have read here that has been hit or miss also on the lube and no one it seems has been able to see if the bullet lube is available.

Again we all are looking for the something and that is a guaranteed supply but unfortunately we not have that right now. Until we have that guaranteed supply this battle will go on.

[Recluse]

This is silly already!! What's the big secret? Why do people get flamed just for asking what BP is? Nobody is crying for Lee Precision with their Lee Liquid Alox and they're also a sponsor here. Someone found out what it is and it's no secret:
"The formula is Alox-606-55-HF, this is 55% alox 606 cut with High flash point (172 degrees) Mineral Spirits."
Search for it on this site, that's where I found it.

Someone on this site is selling the stuff and I'm sure Lee Precision isn't happy. They have employees that are being hurt by someone else selling it but it's not a secret forumla. It's something everyone can go out and buy in bulk if they want and repackage it and sell it. There's no patent infringment against Lee since they're just repackaging Alox-606-55-HF.

Why is is ok to spill the beans on LLA and a horrible crime for BP?

Bull Plate Lube is just some synthetic 2 cycle oil, which exact one is the question. There's no secret mix or years of costly research. It's not seal blubber rendered and mixed with moose fat cooked at a special temp then added to something else. The bullshop people have chainsaws, snowmobiles, outboard motors and most likely just grabbed the oil they use and found it works great for sprue plates. Many of us have already tried synthetic 2 cycle oils and found they work just about the same.

If someone knows which oil it is, post it already and be done with it. Nobody is going to get sued and the bullshop people won't be hurt as they're not even in business any more. It's truely time to move on already.

Just my opinion, but this is an apples to oranges argument.

Lee Liquid Alox is GIVEN away with Lee's push-through sizing die kits. Furthermore, alox is still purchased in mass quantities for a variety of other purposes, chiefly of which is rust-prevention/metals preservation.

I was around and getting ready to come out of the lurk cave from the old Shooter.com days when Dan announced the formula for Bullplate, and I remember specifically that it is a BLEND and not one single ingredient.

I also remember how danged well it worked at the time and what a huge, significant improvement in casting it was for a lot of us, especially those of us who had/have aluminum molds in our inventory. At the time, if you recall, all group buys were going through Lee. . .

And finally, if you compare Lee Precision's modus operandi and list of inventory and services compared with the Bullshop's, you'll see a difference. A big difference.

I have no doubt that LLA is at the very bottom of Lee Precision's sales list in terms of numbers purchased by specific order (meaning customers who order the LLA specifically rather than having it included in a push-through sizing die kit). Lee's presses, dies, FCDs, molds, etc overwhelmingly make up their sales numbers and money generator.

On the other hand, so far as the Bullshop goes, while not expensive, I would venture that Bullplate is at or near the top of products Dan and Tina sell--and they do so to feed and take care of their family.

I think the world of Dan, Tina, Junior and the family and I will continue to purchase, buy and support the Bullshop however and whenever I can. The man had some family issues he deemed serious enough to pull the plug on the internet for. His choice.

Bad business decision? Maybe. Good family decision? Sounds like it.

Bear in the mind that Dan and Tina are not Harvard MBAs who have sat in the CEO's chair at Fortune 1000 companies. They are honest, God-fearing Christians who run a small family-owned/operated business from an extremely remote location. They know how to make a first-rate product, sell it honestly and use the money for honorable purposes (sustaining their family). Business mistakes will happen, and shutting down the internet/no communications was one of them.

I choose to look at the big picture with Dan and Tina and continue to support them.

Quite honestly, I'm wondering what has happened to our forum. Three years ago, this discussion never would've taken place, let alone a frenzy to try and upend a respected member's source of additional income.

But today, it seems to not only be fair game, but expected. . . like some sort of a reality TV challenge.

Just don't get it.

[Finnmike]

Some people just love to be "special". A few years back I shared a "honey-hole" for milsurps with a "friend", and the next thing he's blabbed all over the internet to get his 15 minutes of attention. That place now runs internet auctions on all their stuff at high prices. Thanks, "buddy"....

[mdi]

I haven't tried to get any Bull Plate for a while and am running low. I used a lot to make Speed Green and saved one bottle for lubing molds, etc. So, now that I need more bullet lube I'll have to use a substitute (actually a fun process) to find a concoction that works as well as Speed Green. So what? If I can no longer get Bull Plate I'll find something that works. I don't need to know exactly the blend that Bullshop uses for his Bull Plate, just one that works as well, and I'll find one for sure. Don't see what all the fuss is, Bull Plate isn't a National Security secret, and I don't think it's copy writed/patented, so quit worrying about exactly what makes up Bull Plate and find something that'll work. (I have found a 2-cycle motor oil that seems to be working fine for lubing my .44 Magnum bullets). I'm sure this isn't about supporting a fellow forum member and his family, if it were I'm sure the product would be made available to the public for sale...

[Hamish]

What happened while I was away? Gosh, I guess I should be glad that the long time member here that had sent me a funky old mold to try out did'nt trash my name and my reputation when he did'nt hear from me for SIX MONTHS!

I am throughly ashamed of some of what has been posted in this thread, a couple of you need one between the landing lights to remind to remember your manners.

I have not seen the Opti products mentioned here, and will give it a try as a sprue lube first chance I get. A few years back a few of us in this area went to Opti-2 as it matters not what size, type, pre-mix ratio requirement, you take a pouch of it and add it to the prescribed amount of gas, and Bob's your uncle.

Great stuff, have let it sit in everything from weedeaters to boat motors over the winter and they start right up. Absolutely no smoke, no fouling, no carbon build up, which made me wonder about using it added to Mellow Yellow lube.

