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Thread: Beginner

  1. #1
    Boolit Buddy fn1889m's Avatar
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    Beginner

    I have traded a M14 clone for a like-new Browning BPCR, Soule sight, etc. I am completely new with this black powder cartridge thing. And I don’t really have anyone to help me get started. I thought it might be easier to start with smokeless powder loads that were the equivalent of black powder loads. I don’t even know how to clean a rifle after shooting black powder.

    Is this a reasonable way to get started shooting the browning? Second, if it is, could anyone recommend a website with the equivalent smokeless loads. I have a mishmash of cases and bullets. My local range is only 200 yards distance. I just really don’t know where to start by myself.

    I do reload for smokeless powder cases, including 45 colt.
    Last edited by fn1889m; 12-16-2018 at 02:30 PM.

  2. #2
    Boolit Master

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    what caliber? there are a lot of BPCR shooters here who can guide you. I think a smokeless load is a good place to start. You will want to get into casting as well. It will save you lots of money in the long run.

  3. #3
    Boolit Master
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    You’re at the right spot for info. I have an in line traditions .50 that I’ve harvested a few bucks with but haven’t used it in years. I’m sure your going to get plenty advice here in a few mins. There’s a lot of experience here. I do know after you shoot, if your not going to shoot for a while you need to clean it with warm water and oil it good and look at it more often than with smokeless.

  4. #4
    Boolit Buddy fn1889m's Avatar
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    Beginner

    Quote Originally Posted by ascast View Post
    what caliber? there are a lot of BPCR shooters here who can guide you. I think a smokeless load is a good place to start. You will want to get into casting as well. It will save you lots of money in the long run.
    It’s a Browning 45-70 BPCR 1885. The long, heavy barrel, Vernier sight, etc. It’s sort of intimidating.

    I purchased 45-70 dies and have some reloading supplies for it. But I am overwhelmed with everything.


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  5. #5
    Boolit Master
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    You can use the search for that (top right corner ) ,it"s a good place to start/Ed

  6. #6
    Boolit Buddy
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    Where abouts do you reside? Cleaning your rifle after shooting black powder is pretty easy. Just wet patches until the come out clean. Then a few dry patches and finally and oily patch. The brass will be super easy if you have a rotary tumbler. Your rifle will shoot very well with black powder loads.


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  7. #7
    Boolit Buddy fn1889m's Avatar
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    This reminds me of how I felt when I fired my first reloads. I was expecting the gun to blow up. It honestly looks overwhelming at the moment, especially when you’re sorting it out yourself based on books and the Internet. I live in the PNW. I am within a stones throw of retirement, and was hoping to shoot more when I had more free time. Are black powder substitute like Pyrodex worth trying, or should I just go straight to black powder? But for now, I would just like to shoot the rifle, and thought I could try smokeless at bp equivalent loads.


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  8. #8
    Boolit Master
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    Getting started with black powder is pretty easy, although getting the best accuracy can take some effort. To some degree in load development, but mostly in trigger time.

    If you want to first try some smokeless loads, check out the Hodgdon's online data. Look for .45-70 Trapdoor level loads. Use a heavy bullet and keep the velocity between 1100 and 1300 fps. My Browning BPCR shot quite well with a 450gr Bullet loaded with a light load of H-4198. It did not shoot as well as with black powder.

    Do you cast your own bullets? If so this will make the black powder shooting experience much more enjoyable.

    Chris.

  9. #9
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Welcome to the addiction.fn1889m. I too will ask where you are located? Black powder isn't a mystical dark arts to load.
    Cleaning isn't a big chore at the range windex with vinegar is a good convenient cleaning solution. Works good to remove fouling is handy in the spray bottle. At home ballistol water mixed 20-1 will do very good. If no leading warm water and dish soap. IF you have leading follow with a solvent like hopes, or shooters choice. After clean a lightly oiled patch thru the bore and wipe down.
    Obtain 100-200 cases all the same ( Starline is good in 45-70). trim and chamfer same as smoleless loads. Prime. Now heres where the differences start. You want to start with a charge of Black Powder (BP) that fills the case to the base of bullet and a .060 wad. Basically no compression no airspace, ( May actually be around 60 grns of powder) this is your starting point. Load a test series and shoot them. Work up from here changing only the powder charge by 2 grns. This changes charge and compression of powder ( different powders like different compression) when you find the best 2 loads test at mid point between them. These rifles have little camming force so load just off the rifling. Use a die to compress powder seat wads. Use a bullet lube meant for bP.

