Lead/blood test is high

[hansumtoad]

This isn't a big deal. MtGun was right on the nose. WASH YOUR HANDS after handling WW, casting, reloading, or shooting at an indoor range. Especially do so before you put your big, greasy mitts on a Triple Cheeseburger and a Supersize order of fries.

Did I suggest WASH YOUR HANDS? If you do want to use even a disposable mask when casting as a precaution, make sure it is N100 rated and not N95.

Again, feel free to PM me if you have any questions. My company's website is www.oshahelpnow.com.

[303Guy]

I heard a rumer that the Roman empire finally fell (after three thousand years) because the ruling class got killed off from lead pipes and peuter cooking and drinking utensils. Hell, I can't remember how long the Roman empire lasted! As far as I can make out, it's still going strong. Raman Catholic Church? Vatican City?

On the serious side, my youngster was exposed to lead from leaded fuel (and of cause, carbon monoxide) due to a leaky exaust and his speach development did seem to regress (he was under two years old). More likely it was due to a fall and a crack on his head - he being hyperactive and all, or perhaps it was simply his aspergers. He is still very bright.

[Multigunner]

I heard a rumer that the Roman empire finally fell (after three thousand years) because the ruling class got killed off from lead pipes and peuter cooking and drinking utensils. Hell, I can't remember how long the Roman empire lasted! As far as I can make out, it's still going strong. Raman Catholic Church? Vatican City?

On the serious side, my youngster was exposed to lead from leaded fuel (and of cause, carbon monoxide) due to a leaky exaust and his speach development did seem to regress (he was under two years old). More likely it was due to a fall and a crack on his head - he being hyperactive and all, or perhaps it was simply his aspergers. He is still very bright.

The worst of the Roman lead poisoning came from use of lead ascetate as an artificial sweetener for wines.
This was especially common during the first years of the "Dark Ages" when the skies were actually darkened by debris from a massive explosion in Asia, cause not known but suspected to be a comet strike that hit dead onto a weak spot in the Earth's crust near Krakatoa, the same weak spot that caused the 19th century eruption.
Anyway whatever the cause sunlight was greatly reduced for three years, and wine grapes were harvested early to avoid rotting before they got ripe. There was not enough natural fructose in the grapes so after fermentation the wine was thin and soured.
The skeletons of upper class Romans do show signs of heavy metal poisoning, and historical records of some individual omans revealing progressive mental deterioration appear to confirm the effects.

[303Guy]

Interesting. The only massive explosion I am aware of in recent times was that of our own Kiwi volcano, Taupo which ejected some 100 cubic kilometers of material (that's a big number, folks) and the event was recorded by the Chinese and the Romans due it's atmospheric effects. This was 10 times as large as the eruption of Krakatoa. Heaps of gunpowder!

The eruption column was twice as high as the eruption column from Mount St. Helens in 1980, and the ash turned the sky red over Rome and China.

... the most recent major eruption, which occurred in 180 CE. Known as the Hatepe eruption, it is believed to have ejected 100 cubic kilometres of material, of which 30 cubic kilometres was ejected in the space of a few minutes.

The 1980 eruption of Mount St. Helens ... An eruption column rose 80,000 feet (24,400 m) into the atmosphere and deposited ash in 11 U.S. states

Heaps and heaps of black powder!

[knotbrush]

We know your Boolits are pretty but quit kissing them and your problem will go away.............................

Some times I AM especially proud of a batch! ...and thanks all, I feel a LOT better! I will take serious precautions and develop better work and clean-up habits. At least I know I don't have to stop casting and shooting.

I recently got my NRA cert for teaching reloading and I was hoping to do informal classes in casting too. I can go forward with that now.

[tommygirlMT]

<snip>

Before you smoke, eat, drink, or apply makeup (yeah, there are some women in this category, as well as some fellows whose drummer plays a different tune) wash your hands with soap for at least 20 seconds and rinse thoroughly. Doing so will keep your lead levels down where they they belong.
My last BLL was 4.6, and I load and cast hundreds of boolits each month. If you shoot indoors and you can see gun smoke lingering, limit your exposure to one or two hours a month.

On the makeup thing --- unless you are careful about what you buy the makeup itself has more toxic $h*t in it then any potential lead contamnation --- Hg is especially a problem in most makeup and is far more problematic then lead

What little makeup I use I buy at the local health nut granola store that is the all natural ingredient stuff --- granted I also like going there because I get to mess with the guy who ownes the places head as well but that isn't too hard --- (I think he smoked a little too much of a certain green herb an fried what few brain cells he had)

[truckjohn]

OK, so now we have heard how the lead gets into the bloodstream and how to avoid it and what the acceptable levels are but what does lead in the blood actually do to a person?

Assuming you are an adult, not a kid...... (Bear in mind I'm not a doctor...)

At lower levels - you end up feeling like ****.... Kinda like a cold you just can't shake... Generally, feeling crappy, worn down, can't shake that feeling of just "Yuck" and tired.....

As the levels increase - it gets worse..... moving into painful bones and joints and really severe fatigue..... almost bordering on "Chronic Depression" or "Chronic Fatigue..."

and to make "Self Diagnosis" matters worse - Vitamin C helps alleviate this when you have higher blood leads... so you really believe you have a cold you just can't shake.... and that large daily doses of Vitamin C is the cure..... The Vitamin C is helping - but it's not helping an actual Cold per se....

Next thing... Pb substitutes into the bones in place of Calcium.... especially if you don't drink much milk (Many adults don't).... It's also why drinking lots of Milk was generally accepted by casters, plumbers, and welders... Getting plenty of Calcium slows down the Lead absorption.....

