25 stevens rimfire

[Chev. William]

I went by Hollywood Engineering and found the owner and his wife there, along with a few Volunteers helping with clearing the collapsed roof and similar fire debris. The owner said he needed a few days in hospital then it took about two weeks to get a permit before they could get permission to enter and start clean up. He shows the evidence of burns on the left Forearm and Right hand (bandaged when I spoke to him). He is somewhat pessimistic as to the future fo the business as he is 80, and still does not know the full effects of the fire on his machinery and tooling. He did mention that the 'exploding ammunition' reported by the LAFD was 20mm rounds left over from work he did for the Government building reloading dies and presses to handle them for special experiments.

They are still not allowed to stay in their home on the property, I do not know when that might change.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[Suo Gan]

The 25 Stevens is one of those rounds that shouldn't have died. All these yahoos bring out 17's and 5mms at a gazillion feet per second and offering no real use. Now the 25, there's a small game cartridge! The nest closest thing is a down loaded 25/20 or a 22WRF and neither one is quite right. Too bad.

Isnt this how it has been for them all? Excluding the 30-30 of course...sigh

[Chev. William]

Well, yes, it seems most cartridges were designed to sell firearms, not vise-versa. that indicates when sales lower, a new cartridge is introduced, along with a Firearm to use it.
J. Stevens did some innovation in inexpensive and relatively easily produced firearms and some very good cartridges that 'grated' on the other makers such as Colt, S&W, Winchester, etc.
Winchester would not use someone else's name on his rifles, so the 25 Stevens (Long) became the 25-10 and other maker' cartridges got new, Winchester generated alternate names. Colt also had a 'slight redesign and Rename' habit. As far as I know, all the manufacturers did the same.

Now i am working on .25 Stevens Long substitutes both in RF and CF versions, and with variations on the rim design to see what will work an be practical to build.

There is another similar project by many to resurrect the .32 Long RF / .32 Long Colt CF cartridge for use in rifles and pistols produced for them at the time. My own 1894 actions were also used with .32 Long RF cartridges and some have successfully converted them to CF and use the .32 Long Colt cartridge, but this is limited due to scarce Brass at the moment.

Please wish all of the experimenters Good Luck in their endeavors.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[Chev. William]

I went by Hollywood Engineering today and talked to the owner again. He is started on the Clean Up and says the City is saying they have two more weeks to compete the clean Up or they will start getting fined.
He did say that it seems he lost most of his existing inventory of parts and components and is still not down to the machine tools.
I am hoping that he finds the machine tools discolored (from smoke) but not otherwise damaged. I would like to see him recover his operation again and continue making Reloading Equipment as an income stream.
The Bandages are off and the burns seem to be heeling without complications.
Best regards,
Chev. William

[Bret4207]

My memory is dim on this, but IIRC there were people converting 25RF to CF and using reformed Hornet brass in custom dies of the same dimensions as 25RF. This was all a good 10 years back and I haven't seen anything much on it since.

[Chev. William]

My memory is dim on this, but IIRC there were people converting 25RF to CF and using reformed Hornet brass in custom dies of the same dimensions as 25RF. This was all a good 10 years back and I haven't seen anything much on it since.

Thank You for the memory that tells me I am possibly on the right track in reforming .22 Hornet cases to fit the .25 Stevens chamber. I am waiting for my Gunsmith to complete the strength upgrade and inspection of my two 1894 series Stevens Favorite actions. I have also asked to have tow of the four Breech Blocks converted to CF from the original RF configuration. I now have about 300 Hornet cases to reform while I am waiting for the actions. I also have a barrel in .32 Long that I am preparing to use with reformed brass in .32 Long Colt.