  10. #10
    Boolit Buddy dave roelle's Avatar
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    Have a look at Texasmacs websight---------------he is more than expert on the Browning BPCR

    Wayne also wrote a book on the subject and will certainly help you in any way he can with the best current bullet designs and loading details

    Start with black powder--------its safer, easier to clean up and only requires a few basic quidelines-------

    Dave

  11. #11
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    aa5744 is about the best smokeless for 19th century cartridges and is used a lot in matches. it's not case position sensitive, just add in a greased bullet.

    but black powder is more fun. 1-1/2f or 2f black powder lightly compressed, a milk carton or veggie wad, a greased bullet and yer good to go for starters. between shot fouling control is either a piece of 7/16" neoprene tubing as a blow tube or just wipe with a damp patch.

    above all, have phun!

  12. #12
    Boolit Man
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    I see your in the PNW. Does your 200 yard range happen to be custer? If it is we`ll have to do some messages and meet at the range to do some BPCR shooting.

  13. #13
    Boolit Buddy fn1889m's Avatar
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    Beginner

    I end up shooting at Greene’s Gun Shop on Whidbey Island 90% of the time. They do a lot with muzzleloaders, and the rifle range is now restricted to BP (and a few other long time patrons). (The pistol range is open to the paying public.) But I could make it to Custer, which is under an hour on I-5. Is there a regular BP shooting time or BP range day there?

    Again, I know nothing about BP.
    Last edited by fn1889m; 12-17-2018 at 12:35 AM.

  14. #14
    Boolit Master Randy C's Avatar
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    Accurate 5744 is what everybody uses at our shooting meets, We shoot in Minot ND. I shoot black powder but I have used 5744 and it works very well, I'm having a new barrel put on my rifle. I really enjoy shooting back powder it is a lot more work. I have to run a patch through to clean the barrel after every shot. The guys shooting smokeless don't have to go through that and it's quicker and easier to clean your rifle with smokeless. Black powder it Is hard on your rifle it eats at it if you don't get it clean. I'm hooked on Black powder It kicks less Its more like a push with BP. I shoot a after market 4570 Sharps

  15. #15
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    i like loading and shooting black powder. it's easy to load for cartridges and is best for side lock muzzleloaders (and mandatory for their flintlock ignitions). all the gun corrosion and rusting issues with bp usage can be traced back to 1) not maintaining guns (and cartridge cases) immediately after firing, and/or 2) not cleaning guns properly. fouling control can be handled in a variety of subjective ways, pick what works best for ya. lack of good bp cartridge load knowledge is what matters most from the get-go. there is a gamut of bp cartridge loading procedures that will work quite well, from the super simple as was prolly done back in the day, to some of the more tool and process intensive methods that some of us do these dayze for both greasers and PPBs. lotta good ways to skin the bp cartridge loading cat. it's all good if we're havin' fun.

  16. #16
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by fn1889m View Post
    I have traded a M14 clone for a like-new Browning BPCR, Soule sight, etc. I am completely new with this black powder cartridge thing. And I don’t really have anyone to help me get started. I thought it might be easier to start with smokeless powder loads that were the equivalent of black powder loads. I don’t even know how to clean a rifle after shooting black powder.

    Is this a reasonable way to get started shooting the browning? Second, if it is, could anyone recommend a website with the equivalent smokeless loads. I have a mishmash of cases and bullets. My local range is only 200 yards distance. I just really don’t know where to start by myself.

    I do reload for smokeless powder cases, including 45 colt.
    I reckon you did a good deal (think the feller that took your M14 was not the smartest dude you ever met)

    Its a Blackpowder Cartridge Rifle - why not start out right ! - taint hard at all!!!

    Cleaning a blackpowder single shot is ridiculously easy - pour some cold water down the thing and push a cloth patch through - repeat two or three times - then dry it out and oil - takes less than five minutes at my place -- the major difference is you CAN put a smokeless gun away dirty and come to little harm - but you needs to clean the blackpowder rifle after every shoot.

    Loading blackpowder is equally simple at the start - fill the case to level the base of the boolit - put a card wad over the powder - put the boolit in - shoot it -

    a couple of caveats
    1)use a proper blackpowder lube (buy or make your own - plenty recipes on this forum)
    2)pick a boolit or mold that carries plenty of lube - big lube grooves - keeps you from fouling out.

    Reading stuff hereabouts gives the impression that shooting blackpowder is some kind of cross between voodoo and rocket science - but most of these blokes are long range specialists at the top of the game - MOA blackpowder takes the same degree of fine tuning that gets success with modern benchrest but 2MOA blackpowder is within the easy reach of most of us with a decent firearm - and you have got yourself a more than decent firearm I think.
    Blackpowder is easy ------really!

  17. #17
    Boolit Grand Master

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    A good read on this is Loading and Shooting the Paper Patched bullet A Beginners Guide. By Mr.Wright. While it deals with the PP bullet the techniques are the same for grease grooved also. A lot of good information in it.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check