Personally, I found that I started getting cravings for milk, cheese, and dairy products once I got enough Vitamin D to get adequate calcium absorption..... I also craved citrus and high vitamin C foods like Cabbage..... as well as Vitamin C pills.....

It's a different matter for kids - as Lead interferes with nerve development and development of sexual organs and the like.....

[303Guy]

Oh hell! I have all those symptoms! Is bad memory also a sympton? What was I talking about? .....

I shouldn't have high lead levels - I not being exposed so much but I'll ask my doc to check it out just the same.

Thank's, truckjohn. (I think?)

[Peregrine]

I've looked into the Vitamin C (adsorbic acid) thing, it seems there could be something to it.

Here's a paper that found a significant increase in lead excretion in urine/feces in rats when lead was dosed in combination with Vitamin C compared to just lead.
n (number of subjects in the study) is pretty small, 10 for each group, but 3 rats died in the lead only group, one died with low dose C and lead, and none died in the high dose C group.

I found other studies showing similar results in terms of increasing excretion of lead but if I link them y'all wouldn't have access and be able to read them without paying for a subscription scheme because of where they are published.

I've found several studies correlating high blood vitamin C concentrations with low blood lead levels in humans, as well as the reverse. There are also a few trial that didn't show a significant correlation one way or the other.

There are many Chelating agents (chemicals that form a complex with lead allowing it to more easily be excreted from the body) that have been proven to be effective to some extent in removing lead from the body, but they tend to have nasty side effects of removing various metal ions your body needs as well as other unpleasantness, and in any case are not something you'll be able to acquire easily.

Vitamin C is dirt cheap, I hit up Costco a few days ago and was able to get 1000 IU tablets for about two pennies each.


The upper recommended daily dose of vitamin C is 2000 IU a day, the reason it isn't higher is at around 3000 IU some people displayed intestinal discomfort. Large doses of it are tolerated by the body quite well, most of the other common vitamins can be VERY harmful in high doses, in comparison C is quite safe. It's water soluble and excesses are easily excreted in urine. I think taking 1000 IU as a maintenance dose or 2000 IU if you have an elevated blood level is an excellent idea. Most likely symptom you'll run into first going much higher is diarrhoea.

This a bit of a humorous aside, but for acute toxicity the LD50 in rats was found to be 11900 milligrams per kg in rats. That mean you can estimate the average 200lb human would have to eat about 1.1kg (2.4 lbs) at once to have a 50% chance of dying.

Absorbtion of vitamin C by the body drops off as you take more, large doses don't increase blood concentrations of vitamin C above a ceiling of 0.22mM. This part is purely conjecture on my part but i'm guessing the ability of vitamin C to increase lead excretion also hits a ceiling at this point, taking ridiculous mega doses (multiple grams per day!) of it as in in vogue by some quacks for assorted purported benefits would just be a waste. So taking advantage of the low toxicity to take a massive amount in order to remove lead from your body faster almost certainly won't work.



It's my opinion that supplementing vitamin C strikes an fantastic therapeutic balance for anyone like us who is has increased opportunity for exposure to lead. It's very ubiquitous an inexpensive, there's a good chance it's effective, and it's remarkably safe to take even at higher than recommended dosages for long terms.

[whisler]

If you tend to have gout, don't take high doses of Vitamin C. It tends to metabolize to uric acid and that will cause a flare-up. Don't ask me how I know.

[Peregrine]

If you tend to have gout, don't take high doses of Vitamin C. It tends to metabolize to uric acid and that will cause a flare-up. Don't ask me how I know.

That's odd, I thought the opposite is true at least for moderate doses. Here's a study to that effect, with the highest decrease in gout incidence (45%) at the highest levels of vitamin C intake.

I also don't think that vitamin C is metabolized to uric acid.

Here's the structure of uric acid.
The thing to notice there is that it is a purine, a heterocyclic aromatic compound that's composed of pyrimidine ring fused to an imidazole ring. Note all those nitrogens fused into that ring system. Quite unique structurally.



This is adsorbic acid.
Note the structure is completely different, no fancy aromatized rings or any nitrogen whatsoever.


Gout can be caused/worsened by consuming foods that contain purines, molecules with those fancy rings. I have no information to say that you won't make an existing outbreak of gout worse one way or another, but it won't be because adsorbic acid is being metabolized into uric acid. Any references to the contrary are welcome.

[whisler]

Just going by what my doctor told me. I know that after taking high doses of Vitamin C to combat sinus issues I had a gout flare-up. When I asked the doctor, he told me that for those prone to gout, high doses of Vitamin C would cause flares due to metabolizing to uric acid. Possibly nitrogen is picked up from elsewhere in the body or food supply. I am a chemist but not a biochemist.

[Silvercreek Farmer]

Just quit kissing your pretty little ingots, people!

[toallmy]

I go in for some blood work tomorrow morning , and when I mentioned to my Dr. I wanted to be tested for lead & mercury he was very surprised . When he asked why , I just replied I work around some pretty nasty stuff .....

[Yodogsandman]

I had elevated levels once up to 18. I attributed it to digging and sifting dirt from the range. Lead oxidizes causing that whitish dust on the surface. The range lead has this powder on much of it. I ingested it by breathing it in, never thinking about what that dust cloud was, Should have worn a respirator. It took two years to reduce my levels below 10, drinking orange juice every day. Only cast the bare minimum of what I needed, too.