Pedersoli Sharps

[doubs43]

Tom, your Pedersoli should have a groove diameter of .456". I have an 1874 Pedersoli Sharps and it shoots a .458" boolit quite accurately. What diameter are your Trapdoor boolits?

[THerbert]

Well, that could be the problem. I measured a bullet pulled from an unfired load, and it measures 0.456". A sized and lubricated, but never loaded bullet measures the same. Interesting, being that my sizing die is marked 0.457".

Regardless, it looks like I need a 0.458" die.

Now, I'm also interested to find out what the bore of my original trapdoor measures. I have some 405 grain hollow-base bullets to load for it, that are sized 0.459".

[montana_charlie]

Regardless, it looks like I need a 0.458" die.

It would be a good idea to cast your chamber, or make an impact impression, which includes the first inch of the bore.

You may find out that the groove diameter at the chamber end is measurably larger than the groove diameter at the muzzle.
Pedersoli cuts that taper on purpose.

Then, when you go to buy a larger sizing die, you may find that .460" is what you want. That is what I use ... and the PGT bullet (designed expressly for the Pedersoli Sharps) is spec'd at .460".

CM

[sffar]

I just purchased a Pedersoli Sharps, and have to say it's real nicely put together. I believe it's the Long Range Hunter model with a 30" barrel. Bought it used, but with one round through it by the previous owner who'd bought it at Cabellas. Just ordered brass, dies and what not, but haven't purchased a mold yet. There's a 600 yard range at my club, so I'm hoping to shoot it there. I'm finding it difficult to pick a mold. I'd like a SC, and would probably be happy enough with the 547125 or 547132 Lyman designs, but I'm worried about their casting large enough, as I've read a .460 is just right. The Paul Jones mold is what I want, but it's very expensive. I may go for it anyway, but only because it's easier than going through several molds/designs that may or may not work well. The Lee probably would give me a .460 bullet, and it's inexpensive. I put a post on the Group Buys forum to see if there's interest in having the PGT bullet made by NOE, MiHec or whoever–maybe Jones would do a group buy–but there's been no interest, which is disappointing, as Pedersoli sells a lot of these rifles and I thought maybe I wasn't the only one thinking along these lines.

[Kenny Wasserburger]

You may wish to check with NEI Moulds and the Original Ideal Postell, they usually are at .461 out of the mould, I sized mine to 458 for my Shiloh and shot into AAA in silhouette with this bullet in the late 90's. Get the Cast Iron Blocks they last much longer.

KW
The Lunger

PS BACO aka Buffalo Arms also sells excellent moulds for around 130 and are of top quality.

[sffar]

Thanks, Kenny. I've looked around the BACO website, but will have a look at the NEI. I really like the idea of a bullet built specifically to the chamber, though, I gotta say!
With the brass, etc. in the mail, the weather looking good, got to order something pretty soon. I called Lyman, and they promise plus or minus .002 from .460, but it's a throw of the dice.

[Doc Highwall]

I think I saw the Pedersoli-Gunn-Trenk bullet mould available from Buffalo Arms.
Great site and lots of knowledgeable people there.

[sffar]

I'll have to call BACO. I do see one design in the NEI catalog called "Gunn Modified" #341C, though it has an additional band. Maybe their own take on the PGT.

[montana_charlie]

That #341C has been in their catalog a lot longer than the PGT design has existed. Dr. Gunn designed a ton of bullets in his day.
It was because of his expertise that he was recruited to develop the Pedersoli bullet.

CM

[sffar]

That #341C has been in their catalog a lot longer than the PGT design has existed. Dr. Gunn designed a ton of bullets in his day.
It was because of his expertise that he was recruited to develop the Pedersoli bullet.

CM

And here I was thinking "gunn" was Italian for "gun!"
MC, I've read many of your posts here and on a bpcr forum. I believe you use the PGT bullet. May I ask your opinion (and others as well) on whether it's worth pursuing this bullet designed specifically for the Pedersoli chamber? Is there a theoretical advantage more than a practical one?
Don't mean to hijack thread, though it is about what works for a Pedersoli Sharps.

[montana_charlie]

I believe you use the PGT bullet. May I ask your opinion (and others as well) on whether it's worth pursuing this bullet designed specifically for the Pedersoli chamber? Is there a theoretical advantage more than a practical one?

First, the PGT bullet is pretty similar to the PJ Creedmoor. It is less similar to the Postell. A gun that shoots the Creedmoor well will probably also shoot the PGT well. That refers to any brand of rifle.
As I recall from the days when I remembered the numbers, the ballistic coefficient of the PGT is slightly better than the Creedmoor.

Which it will shoot 'best' will likely hinge on which one 'fits' best. Bullet fit is the most important part of having it shoot well.
I have no idea of what rifle Paul Jones originally cut his Creedmoor to fit. But, whoever shot it got such good results that everybody had to have his own. It turned out to be a very flexible design which works well in many rifles. Those rifles that don't like the Creedmoor seem to like the Postell.