On another Note:
Saturday afternoon, I was with the owner at Hollywood Engineering and helped him to remove about a four by four foot area of fire marked Die inventory to be cleaned in my Vibratory Tumbler. There is an additional four by four foot area in this shelf section that holds more die inventory and the stock of expander tips and seating tips to match, this is only one of several shelving sections, about 30 feet long, holding more dies and components, tooling and tool bits, reamers, fixtures, etc. on this one wall. The rear shop has been stripped to the 'four walls' and is now being used to temporarily hold the machines he feels have the best possibility of refurbishment. the front shop has only been cleared about 40 percent of the machines that were there before the fire. most of the tooling and fixtures I observes have water damage after the fire heat removed the lubricants coatings. Drawers and trays held water and the time immersed rusted them so that they will need thorough de-rusting and cleaning to decide if they are usable again. The machines in the front shop show smoke staining and some drying of lubricants but so far no water damage nor fire damage. I guess the roof collapse and the Fire Department pouring on the Water from Snorkels saved them from heat damage.
The main Power panel is definitely in need of stripping and replacement as the power wiring is all charred or insulation missing. The main power meter is a rusted blob of corrosion. I did not open the Circuit breaker panels but suspect the Breakers are heat damaged, as almost all use molded plastics for the body.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[Marvin S]

If you want ill check with a guy I know who has or had several boxes of 25 long RF. I don't really know how to get in touch with him other than next gun show. PM me if interested.

[Chev. William]

Marvin S,
Yes, I think I would be interested in one or two boxes for reference use, not for active shooting as they would probably be in the 'collectibles' range of prices rather than the 'shooting ammo' range from what I have seen on the internet. Also I believe most of the pre-WW2 ammo was made with primers and and powders that are considered 'corrosive' by modern standards. I would rather not subject the actions and barrels I have to the effects of corrosive ammunition as I have taken note of the existing damage and do not want to increase it. The most I am planning to do is shoot some Black Powder rounds through them then thoroughly clean them repeatedly over a couple of week s to assure all corrosive combustion products are removed before finally allowing them to be stored before the next shooting range run.

My general intent is to use none mercuric, none corrosive primers and low corrosion smokeless powders in my personal hand loads after the initial testing and documentation of performance of 'original loading equivalents' for my personal references.

I have been messaged by a gentleman that is taking the new Winchester .17 Rimfire Magnum rounds apart and reforming the cases to use as .25 Stevens RF rounds. I hope he will eventually share his experiences with the Forum in general as it sounds like and interesting process.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[rattletrap1970]

I have a question because I do see these old rimfire rifles every now and then. If you had the machining and/or designing ability (which I do), wouldn't one be able to chamber one of these guns for some reduces load rimed centerfire cartridge?

[soli]

I have 25 short and long if any one still needs them.

[Chev. William]

I have a question because I do see these old rimfire rifles every now and then. If you had the machining and/or designing ability (which I do), wouldn't one be able to chamber one of these guns for some reduces load rimed centerfire cartridge?

Yes, there is a possibility of modifing the firearms (both handguns and Rifles) but most people would like to have them keep their collector value and still be able to occasionally shoot them. In my case, I have two Stevens Favorite actions of the 1894 Series that I am having a gunsmith go through and upgrade the pins and Screws that are vital to the action and also having two spare breech Blocks reworked from RF to CF capability. I am reforming .22 Hornet brass to fit the .25 Stevens chamber in one and reforming .32 S&W Long Brass to fit the .32 Long RF/.32 Long Colt chamber in the other. in both these cases the original condition did not argue for 'Collector' Values so they will be 'shooters' in the new configurations but I will retain the RF Breech Blocks and some spare extractors to allow returning them to original configuration if deemed advantageous at some time in the future.

As a side benefit, the .25 Stevens chamber is of suitable dimensions to be able to use commercial .25ACP ammo like the original RF used the .25 Stevens Short, but the .25ACP will offer performance similar to the .25 Stevens Long Rf cartridge.

