MidSouth Shooters SupplyWidenersReloading EverythingLee Precision
RepackboxLoad DataRotoMetals2Inline Fabrication
Titan Reloading PBcastco
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 24

Thread: Chamber corrosion: Repair options

  1. #1
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    467

    Chamber corrosion: Repair options

    I picked up an H&R Buffalo Classic. The chamber has some significant corrosion. It initially wouldn't chamber a round due to the corrosion. I used kroil and JB bore compound and lapped the chamber with a jag and also chucked a brass bore brush in my drill and have it cleaned up to where it will now chamber. However after firing the brass is showing the imprint of the pitting, its indented where the corrosion is, showing I still don"t have it removed. Could this be fixed by running a chamber reamer in the chamber? I know bores are relined, is that also an option? Can a chamber be enlarged and lined?

  2. #2
    Moderator


    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Way up in the Cascades
    Posts
    8,056
    I have limited experience in this area, but will try to help. First, the brass is going to extrude into the pits, and in these circumstances it will usually be enough to effect efficient extraction. I had a friend who filled the pits with soft solder. He claimed that every time he fired it the solder would melt at the time of ignition, but solidify again by the time he extracted the cartridge. I heard of another person who filled the pitting with JB Weld. When it cured he ran the appropriate chambering reamer into the chamber and cut out the excess JB, and said that it worked fine thereafter. I have a broomhandle Mauser pistol with a gouged chamber that would cause the pistol to jam on every shot, but I solved the problem by shooting cheap Chinese steel cased ammo in it, found that the steel would not extrude, and the pistol then functioned perfectly. Note: It was necessary to pull the bullets and download the ammo a bit from the Tokarev loading.

    All that having been said, I think that I would have the chamber relined. Being an H&R, you'd probably want to avoid re-barreling or changing out the entire unit, especially since H&R is out of business and you'll be unlikely to find another unattached barrel in good condition. Relining the chamber is pretty straight forward, it just involves boring out the existing chamber to a larger sized, making and silver soldering in a liner, and then chambering the liner to the original caliber. Unless you have a lathe it is pretty much a gunsmith job.

  3. #3
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    467
    Does anyone know if Bob Hoyt does chamber relinings? I always see his name mentioned for barrel relines.

  4. #4
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    brisbane ,qld,australia
    Posts
    2,110
    Sleeving a chamber is a simple process,however ,I dont recommend blackpowder be used any more in the sleeved chamber ,if it goes full length.If its possible to have the sleeve 2/3 or 3/4 chamber ,with the neck left to seal,then probably OK.....A straight taper case like 45/70 ,doesnt need a reamer ,just cut the chamber with a small boring bar,and a light hone to finish.............by the way,there is no need at all to silver solder ,the high heat involved is quite damaging......loctite is quite sufficient,and Ive found after a test firing/proof load the sleeve is stuck near immovably without any adhesive .

  5. #5
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    467
    Quote Originally Posted by john.k View Post
    Sleeving a chamber is a simple process,however ,I dont recommend blackpowder be used any more in the sleeved chamber ,if it goes full length.If its possible to have the sleeve 2/3 or 3/4 chamber ,with the neck left to seal,then probably OK.....A straight taper case like 45/70 ,doesnt need a reamer ,just cut the chamber with a small boring bar,and a light hone to finish.............by the way,there is no need at all to silver solder ,the high heat involved is quite damaging......loctite is quite sufficient,and Ive found after a test firing/proof load the sleeve is stuck near immovably without any adhesive .
    Do you not recommend black powder due the chance of corrosion where the repair is made?

  6. #6
    Boolit Master Cap'n Morgan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Denmark
    Posts
    1,457
    The soft solder/JB Weld fix seems like a good and easy solution.

