MidSouth Shooters SupplyWidenersInline FabricationLoad Data
PBcastcoRotoMetals2Lee PrecisionReloading Everything
Repackbox Titan Reloading
Results 1 to 20 of 20

Thread: Current group buy production times

  1. #1
    Boolit Master Whistler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    524

    Current group buy production times

    I'm not an expert on group buys, I've only been involved as a buyer in two or three and I've never honchoed or designed for one.

    If I'm not mistaken the two main suppliers for group buys on Castboolits are NOE (Night Owl Express) in the US and MiHec in Slovenia (Europe).

    In a couple of threads I've read that current production times are well over a year. One particular group buy was listed as production in December 2013!

    The demand for semi-custom moulds of high quality is obiously great. So great that Miha Previc (spelling?) on MiHec moulds actually quit his daytime job and is now a mould maker for a living. This is admirable and I believe it to be a great sunshine story in which Castboolits has played a part!

    However, I myself find myself not signing up on several interesting buys because of the long waiting times on both NOE and MiHec moulds. I have seen a lot of people even removing their names from the lists they signed up on when they realize the delivery dates. In the same time the mould makers usually do a couple of extra moulds in each buy, because they now someone will find the Closed Buys and will want to get in afterwards. Some members even do this systematically, looking in the Closed Buys section and write when they see something interesting. I have to admit that was how I myself got into group buys, I found a mould for a boolit I liked in a Closed Buy and asked if there were any spares. After that I have signed up in some lists and gotten the product.

    Personally it would take a lot to buy anything else than MiHec, there is a huge cost difference as any US made mould will have a 25% tax fee added (calculated on shipping costs as well). This makes a NOE mould almost twice the price of a MiHec mould for me, and I know a lot of other Europeans think the same. This also goes for Lee, Mountain Moulds, Accurate Moulds, NEI etc. I would happily spend $100-200 a month on group buys if the delivery times were 4-6 weeks. As it is I'm happy if I get in on one or two buys a year.

    So what can we as a community forum do to help reduce waiting times? Spread the buys among other manufacturers? High demand is of course desirable for any manufacturer, but as written above there is also an unknown amount of potential customers lost because of the waiting times.

    I am not complaining, merely trying to improve for all our benefits, both the mould makers and us buyers.
    Last edited by Whistler; 04-25-2012 at 06:47 AM.
    Shoot from a rest at 25/50/100 yards, then post your groupings. That is the only way to compare accuracy results.

  2. #2
    Boolit Grand Master
    btroj's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Nebraska's oldest city
    Posts
    12,418
    If there were other viable manufacturers we would be using them too. Until a few years ago most group buys we're for Lee 6 cav moulds and many had wait times over a year and some needed to be remade due to problems.
    We are very
    Icky to have the two custom makes we have. They are relatively new on the scene and both produce an excellent product.

    I don't care for the wait time but view it as a necessary evil. I want the quality of the product made and like the designs available.

    In time Ballistic-cast may become a viable option but that is going to need investigation. They make great moulds buti don't know about their ability/desire to do custom jobs or smallish runs of 15 or 20.

    We do have true custom shops like Accurate Moulds too. He has a decent catalog, will work with you on a custom one of a kind mould and words the wait time is measured in weeks, not months.

    I am happy that we have the options we do. We are truly lucky to have what we have. We are actually victims of pur own sucess, group buys have become so popular that we have swamped the makers we use.

  3. #3
    Boolit Master kenyerian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    977
    There are more good molds available now than I can rember. The internet makes it possible for Small custom operations to be global. This just might be the Golden years of mold availability.

  4. #4
    Boolit Master



    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Nashvegas, TN
    Posts
    1,386
    While NOE's molds are great, you should have no concerns other than selection when only buying MiHec's molds. He always has extras and if there is something he has previously made you are interested in then PM him and he will let you know if he has one. Too bad he doesn't keep his site updated with his current inventory.
    At one with the gun.

  5. #5
    Boolit Buddy H.Callahan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    East Central Illinois
    Posts
    470
    The long delivery times don't bother me (good stuff is worth waiting for) as much as the long request for payment time.

