I am using a RCBS Lubamatic II to lube and size .321 bullets. This is my first attempt. It seems to be set up correctly and working more or less properly. I have it adjusted so that the lube only goes to the last lube band.
The problem is that the bullets come out with one side all mashed up. It goes up past the lube groove and onto the nose of the bullet for a bit. Any idea what is going wrong?
Can you post a pic of a sized boolit. Can't quite see this in my imagination.
Yeah, I'll try.
Ok, so the picture with 4 bullets has the two in the middle showing the mashed side and the two on the outside showing the opposite side. The picture with 6 bullets is the same thing but with two unsized bullets included on the outside for reference.
The contrast is particularly apparent with the sized bullet on the far right. The top band on that side is fairly unmashed, but the other side is mashed. The lube bands down both sides are the same. On the mashed side the bands are wider and the lube is narrower.
Sorry, I don't have a macro lens yet for closeups, and that's why I got this camera. hahaha
I just went and remeasured my bullets. I had thought that my two cavity mold threw bullets of two different diameters, but it seems each bullet is .322 and if you rotate it a quarter turn it is .323. So they are slightly oblong. Don't know if that matters. It still seems odd that only one side is messed up, you'd think it would be both sides.
Have you looked at the corresponding mold half? Is it in "ok" shape?
I'll double check. It's new, so I wouldn't expect any problems, though I did get some lead in the well where the alignment pin goes that was a bear to get out. Maybe it still has some, but I don't think so.
Maybe it's the sizer die. Could I just get a .323 sizer die and make this problem go away?
Watch out for how much pressure you apply to the lube, that can make it leak even more where the bullet is slightly smaller and not getting sized as much.
When I size bullets for match shooting I go in and out of the die several times rotating it at the top of the stroke, to make sure the lube is even all the way around the bullet.
a thought that may or may not apply is during casting ( keep in mind i dont know if you water drop or not ) if you're not letting the sprue fully harden there's a chance that when dropping the casting can slump somewhat ( depending upon how hard it is when it hits ) this can cause oblong castings and assorted other problems ( i've even managed to make semi hollow ingots by emptying too soon , boy was that a mess [doh] )
Je suis Charlie
if it was easy would it be as worthy ? or as long of lasting impression ? the hardest of lessons are the best of teachers [shrugz]" To sit in judgment of those things which you perceive to be wrong or imperfect is to be one more person who is part of judgment, evil or imperfection."
Wayne Dyer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLzFhOslZPM
I checked and the bullets are wider along the seam. There is no gap between the mold halves. I think the mold is fine, and the bullets look fine to me, it's just that the sizer mashes or cuts that one side.
If going to a larger sizer die will fix this problem I will do it as I most likely will have to switch to that for other reasons.
Could be that the nose punch isn't lining up with the centerline of the sizer. Try putting a small dab of lube on the top of the ring of your nose punch. Put it back in the ram without tightening the set screw. The lube will hold it in place against the bottom of the ram. Now the nose punch can self align with the boolit as you push it into the die.
Some times it's the pot,
Some times it's the pan,
It might even be the skillet,
But, most of the time, it's the cook.
I tried that and even guided it by hand on a couple, and all still had the same result.Originally Posted by C.F.Plinker
Thanks for the suggestion.
Just a thought: What are you using to measure the boolits' diameter? If a caliper, it's lack of accuracy when compared to a micrometer, could mean that your boolits are more out-of-round than you realize, and the sizing die is just making them round.
Completely loosen the setscrew holding the top punch in place. Remover the top
punch and put a dab of sticky lube like NRA 50-50 on the shank and push back in.
Now try using it. The top punch can float to center over the die after a few sizings
and this may be your problem. OR - it just could be straightening out an out of
round boolit, and not be a problem.
Bill
If it was easy, anybody could do it.
He tried that. From what I can tell his bullets are out of round far enoung that when he sizes the "fat" sides are collapsing the grooves. I think the mold may need to be cut deeper, perpendicular to the seam and then a bigger sizer, if it fits gis guns barrel.
sent via hammer and chisel
need oversized powder funnels , PTX's or expanders ? just ask, I make 'em for most brands plus my own styles.
I'm using a caliper, it's a Starrett, and while it may or may not be accurate, it is precise. I get the same results every time and have measured numerous times now so I am certain the difference between the two axes is .001" or slightly less.
I will double check this, but earlier I looked close at the bullets and they seemed wider along the joint and the part that gets flattened upon sizing is random as far as location on the bullet goes, but seems to be dependent upon the location within the sizing die. So it is in the same location relative to the die that gets flattened.
I took the die out and hammered one in and then out again and it didn't get flattened. I repeated it once and it seemed to be flattened. I should probably try this a few more times.
I also tried loosening the die locking nut various amounts and even removing it but it seemed to still happen to the same degree. Upon loosening it, it seemed to make one bullet that wasn't as bad as before, but if I did a second it was right back to as bad again.
Gonna have to start casting again at this rate. hahaha
It is flattening more than half the bullet, probably about two thirds, and not in the same place on the bullet, so I don't think it is really bullet shape that is the causative factor.
I am using 30-1 which has a bhn of about 9 or so. I ran some Laser Cast .322 bullets with a bhn of 24 through, which were a lot tougher to get through, but came out unscathed. Maybe it is partly because my lead is so soft.
Also, I ran several through without gas checks and that certainly appears to be part of the problem. They showed slight deformation, but to a much lesser extent. So, the gas check seems to throw off the centering and exacerbate the problem more than it would be. Even without the gas checks I don't think I'd be happy with those bullets, the one side is still obviously different than the other, but the crimp groove appeared usable on most.
I think I'll just get a .323" die and see what happens. Of course then I'll have another problem. The force to seat the bullet with my Lee Classic hammer loader deforms the nose pretty badly when seating these bullets unsized. Would getting a press alleviate that problem? I'm think that the constant pressure as opposed to smacking it would reduce if not eliminate that problem.
Any press will help plus getting a sizer nose cone that fit the bullet good will help from damaging them.
sent via hammer and chisel
need oversized powder funnels , PTX's or expanders ? just ask, I make 'em for most brands plus my own styles.
I think it is the alignment, or lack there of, maybe wrong top punch...
Posting Permissions
| BP | Bronze Point | IMR | Improved Military Rifle | PTD | Pointed |
| BR | Bench Rest | M | Magnum | RN | Round Nose |
| BT | Boat Tail | PL | Power-Lokt | SP | Soft Point |
| C | Compressed Charge | PR | Primer | SPCL | Soft Point "Core-Lokt" |
| HP | Hollow Point | PSPCL | Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" | C.O.L. | Cartridge Overall Length |
| PSP | Pointed Soft Point | Spz | Spitzer Point | SBT | Spitzer Boat Tail |
| LRN | Lead Round Nose | LWC | Lead Wad Cutter | LSWC | Lead Semi Wad Cutter |
| GC | Gas Check |
Reply With Quote