    I once read of a couple of Danish explorers who crossed the Sahara desert on a Nimbus motorcycle with sidecar. At one point the engine's cylinders were so worn from the fine sand getting in everywhere that they had to fix it. It was done using Babbit "white metal" to fill out the worn areas and then file the cylinder bores into round shape again, using a campfire to heat the cylinder block. Now that's handymen for you..!
    Cap'n Morgan

  7. #7
    Vendor Sponsor

    W.R.Buchanan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Ojai CA
    Posts
    9,871
    Quote Originally Posted by Cap'n Morgan View Post
    The soft solder/JB Weld fix seems like a good and easy solution.

    I once read of a couple of Danish explorers who crossed the Sahara desert on a Nimbus motorcycle with sidecar. At one point the engine's cylinders were so worn from the fine sand getting in everywhere that they had to fix it. It was done using Babbit "white metal" to fill out the worn areas and then file the cylinder bores into round shape again, using a campfire to heat the cylinder block. Now that's handymen for you..!
    Yeah, and if you don't have anything else to do while waiting in the middle of the desert for someone to drive by and give you a lift, it might be time well spent.

    Kind of like Flight of the Phoenix ?

    I bet they wished they'd had K&N Air Filters back then.

    Randy
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
    www.buchananprecisionmachine.com

  8. #8
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    467
    My corrosion problem isn't that there are pits, it is that the corrosion is proud of the chamber walls. Like a chunk of rust in the chamber. Thats why it initially wouldn't chamber. I've removed enough that it will now chamber but once fired the brass is indented, not blown outwards into pits. I currently have a little bit of Evapo Rust soaking on the spot overnight, will see how it cleans up in the morning.

  9. #9
    Moderator


    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Way up in the Cascades
    Posts
    8,056
    Well, you see, once you remove that proud rust you will have pits. I think your best bet is to reline and re-chamber.

  10. #10
    Boolit Grand Master Bazoo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Cecilia, Kentucky
    Posts
    6,689
    Once you get the rust removed you might have pits bad enough to hold your brass or not. I wonder if you used nickel brass if it would not grab the pits as bad? Just a thought I had.
    Last edited by Bazoo; 10-03-2020 at 09:57 PM.

  11. #11
    Boolit Grand Master

    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Northwest Ohio
    Posts
    14,420
    While most shooting 45-70 look for the thinner brass some of the thicker brass may help here it wont flow as easily. What you might try is use a case for the polishing lap to actually true the chamber up some. drill and tap the head thru the primer flash hole and lovktite a bolt and jam nut in it. use this to turn it in a tapping motion by hand. The brass case and fine compound will cut high spots and clean up the chamber. Go slow and easy with very fine compounds flitz auto rubbing compound tooth paste JB Bore cleaner, the goal isnt metal removal but to just remove the high spots and break the roughness up.

    If it comes to sleeving the chamber then you first need to check the bore good and decide if you want to reline or sleeve. It would be a real shame to spend the time money on sleeving the chamber to find out the bore wasnt good and have to start over. The few chambers Ive sleeved I did by shrinking the sleeve in place. Poll barrel and bore out the chamber the length and squareness is important here is important here as the sleeve must fit tight and be a good tight seal at the seam. Then turn the sleeve to +.001-.0015 over the chamber bored size. Now heat the barrel and freeze the sleeve. Have everything set up and ready to go. A hammer brass punch barrel well blocked and supported solid. I make a piloted punch so setting it in place lighns it up. Freeze the sleeve over night in a glass of crushed ice A small zip lock bag will keep moisture off the sleeve. When ready take the sleeve in the cup to the shop heat the barrel and insert lightly tap down in place with the punch and hammer. allow to normalize and as this happens the sleeve expands back up and the barrel shrinks back down making a very tight interference fit. You want good smooth finishes on both parts to get the best seam and bite possible. When done the seam inside should be invisible even under magnification. I would try for a .075 to .100 wall thickness so the back seam is hidden in the rim cut shoulder. For this to work well set up is important the bore has to be running dead true in the lathe both boring it out and when finishing it Here I left the bore small and first step was boring it to size for the piloted chambering reamer to true and size.