    I don't know about anyone else, but my financial situation changes from month to month. I might see a mold during a time when I have a little discretionary money, but I have no clue what my situation is going to be a year or more from now. This has prevented me from participating in a number of group buys that I might have otherwise gotten in on but didn't because I don't want to commit to anything that far out.

    It would be nice if the honchos could somehow collect the money at the time of sign-up. If the GB blows up, then of course they would have to be responsible for getting it returned, but I haven't seen very many that have actually gone south.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master Stick_man's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Salt Lake City, UT
    Posts
    543
    Or you could watch the GB discussions and the "Active" buys and jump in when they are near scheduled production. I find the long wait times to be both frustrating (the little kid side of me gets impatient but I ain't complaining) and a great opportunity to pull together the cash a little at a time. The quality of the molds make the wait worth it. I need the extra time to save up the cash for another buy. It would be nice to see some of the more popular GBs scheduled to run a little more often, say every 6 months or so. That way, if somebody just misses one, they don't have to wait for over a year before it is run again. The downside to that would be that the new designs would take longer to come to fruition, so I guess that wouldn't be a very good option either. I feel like a kid in a candy store... I want that, and I want that, oh and I want that one, etc.

    You know you have a good product when everybody wants it. The two main custom mold makers we have here have great evidence that they produce great quality. That quality makes the wait worth it.
    Last edited by Stick_man; 05-30-2012 at 12:41 AM. Reason: sounded like I was complaining about the waits
    "We the people are the rightful masters of both
    Congress & the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution,
    but overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution."

    Abraham Lincoln

  7. #7
    Banned

    Blammer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Asheville, NC
    Posts
    10,427
    I do know that NOE, when he makes a mould for a GB, he almost always doubles what was ordered. He wants to have some inventory, but he always sells out pretty quickly.

    The 360180 he ran, he will have a BUNCH of extras for that one. Odds are, he sells out in a month.

  8. #8
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    TWIN CITIES
    Posts
    727
    Didn't Miha make this a full time business? That should cut his delivery time significantly.

    ward
    "To anger a conservative, lie to him. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth." —Theodore Roosevelt"

  9. #9
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    SW Idaho
    Posts
    2,264
    delayed gratification can be a wonderful thing, if the product is quality.

    Perhaps you should consider going into the mould making business...?

  10. #10
    Boolit Master


    SciFiJim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Pensacola Florida
    Posts
    3,548
    It would be nice if the honchos could somehow collect the money at the time of sign-up.
    Been there, doing that. I always send payment info right away. The person can pay then or anytime before the final call. I send out reminders when final call time arrives. The money is kept in a separate account and never commingled with my own money.


    Custom Cast Boolits Google Search


    The Learning Never Stops!

  11. #11
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    SW Idaho
    Posts
    2,264
    SciFiJim does a great job honcho-ing group buys for no money to him.

    On NOE moulds, you have six months to a year to save the $$$. If you can't/won't wait, then do without...

    These waits are nothing compared to having a custom rifle built. Try eighteen months to three years, and money upfront. I can only afford to hunt Africa every other year. Try saving ten-grand in two years.

  12. #12
    Boolit Master
    GLL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    California
    Posts
    3,580
    Although I am an active participant in many Group Buys from NOE and MP I use Accurate Molds for all of my "custom" molds ! Tom produces beautiful brass molds made to your exact specs ! The catalog is just a starting point since he will make just about anything you can dream up. Customer service is the VERY best and delivery is almost instantaneous !!!

    http://www.accuratemolds.com/catalog.php



    I agree that SciFiJim wins the "honcho prize" for organization!
    I have honchoed six Group buys and it was a thankless job at times when you had to deal with LEE Kinda-Precision Inc. !

    Jerry

    P.S. : I really miss BRP though !
    S&W .38/44 Outdoorsman Accumulator

  13. #13
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    TWIN CITIES
    Posts
    727
    Accurate Moulds -- Here's a big second for what GLL just said!

    I recently purchased my first mould from Tom at Accurate. I was a little skiddish at first putting the order in on line but I did and I chose to mail in a check for payment.