[30yrcaster]

Lee Liquid Alox is GIVEN away with Lee's push-through sizing die kits.

Last time I ordered a Lee Push Thru Die kit, I had to pay for it. You're paying for the LLA also. They also charge for it by itself. I don't think if you call them up they'll send it to you for free.

And finally, if you compare Lee Precision's modus operandi and list of inventory and services compared with the Bullshop's, you'll see a difference. A big difference.

I have no doubt that LLA is at the very bottom of Lee Precision's sales list in terms of numbers purchased by specific order (meaning customers who order the LLA specifically rather than having it included in a push-through sizing die kit).

So since Lee Precision is a large company and LLA may be at the bottom of their business and they include it with their sizing die kit, it's ok to find out the formula then sell one of their products but since Bullshop is a small company out of business it a sin? Remember Lee Precision is also a sponsor here and during hard times their employees could get layed off. If they wanted others to sell it, they'd post the formula on their website or include it in their description. I don't think anyone got flamed for asking or posting what LLA actually was.

On the other hand, so far as the Bullshop goes, while not expensive, I would venture that Bullplate is at or near the top of products Dan and Tina sell--and they do so to feed and take care of their family.

It's been mentioned countless times Bull Plate Lube was a very small part of their business.

If someone truely knows which synthetic oil BP is and are afraid to get flamed like I'm getting, pm me and I'll post it. This is stupid already. I remember the moderators made mention it's ok to discuss a substitute or whatever after Dan & Tina left their customers high and dry with no notice or anything.

Have a Happy New Year!!
Stay around and don't drink & drive.

[Ickisrulz]

I have enough Bull Plate to last me a very long time. If and when I run out, there seems to be many suitable products that will do the job if the Bull Shop isn't supplying it.

But just for argument's sake, how long does the Bull Shop have to be "out of business" or MIA (if they really are) for their product to become public domain and the secrets freely distributed by someone willing to do so?

[btroj]

I understand the desire to know where to get the stuff so we can have a lifetime supply. What bothers me is the idea that we have a right to know.

In my opinion Dan is in business until he says otherwise. He can get the word out if he wants to.

Since it appears he is shipping again I suggest you guys get off the computer and go send him some cash. You seem to need the line and I am sure he can use the cash. How much more of a win/win do you want?

[nanuk]

I have enough Bull Plate to last me a very long time. If and when I run out, there seems to be many suitable products that will do the job if the Bull Shop isn't supplying it.

But just for argument's sake, how long does the Bull Shop have to be "out of business" or MIA (if they really are) for their product to become public domain and the secrets freely distributed by someone willing to do so?

I have said before, I don't care what BP is. It works, Great, and I bought some. I also bought some SpeedGreen.

but, as we also have Lube subs for WLL, and others, I think it is a good thing to post a sub, like 357Max did.

We do NOT need to know What BP is.

We DO need to know what works in its stead, when BP is not available.
that is the same need that drove Recluse to make 45/45/10, or Felix to make his FWFL.... shall we all flame them for not supporting Lars at WLL now???

same goes for Lead.... We have RotoMetals.... should we ban anyone looking for a recipe to make Hardball?

the Bullshop makes a fine product, and I will continue to buy it, if I can for a mould lube.
and I see nothing wrong with knowing what an effective sub for making bullet lube or even sprue lube is.

are we not all grownups here?

[Recluse]

that is the same need that drove Recluse to make 45/45/10, or Felix to make his FWFL.... shall we all flame them for not supporting Lars at WLL now???

Actually, I'm one of Glenn's biggest cheerleaders!

I'm hoping this spring/early summer I can fly up his way and we can tinker around with his ideas and progress for a commercial "45/45/10" lube available for purchase.

I might be a tad bit biased, but I think it might be a nice addition to his already outstanding lube offerings.

Shoot, if he/we can come up with a good enough formula, *I'LL* buy the pre-mixed stuff from him!

[btroj]

I would love to see a ready to go 45/45/10.

[MGySgt]

I buy LARS lube mainly because it works and I can't make own that is any better cheaper!

Besides - LARS is a honest and a great vendor to deal with. When I run low on lube I will buy another 20 sticks from him!

Same with Bullshop - I trust Dan and Tina. When I need more - I will contact them. If they are not in business - I will go elsewhere.

Trust and liking your vendor goes a LONG way in where I spend my hard earned money!

Loyalty to your vendor and loyality to your clients means a lot to me. Both of them have loyality to thier clients in not ripping them off to make a buck.

Enough said!



Drew

[nanuk]

Recluse, you guys have it lucky to have a guy like WLL that can provide great lubes at prices that rival or better what you can do at home! (shipping is what kills it for us up here!)

From what I read, Glenn makes excellent, consistant products. if you can get the lube at such great prices, Why would you waste time doing it yourself?

That is what is so great about this site. OPTIONS!

for those who want to make their own, you Leaders have shown the way.
for those who want to buy theirs cause it is so cost effective, the suppliers have made that a great option.

it is the best of both worlds here.

the knowledge base here is unprecedented. And the willingness to share that knowledge is also unprecedented.

I am humbled and I thank you, and all the others.

to all who celebrate on the Roman Calendar, have a safe and Very Merry New Years Celebration.

to those to celebrate on the Julian Calender... well, you'll just have to wait a bit!

[MGySgt]

Nanuk - Happy New Year!

Drew

[GaryN]

I would also buy 45/45/10 from WLL just for the convenience. I made some and it goes a long ways.

[milprileb]

I wish I never started this thread. Can we just kill it ?

Dans stuff is for sale now so the issue of supply is solved.

8 pages of spin.... this thread needs to just die !