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Thread: wads in 45-70

  1. #1
    Boolit Man
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    wads in 45-70

    why do you need a .060 wad in your load? would a. 030 work just as well? Where do you find wad material that is .060 thick? could ou use two .030 wads and have it work? just questions before I start experimenting. thanks a lot for any info. John

  2. #2
    Boolit Buddy
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    If you search a bit here and on some of the other black powder sites you will find a bunch of info on wads. I started last summer and the first person that helped me out (he has a wall covered with plaques) said he used a hard wad from milk cartons and then a newspaper wad on top so the wax from the hard wad does not stick to the base of the bullet. I tried several other types including veggi wads and even no wads at all and the most accurate for me turned out to be the original suggestion. I would suggest trying various materials and thicknesses and see what works for YOUR gun as they all seem to want something different. One thing to note is, if you end up compressing the powder then the wad will take the force of the ram so it should be somewhat stiff and not so sticky as to stick to the ram.

    I bought a 45 caliber sized cutter and make my own so someday, probably around 2018 they wads will pay for the cost of the cutter! Unless the world ends today that is????!!!

  3. #3
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    montana_charlie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wild thing View Post
    why do you need a .060 wad in your load? would a. 030 work just as well? Where do you find wad material that is .060 thick? could ou use two .030 wads and have it work?
    Some people use a combination of wads to adjust their load for best performance.
    A guy might use a .030 veggie wad, an eighth-inch cork wad, and a wax paper wad separating the base of the bullet from a 0.2 inch lube cookie.

    Admittedly, this would be an uncommonly complicated wad column. But it is a valid illustration.

    Some believe a .060 wad protects the bullet base better than a .030 wad. I suppose two .030 wads would do the same. I only use one, so I don't know.

    As for your 'where can I find' question ...
    There are several places that are 'favorite' suppliers of BPCR-type items. But, this answer ( http://www.buffaloarms.com/ ) will get you almost anything you can imagine.

    CM
    Retired...TWICE. Now just raisin' cows and livin' on borrowed time.

  4. #4
    Boolit Master Don McDowell's Avatar
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    You just need to experiment and see what you and you're rifle like best. Sometimes I load the .030 and sometimes the .060 and I know one fella that oft uses wax paper.
    These are my favorite wads http://www.sageoutfitters.com/catalo...24/7463753.htm followed by John Walters offerings.
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  5. #5
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    If I feel the need to use them I use nothing more than wads cut from Styrofoam picnic plates. They are about weightless and impervious to any lube bleeding.
    I just adjust the number of wads to fit the load.
    Rather than cutting wads I most often just fill any space in the case with packing popcorn and call it good. Has the same effect with less time investment.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master

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    bull has good plan if you get the byos they dont melt would smell like biscutts cooked with gunpowder . What could be better?

  7. #7
    Boolit Master

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    Wild Thing, if you don't have one already, then get a good wad cutter. When you have a good wad cutter, everything that you see that is flat looks like it might make good wads. From newspaper and Milk cartons through to whatever you could imagine. I got a peice of LDPE from Buffalo Arms that is 0.060 thick.

    With the idea of using two 0.030 thick LDPE wads, they will be the same thickness, but they won't expand in the bore the same way as 0.060 wads. I have read that as the powder gases push on the base of the boolit, LDPE wads will expand into the rifling. The 0.060 wad will expand more than two 0.030 wads.

    I wish that I could remember where I read that. Could be one of the MATTHEWS books, or maybe the SPG book.
    WHEN IN DOUBT, USE MORE CLOUT!

  8. #8
    Boolit Man
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    Thanks a lot for your time and answers . I have a 38-55 that shoots well with a .030 wad and was wondering why yhat dosen't work in the 45. Just have to load and find out. Thanks again wildthing

  9. #9
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    for an initial investment of about 20 bucks for a punch, a couple bucks for a plastic cutting board, and a small hammer you can have all the wads you'll ever need. and it'll give ya somethin' to do on cold or rainy days when ya can't get out and shoot. got my punch from buffalo arms. already had a hammer and used a piece of plastic sheet from an auto parts shipping crate. the punch and the plastic have held up for over 15,000 wads so far. the 1/2 & 1/2 cartons i use are about 28thousandths for half gallons and about 22 for the quarts. if ya ever need any for a 50cal let me know and i'll send ya a thou. luck and have a good'en, bubba.

  10. #10
    here we go--hits 8" plate at 200 yds every time with Uberti rebarreled 45-70. 0.060 X 0.453 Walter wad HDPE from Buffalo Arms, 60 grs Goex 2F, 500gr Lee 459-500 postel type bullet. Alloy 50/50 WW/pure lead w/2% tin added. Federal 215 primers.Wads seal very well no residue noticed in bbl. No need to change except will try Swiss powder when I run out of Goex. Roadrunner (new member) Yay!

  11. #11
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldracer View Post
    If you search a bit here and on some of the other black powder sites you will find a bunch of info on wads. I started last summer and the first person that helped me out (he has a wall covered with plaques) said he used a hard wad from milk cartons and then a newspaper wad on top so the wax from the hard wad does not stick to the base of the bullet. I tried several other types including veggi wads and even no wads at all and the most accurate for me turned out to be the original suggestion. I would suggest trying various materials and thicknesses and see what works for YOUR gun as they all seem to want something different. One thing to note is, if you end up compressing the powder then the wad will take the force of the ram so it should be somewhat stiff and not so sticky as to stick to the ram.

