Fire protection for a safe?

[Three-Fifty-Seven]

keypad . . .

[pmer]

That safe looks really nice, is it a refurb from a bank? I had a couple ATM safes and was going to cut and stack to make them high enough for a long gun. But it was too big of a job.

We let our fire department burn our old farmhouse for training. Once the structure catches good the heat is unbelievable.. and the fire fighters all said they could'nt believe how dark it was in the house while it was burning.

I wonder if cement board (for tiling a Bathroom) would work on the inside?

[oneokie]

If you have good carpentry skills, consider covering the exterior of the safe with multiple layers of drywall/gypsum board. The 5/8" and thicker is fire rated. Many of the common fire rated gun safes have the interiors lined with this product. The tile backer board is also a good product to consider.

The front/door would be the most difficult part. That would probably be a good place to utilize the products you linked.

[Ickisrulz]

Although I never consulted an expert on the matter, I am just assuming I don't want a firearm that has been exposed to the high heat of a house fire and water damage. Therefore, I didn't get a fire liner for my safe...just good insurance.

Maybe some can comment whether I'm correct or not.

[winelover]

Don't really know how effective fire proofing is but it does make a safe heavier and that's a good thing cause criminals are lazy.
I have a vault door on order and asked the manufacturer if their one inch thick non-fire rated door was more effective, security-wise, than their half inch thick fire rated door (which weighs almost twice as much) and they gave the nod to the thinner fire door. Seems that the cement that is in the door adds additional security against drilling and you get a fire rating as a bonus.

Winelover

Shawn: Just saw you posted that yours is a Brown Safe as is the door I have on order.

[Artful]

you can route a water line and fire sprinkler head over the top of your safe pretty easily - Dry wall around for additional protection. - If you want something to shatter and release water look more at glass mason jars.

[man.electric]

I have read a few different articles about the damaging effects of dirty fire air on firearms in safes. Apparently the cooler inside temperature of the safe will suck in contaminant-filled air from the outside resulting in instant corrosion of everything in the safe. I know that there are products for that expand and seal under heat for safe guarding safes, but I have not researched them much. I just have a huge investment in insurance and hope and pray that I never need it.

[Bad Water Bill]

If you run some PVC water pipe over your safe, the pipe will rupture do to the heat and the municipal water pressure. Bingo instant sprinkler system over your safe.

I was given this info from a fire man with lots of experience

[firefly1957]

If you do not mind the water damage why not just add a sprinkler? they go off at a much lower temperature.
I have often thought that a safe with double walls containing liquid would be great not only for fires but with a level monitor if someone drilled it an alarm would go off.

[Catshooter]

I have a very good friend who is in the ATM industry. He gave me a safe with the same wall/door thicknesses you list.

He has opened two safes just like the one he gave me that were in grocery store fires. He says that there was a bit of smoke/carbon just on the very edges of some of the money but other than that there was no damage to the paper money.

I've seen a number of firearms that have gone through house fires. Generaly if their springs are still good then the rest of the gun is fine. The worst to clean up are those in plastic cases as the case can melt into the gun and it sticks very well.


Cat

[blackthorn]

Any water that is in a tightly sealed container, i.e. a jar or a tin that boils, will cause the container to explode. It will NOT "boil away".

[Franklin7x57]

what about fire bricks, the white bricks that masons use in the firebox?

[Blacksmith]

Just build a fire resistant enclosure around your safe. You can find specifications on the internet of the fire rating of various designs using conventional construction materials and methods. Descide how long it will take the fire department to get there and put out the fire and build accordingly. If you need more time build one inside another.

Blacksmith

[-06]

My safe is on concrete between brick walls. We are going to sheetrock(gypsum wallboard) the ceilings all over our home for an extra bit of protection. If yours is on wood floor then I would place a sheet of gypsum down first then metal and another sheet of sheetrock-and another metal. That will protect the floor from heat a long time. Would put double walls of rock all around and on top. Casing it in sheet metal or plywood will hold it in place and make the door more easy to attach. Worked as a VFD for 24 yrs and the floors hardly ever burn. Heat rises so putting those plastic water jugs on top is a good idea. They probably will not burst but melt as the water evaporates-as scouts we boiled eggs in paper cups on coals. There used to be jugs that had thermo things in the neck that you hung from ceilings. When the temps rose the thermo things melted and released the flame retardants. Have not seen them in 40 yrs but seemed a great idea to me as a kid. A bit of sheetrock will greatly slow the spread of fire and act as a shield to your valuables.

[crazy mark]

You can buy fire/smoke rated door gaskets. We have to put them on fire doors at the Hospital. They expand during the heat of a fire.

[colt 357]

Although I never consulted an expert on the matter, I am just assuming I don't want a firearm that has been exposed to the high heat of a house fire and water damage. Therefore, I didn't get a fire liner for my safe...just good insurance.

Maybe some can comment whether I'm correct or not.

I think I am on board with you on this one. If it is a totaly involved working fire were the house is consumed by the fire I think that the guns in the safe would be harmed. But if it is a small house fire with a good insulated safe and the fire department was able to do a fast knock down of the fire I think the guns would be fine.
Insurance would be the best bet.

[Westwindmike]

I used to keep a Halon fire extinguisher in my gun safe. The theory was that if it got hot enough inside the safe, the pop off valve on the extinguisher would fail and flood the interior with cold Halon.

Would it work? I don't know.

[Jim]

I've been thinking about this thread. The thing that keeps coming back to me is, how long will it be, once a fire breaks out, before the temperature is back down below that which causes damage. No matter what you do, if the plan does not protect the guns from the heat for the duration, the plan is no good.

I am certainly in favor of a system that would protect firearms from fire damage. However, the system has to be designed and built to withstand the heat for, I would think, at least two hours.

When commercial buildings are constructed and firewalls are required, the standard established by engineers is that two 5/8" sheets of sheetrock will hold a fire back for one hour.

My suggestion would be to construct a frame made of salt treated lumber which is fire resistant in and of itself. I would then surround it with two sheets of 5/8" sheetrock. If finances allow, I might even panel the inside of the enclosure with the same and fill the void between the studs with rock wool batts.

If the enclosure is built to the right size, this would also provide a place to store other valuables that need to be protected from fire.

The ideas that have been mentioned are not bad. I just wonder how long the protection they afford would last in the event of a serious and fully engulfing fire.

[cajun shooter]

I have a Liberty safe and some of the sealing material on the metal around the door was missing as it was a floor model and I purchased it for $500 less than retail. The safe sold for $1800. I contacted Liberty and they told me that the material was a special fireproofing that after reaching a certain heat would swell and seal off the door. You may try to buy some of this material.

[LUCKYDAWG13]

i had a house fire 4 years ago a bad one lost the house the cops took my guns
to hold on to i picked them up in like 3 days water did more damage to them
then the fire RUST that quick no water on in or by my safe