As to changing the chamber to a 'modern' cartridge, in my case the actions do not lend themselves to much stronger modern cartridges, they are not the strongest of designs nor the strongest of materials, but then again, they are strong enough for their original cartridges.
An example: the .32 Long chamber could, and has been, enlarged to fit the .32 S&W Long cartridge but that would be straining the action and a full power commercial load might cause stratigraphic damage or failure. Not a good thing to contemplate. So I will leave it at .32 Long Colt and handload to feed it rounds that are comparable to the .32 Long RF.

I hope this answers your questions to your satisfaction.
Best Regards,
Chev. William

[Chev. William]

I have 25 short and long if any one still needs them.

Are they single rounds or boxes of rounds?
What manufacturer(s) and what loading(s)?

Best regards,
Chev. William

[rondog]

I have a single .25 Stevens Short round that I found in a parking lot many, many years ago. When I found it, it was in brand new condition but I had no idea what it was. Mystified me because it was such a big rimfire, never seen one. Took me 30+ years to find out! Still have it too.

[rattletrap1970]

Oh I don't mean making a powerhouse out of them (which you can't), I just don't keep up with all th old cowboy calibers. I have had a chance at getting one of these old rifles every now and again and would have liked to rechamber to something just to have fun with the gun.

[Chev. William]

Oh I don't mean making a powerhouse out of them (which you can't), I just don't keep up with all th old cowboy calibers. I have had a chance at getting one of these old rifles every now and again and would have liked to rechamber to something just to have fun with the gun.

There are numerous auctions on Gun Broker for Stevens Favorites and a few for Stevens Model 44 or 44-1/2 that you can look through. most are more of a collector type but there are some that are 'shooter' rather than collector types. A pitted bore in a 'shooter' may not affect its accuracy much but there does need to be some rifling left to spin the bullet. Stevens Favorites are and were offered in 22LR, 25 Stevens, or 32 Long RF. The 22LR and 32 Long are relatively easy as 22LR is still made and the 32 Long shares dimensions with the 32 Long Colt original outside lubed rounds. 25 Stevens is doable by reforming .22 Hornet cases and trimming them to the length of the 25 Stevens case. In the two larger calibers you would need to convert from RF to CF so they would take some machine or gunsmith work.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[rondog]

An old friend of mine back in OK has an 1892 Marlin levergun chambered in .32 Short RF. His brother bought an old Chevy from a farmer when we were teenagers, and the rifle was in the trunk under some gunny sacks.

The firing pin is easily removed from the bolt, so we had a CF pin made by a gunsmith. Shot it a few times, it was surprisingly accurate, I'm sure he hasn't fired it since. We also refinished the stock <shame>, but hey, we were 15 then.

[Chev. William]

An old friend of mine back in OK has an 1892 Marlin levergun chambered in .32 Short RF. His brother bought an old Chevy from a farmer when we were teenagers, and the rifle was in the trunk under some gunny sacks.

The firing pin is easily removed from the bolt, so we had a CF pin made by a gunsmith. Shot it a few times, it was surprisingly accurate, I'm sure he hasn't fired it since. We also refinished the stock <shame>, but hey, we were 15 then.

There are many posts of people using the 1892 Marlin, with it's convertible nature, to good advantage either hunting or shooting targets with the CF cartridges nowadays. I suggest you see if it is still available for use.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[NoZombies]

I don't know if it's been mentioned, but the new winchester 17 'super mag' looks like it might be based on a case that is similar to the original .25 stevens. Case dimension just ahead of the rim is .267, so I imagine up cut off at the shoulder (carefully) with the proper dies, you could probably replace the powder and seat a .252 bullet and make the old Steven's .25's sing again.

[Chev. William]

A man is doing just that, getting cases that are about .98" long and then loading either 50gr or 35gr jacketed bullets for trials. I hope He will choose to share his process and results with the group at some point.

Best regards,
Chev. William

[KCSO]

If you reline a 25 to 22 you have to either cut a new friing pin a little off center or recess the extractor where the 25 pin hits. I just did one yesterday.