    He notified me by email immediately when the order was received and again when the check was received. He received my payment on a Monday and when I got home from work that Thursday my new mould was waiting for me! NOW THAT'S QUICK!

    My new mould is for black powder use with my 38-40 vintage rifles. I went with a three cavity in aluminum blocks. I have cast up a couple hundred boolits but have not yet had time to load nor shoot any. The mould cast very nice and the boolits dropped freely when the mould was opened. The dimensions were just as ordered. Dummy rounds fed smoothly thru my Win 73. I'd buy from him again without hesitation!

    I can't quite see the logic in paying up front to the honcho. As we are nearly a year out, Honcho could get sick or even die and then where would you be? Same could hold true for the mould maker. I only got in on a couple of Lee's buys before the new guys came on the scene. I like the way its been running lately!

    ward
    Last edited by WARD O; 04-26-2012 at 01:03 PM.
    "To anger a conservative, lie to him. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth." —Theodore Roosevelt"

  14. #14
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Utah
    Posts
    350
    I also am a big fan of Accurate molds if you want it fast. Last one I got took 4 days from when I ordered to when it showed up on my door step. I would only use Accurate molds if he did molds that were under 30 cal, hollow points and not just flat points.

    Bardo

  15. #15
    Boolit Master



    ddixie884's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Avery, Texas
    Posts
    1,309
    Another +1 for SciFiJim, he is first rate...........
    JMHO-YMMV
    dd884
    gary@2texastrucks.com
    Gary D. Peek

  16. #16
    Boolit Master 40Super's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    1/2mile from nowhere
    Posts
    754
    You do pay for the quick turn around though,but from what I've seen very high quality.

    edit:When you first see the mold block prices, they show high. But his pricing changes when your order form is completed, so his prices are good.
    Does he HP any of his moulds?
    Last edited by 40Super; 04-27-2012 at 01:29 PM.
    sent via hammer and chisel

    need oversized powder funnels , PTX's or expanders ? just ask, I make 'em for most brands plus my own styles.

  17. #17
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Nebraska
    Posts
    1,171
    Accurate Molds whipped out a mold for my .401 Herter Power Mag in under a week.

    Accurate Molds are second to none, and I have molds from at least seven different manufacturers at the present.

  18. #18
    Boolit Buddy
    Ozarklongshot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    NW Arkansas
    Posts
    193
    I've never ordered an Accurate mold and I'm sure they are first rate. The only semi-customs I have are about a half dozen MiHec molds. I'll take the wait over loss of quality. Maybe I've been lucky but I've never waited longer than 4 months for any of them and the time frame allows for budget recovery. I couldn't be happier with the products I've received and can't believe I spent 30 years casting with "off the shelf" molds. I do have a particular need that I may see about having Accurate do.
    Compromise is giving up something you are unwilling to fight for! ΜOΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ www.concealedcarryofarkansas.com

  19. #19
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Alberta
    Posts
    270
    It looks to me like the time is nigh for us to re-rationilize our expectations for group buys and custom moulds. NOE has stopped taking orders as they are overwhelmed. After some earlier hints that quality was slipping at MP, it looks like a whole group buy worth of moulds has been delivered out-of-spec. Something has to change or the casting world's treasured makers risk burning out or slipping into mediocrity.

    Probably the first change that has to be made is a significant upping of the minimum group order size. Instituting a minimum group size of 25 or more for both new designs and re-runs would ensure that less time is spent in setup, and more time in producing moulds, and would also ensure a reasonable payback for the makers.
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    --BattleRife

  20. #20
    Made in U.S.A.
    SwedeNelson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Provo, Utah
    Posts
    2,627
    BattleRife

    Yes we are overwhelmed and have been from the word go.
    I don't think we know how to operate any other way.

    We have stopped taking on new group buys, not orders.
    Like you said - more orders help.
    A slip like that will put us out of business.

    Thanks
    Swede Nelson
    Last edited by SwedeNelson; 05-29-2012 at 09:53 AM.
    The expectation of evil is more bitter than the suffering -OR-
    More people die from worrying about getting ate by a bear then get ate by a bear.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check