You are looking at trying a number of designs, to see what works best in your gun. If you prefer to buy a mould for each design you try, you will own at least two moulds ... because you will always wonder if one of the others would 'do better' (which usually means 'fit better').

If you buy a Lyman 457132 Postell mould, current thinking among our members leads me to believe it is likely to be undersize. The PJ Creedmoor is available from NEI at a lower price than Jones charges, but it's about twice what they want for Lyman moulds. The membership here has been saying that NEI moulds are coming out undersized, too.

That could get you pointed toward a custom cut mould ... for the simple fact that you want it to cast the bullet that you expect it to.
Thinking on that line, buying a Creedmoor mould - or a Postell mould - from Paul Jones could be a fine decision.
But ... since he sells a mould that is specifically shaped to your chamber ... why not go the route which has the greatest probability of working for you?

After considerable 'development', my rifle shoots the Creedmoor well (from an NEI mould). It does about equally well with the PGT, but I never spent much time with that bullet after I finally got the mould ... a long wait during the days when Victory Molds was on it's deathbed. I set the mould aside after only a session or two because I was just turning toward paper patching.

In answer to your specific question ...
Because I didn't take the PGT all the way through to finding the 'best load', I can only say that the advantage is 'theoretical'. But it sure was easy to get 'decent' results.

Having used mass-produced and custom-made moulds, I feel you will never regret using a custom. There are a number of mould makers in our membership.
Any of them could (legally) cut the PGT cavity for you.

I hope this is informative enough to help you make a decision ... without being too pushy.

CM

[sffar]

Thanks, MC. I appreciate your very circumspect opinion. The PJ mold is looking better and better–that price is still tough, though. I have bought custom molds and they're a much more reliable purchase, and if the NEI experience has been difficult for a lot of buyers, that's worth the difference in price right there if it turned out to be a hassle. I don't see this as a gun I'm likely to want to try more molds for than I have to. Might be nice to have a slightly lighter bullet that shoots well at my distance, but that's trivial, really, given that it might take more of something else to assemble. I'd much prefer to get a promising outcome the first time.
Too bad my group buy post has gotten no interest, as that would have solved the problem cheaper, and whoever made it might have a good money maker given there are so many Pedersoli Sharps out there. Hard to believe I'm the only one considering these same options. Not a single bit of interest–a lead balloon!
Maybe it'll get traction after I purchase the PJ edition.
Sam

[Baja_Traveler]

My experience with the Lyman Postell mold is that it drops at an average of .459. The mold I borrowed doesn't drop them perfectly round - .458 to .460. Shot them for the first time last weekend, and they shoot reasonably well out to 300 yards. I will be ordering the PJ mold soon, as that was the plan all along. I sure love my Pedersoli! Finished my shooting sticks today - I'll be shooting my first BPCR Silhouette match next weekend.

[sffar]

Man, that's a nice looking setup. You may throw some guys off their game. Good luck at the match! And thanks for the bullet info.

[Bad Ass Wallace]

I have 3 PJ moulds now 460 PGT, 650gn Creedmoor for the 50/90 and 374gn .380 for the Pedersoli Hiwall with 1:12 twist barrel; I can say his products are second to none.

[mattbowen]

Tom;

I swedged my Pedersoli Sharps the other day and found it to be .4555 and I shoot a Lee 405HBFP (unsized) and it shoots very well out to 100yds. so far (I only have a 100yd range set up).

Matt

[sffar]

I spoke to Paul Jones, and he informed me that Pedersoli had changed their throat dimensions in recent times, so for newer Pedersoli Sharps rifles the Gunn Trenk bullet may not be the best option. If I understood him correctly, the long freebore is no longer the norm, and the throat dimension is now more standardized; cut in a way he compared to those in the Shiloh rifles.
Good guy! He took his time explaining some things, and wasn't interested in the least in getting me signed up for a purchase.

[montana_charlie]

I spoke to Paul Jones, and he informed me that Pedersoli had changed their throat dimensions in recent times, so for newer Pedersoli Sharps rifles the Gunn Trenk bullet may not be the best option.

Thanks for posting that information.

From now on, a person will need to cast his chamber before deciding on a bullet design for use in a Pedersoli Sharps.

CM

[Little Roy]

Thank you for all of the great information on this list.

I just purchased a Bill Dixon Sharps in 50-90 and am just getting into reloading for it.

Where can I get the equipment to cast the chamber?

I am also not sure if I should be looking at paper patch ir streight lead.

I would like to use smokeless.

Thank you

Roy

[Baja_Traveler]

Tom;

I swedged my Pedersoli Sharps the other day and found it to be .4555 and I shoot a Lee 405HBFP (unsized) and it shoots very well out to 100yds. so far (I only have a 100yd range set up).

Matt

I also did an impact cast of my Pedersoli Sharps last weekend - same exact numbers!

Interesting info from Paul Jones, and I'm glad you posted it - I'm about to order a PJ mold, and was going to get the P-G-T design, but now I guess I dont need to...

(BTW - shot a 21 in my first BPCR silhouette match last weekend! It is now officially my favorite game.)