    I bought a 45 caliber sized cutter and make my own so someday, probably around 2018 they wads will pay for the cost of the cutter! Unless the world ends today that is????!!!
    I use a juice carton wad - wash it out properly before you cut them - those things are pretty slick - I cant figure how they would stick to the base of a boolit in flight? but maybe they do? -- I find the wads six to eight feet in front of my firing position most times - woulda thought newspaper more likely to stick to the boolit base than the juice box ??? They dont stick to the compression ram unless it gets boolit lube in there somehow. I put my lube on the boolit not in the case - lube cookies work but they a patch up job to compensate for a boolit that dont have big enough (or enough number) lube grooves - There a huge array of well designed boolits out there to choose from - IMHO most of em do not haul enough lube for trouble free blackpowder shooting - but then I read the rules for the Quigley and the Forsyth 1000yard and it says any safe powder charge - black - sub - duplex - smokeyless - whatever ya like (gascheck boolits even) - so that explains THAT.
    Last edited by indian joe; 06-06-2018 at 01:54 AM.

  12. #12
    Boolit Master

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    bpcr wads - another subjective matter that requires personal testing that might take up a lotta time and trials. it could all start with a simple .025" milk/juice carton over powder wad, compress, insert bullet, no more and no less. i always added a pair of .002" newsprint wads under the greaser bullet, to insure the main wad wouldn't go down range with the greaser. it could also end up with a wad stack of various materials and thicknesses. as with many other shooters, i prefer to punch out my own, and i use a cornell press mounted wad punch - fantastic tool.

  13. #13
    Boolit Master
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    My wads were made from old Thomas Register book covers.
    The covers were punched on a Strippet punch press at work.
    EDG

  14. #14
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by rfd View Post
    bpcr wads - another subjective matter that requires personal testing that might take up a lotta time and trials. it could all start with a simple .025" milk/juice carton over powder wad, compress, insert bullet, no more and no less. i always added a pair of .002" newsprint wads under the greaser bullet, to insure the main wad wouldn't go down range with the greaser. it could also end up with a wad stack of various materials and thicknesses. as with many other shooters, i prefer to punch out my own, and i use a cornell press mounted wad punch - fantastic tool.
    Maybe you can help me with a translation - part of the problem of a common language with different meanings - "what is a vegie fibre wad" - dumb question I know - its obviously a simple name for something this old aussie knows by a different name - newsprint I get - juice box or milk carton I get - we use cardboard wads for the hard wads in shotgun - is this your vegetable fibre wad? ......some would call tablet backing - the backing card on a writing tablet - same stuff ? . ? or are you guys talking about some kind of gasket material ?

  15. #15
    Boolit Master

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    Nope - hard compressed vegatable fiber that you can get in sheets from Buffalo Arms Co. Probably Track of the Wolf, as well.
    Wayne the Shrink

    There is no 'right' that requires me to work for you or you to work for me!

  16. #16
    Boolit Buddy
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    A reasonable description, McMaster Carr carries a similar product


    Vegetable Fiber Gasket Material

    VEGETABLE FIBER GRADE "A" is a premium grade of vegetable fiber gasket material sheet packing, efficiently saturated with a glue-glycerine impregnant rendered insoluble by means of a tanning agent (formaldehyde) to give a strong, flexible, all-proof packing with properties retained during proper storage and in use. EQ250 is plant fibre, chemically treated to resist coal tar, oils, water, alcohol, grease, air, gas, gasoline and solvents of all kinds. EQ 250 Recommended for all oil, grease, water, gasoline flange connections on trucks , tractors, automobiles, Recreational Vehicles, and industrial motors.

  17. #17
    Boolit Master

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    I have been using NAPA rubber fiber gasket material in both .060 and .030 thickness. some loads prefer one over the other. I also use a couple .002 tracing paper wads to insure the main wad dosnt stick. Another material that works for me is playing cards roughly .020 thickness. on my PP loads that use a grease cookie the stack is .060 NAPA wad, grease cookie in appropriate thickness, a playing card wad and 2 tracing paper wads. Wads have been cut from veggie fiber, felt cork card boards Styrofoam ldpe .

  18. #18
    Boolit Master wills's Avatar
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    Some gasket material contains metal, which might not be good for your barrel.

    Some people use a paper wad over the flash hole to keep powder out. They think it improves the ignition.
    Have mercy.
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    A haw, haw, haw

  19. #19
    Boolit Master

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    Willis, in response to your bringing up primer wads. Some use the tracing paper wad inside the case and gain some results, Its supposed to speed ignition keeping powder out of the flash hole and primer it self. I have gotten better results with some loads using a aluminum foil wad between the primer and case. I have yet to recover one when depriming fired cases, they appear to be consumed with the primers blast. These seem to lower extreme spreads for me and improve ignition of the charge in the longer cases. My 45-90 and heavy loads of 1 1/2 f olde ensforde seem to improve by a good margin. My theroy is the small disk of foil is consumed and becomes more white hot particles to ignite the powder better. I haven't recovered any depriming so they are consumed at some point. In one of the books I read it gave this method with tp instead of inside the case. I believe it was Randolph S Wrights Loading an Shooting the Paper Patched Bullet A Beginners Guide.
    I cut a slit in the back of my shell holders .030 wide and .375 wide even with the bottom of the shell holders case rim groove. This allows a 3/8" wide strip of foil to be feed thru and the primer cuts the disk and seats it while priming. I have tried them in several calibers 38-55, 40-65, 45-70 and 45-90.

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