    This job while not super hard is time consuming and slow. Getting that barrel indicated in and everything machined and set together takes time. Almost as long as relining does. And its almost as much work

  12. #12
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    467
    Quote Originally Posted by country gent View Post
    While most shooting 45-70 look for the thinner brass some of the thicker brass may help here it wont flow as easily. What you might try is use a case for the polishing lap to actually true the chamber up some. drill and tap the head thru the primer flash hole and lovktite a bolt and jam nut in it. use this to turn it in a tapping motion by hand. The brass case and fine compound will cut high spots and clean up the chamber. Go slow and easy with very fine compounds flitz auto rubbing compound tooth paste JB Bore cleaner, the goal isnt metal removal but to just remove the high spots and break the roughness up.

    If it comes to sleeving the chamber then you first need to check the bore good and decide if you want to reline or sleeve. It would be a real shame to spend the time money on sleeving the chamber to find out the bore wasnt good and have to start over. The few chambers Ive sleeved I did by shrinking the sleeve in place. Poll barrel and bore out the chamber the length and squareness is important here is important here as the sleeve must fit tight and be a good tight seal at the seam. Then turn the sleeve to +.001-.0015 over the chamber bored size. Now heat the barrel and freeze the sleeve. Have everything set up and ready to go. A hammer brass punch barrel well blocked and supported solid. I make a piloted punch so setting it in place lighns it up. Freeze the sleeve over night in a glass of crushed ice A small zip lock bag will keep moisture off the sleeve. When ready take the sleeve in the cup to the shop heat the barrel and insert lightly tap down in place with the punch and hammer. allow to normalize and as this happens the sleeve expands back up and the barrel shrinks back down making a very tight interference fit. You want good smooth finishes on both parts to get the best seam and bite possible. When done the seam inside should be invisible even under magnification. I would try for a .075 to .100 wall thickness so the back seam is hidden in the rim cut shoulder. For this to work well set up is important the bore has to be running dead true in the lathe both boring it out and when finishing it Here I left the bore small and first step was boring it to size for the piloted chambering reamer to true and size.

    This job while not super hard is time consuming and slow. Getting that barrel indicated in and everything machined and set together takes time. Almost as long as relining does. And its almost as much work
    Thanks for that info. I like the case polishing idea and think I'll give that a try. I do not have a lathe or probably the skills to reline the chamber myself. Thats why I'm trying a few other things first. But if they fail it will be a gunsmith job. Thanks again for the suggestions to all.

  13. #13
    Boolit Grand Master Bazoo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Cecilia, Kentucky
    Posts
    6,689
    Had another idea. To remove the bulk of the raised rust, you might try belling a case so it scrapes and hammering it in the chamber. Same as was described to me for carbon ring in a revolver.

  14. #14
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Posts
    2,377
    Check out the Brownells online catalog. They sell these chamber honing tools. Looks like little rubberized balls on what looks like a big bore brush. There is a special oil/lubricant to be used with the tool. From what I can gather you screw the tool into a section of cleaning rod and it's powered by a variable speed drill the oil acts as a cutting lubricant Run the tool into your chamber and run it back and forth. This is one of those jobs where you use the tool, stop and clean the chamber see how its working on the pits/corrosion and try again. So its not a 123 type of deal. With this type of tool you are homing out the chamber. Frank

  15. #15
    Boolit Grand Master uscra112's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Switzerland of Ohio
    Posts
    6,308
    Those hones are made by Brush Research.

    http://www.brushresearch.com/flexhon...ning_brush.php
    ----------------

    This might just be a good application for electrolytic rust removal.

    Plug the throat with plasticine clay or a tight-fitting rubber plug.
    Stand barrel upright
    Pour in a solution of water and washing soda.
    Insert a piece of iron wire in the center
    Set up a DC current source - a battery charger is good, 6volts is good
    Connect positive to wire, negative to the barrel
    Apply current and wait. Overnight is usually enough.
    Remove connections, dump out solution.

    The interior of the chamber will be black. That's iron phosphate.

    NOW hone the chamber smooth.

    http://www.metaldetectingworld.com/m...lyte_p15.shtml

    I've used the electrolytic process for many years to derust gun parts, old tools, motorcycle parts, and what-have-you. It works. Antique restorers prefer it over any other method, because it affects only the rust. It does not remove any of the parent metal.

    Caution - the solution will bubble as it's working. That's gaseous hydrogen coming off. Maintain good ventilation.
    Last edited by uscra112; 10-04-2020 at 02:57 AM.
    Cognitive Dissident

  16. #16
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    467
    Quote Originally Posted by samari46 View Post
    Check out the Brownells online catalog. They sell these chamber honing tools. Looks like little rubberized balls on what looks like a big bore brush. There is a special oil/lubricant to be used with the tool. From what I can gather you screw the tool into a section of cleaning rod and it's powered by a variable speed drill the oil acts as a cutting lubricant Run the tool into your chamber and run it back and forth. This is one of those jobs where you use the tool, stop and clean the chamber see how its working on the pits/corrosion and try again. So its not a 123 type of deal. With this type of tool you are homing out the chamber. Frank
    Checked those out, never seen them before. Seems like they work good based on a few reviews I read. Might not be a bad option if the homemade plans do't pan out, thanks for suggesting it.

  17. #17
    Boolit Grand Master
    rockrat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    5,310
    Get some 0000 steel wool and take a wood dowel and cut a groove lengthwise a few inches and wrap the steel wool around the dowel, tucking a bit in the split part so it won't spin. Chuck the dowel in a variable speed drill and put some light oil on the wool and in the chamber and start the drill and feed it in the chamber. It will polish the chamber quickly and clean out the rust from the pits. Then go from there. Check the chamber often when polishing.

  18. #18
    Boolit Master


    frkelly74's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    SAGINAW
    Posts
    2,375
    And if the chamber is really toast ,you can still salvage the chamber area as a stub donor and go to another caliber. But there should be enough meat there to bore out the chamber and sleeve it for a rechambering. I wish I had a lathe.
    Quis Quis Quis, Quis Liberat Canes

    /////////BREAKING NEWS////////////
    Millions and millions of American shooters and sportsmen got up, went to work, contributed to society in useful and meaningful ways all over the nation and shot no one today! How do they controll themselves?? Experts Baffled....


    I LIKE IKE

  19. #19
    Vendor Sponsor

    W.R.Buchanan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Ojai CA
    Posts
    9,871
    Should have said this earlier but you can make a "Polish Hone" out of a piece of Rod with a slot cut in the end and wrap a piece of fine sandpaper around it, run it in a Drill motor and polish the chamber with that and some oil.

    It will only remove that which is above the surface.

    This is a lot simpler method than anything from above. If it doesn't achieve the desired results you are out $1 or less. Any chemical or electrical treatment will remove corrosion above and below the surface and ruin the barrel.

    If my method doesn't work right, you are going to need a new barrel as Relining Chambers and other fixes are going to cost you more than just replacing the barrel and probably be much less satisfactory.

    Randy.
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
    www.buchananprecisionmachine.com

  20. #20
    Boolit Grand Master
    Mk42gunner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Butler, MO
    Posts
    9,013
    First you need to get the rust out. I have used Evaporust to remove rust in the bore, the chamber was okay in the rifle I did. I used electrical tape to seal the end of the barrel and stood it up in a sink overnight. It worked and if it didn't it was a junk barrel so I wasn't really loosing anything by trying it.

    As for the chamber, IIRC Roy Dunlap recommended using red jewelers rouge on a case that was fired in that chamber for polishing pitting. I would fire one round, then decap and drill out the primer pocket. Use a small bolt and double nutt it as a mandrel then turn with a slow speed drill.

    It might not take much, you really only need the edges of the pits broken enough for easy extraction.

    Robert

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check