Belding & Mull powder measure report

[rmcc]

I recently bought a Belding & Mull powder measure off one of our members, here is the report. Have had RCBS uniflows, Lyman 55, Herters, Dillon measures. All good and were OK at the time. After using the B&M , there is no comparison. I put it through the paces using anything from Data 2200 to IMR 4350. Measure never hiccupped once. Same charge everytime!! You could feel it shear grains with 4350, but charge was the same time after time. I love IMR 4350 but have never found a measure that would throw consistent charges. Hopper is not large on the B&M measure but with this one you are going for accuracy, not volume. I will buy another one of these!! Jack thanks a lot wherever you are.

Rich

[Bret4207]

I've found the B+M to be spot on as long as I do my part, a bit slower than some, but accurate.

[Wayne Smith]

I've also found it to be my go to measure when I'm loading a ladder. Changing charges just a little is very easy. I've had several measures made with 45-70 shells and 45-110 shells - slight overkill cause I only use one at a time, but it's fun!

[bobthenailer]

ive been reloading since 1967 and my only powder measure has been the B&M mag micrometer.
except when i bought my first dillon 450 press

[hornetman]

I have three of them--one my father bought in '46--one I bought in '78 and one a friend gave me in '97. I have 6 B&M drop tubes plus an assortment of fixed tubes that a machinist turned for me from aluminum stock. The fixed tubes are really handy for some of my favorite loads I use the B&M meaures almost exclusively for my rifle loads even though I have a couple of Reddings. For pistol loads I have three Dillons mounted on my Dillon Presses and a couple of Lyman 55's mounted on a Lyman All American and a Tru line Jr. I've considered buying a Harrell or one of the other similar measures , but the old B&M's work so well for me it's just not worth it.

[kcajeel]

Wow Rich !!! Thanks for the kudos. I'm really glad you like your measure. I really wanted to keep it for myself but I didn't and it makes it OK when someone is happy. Glad I saw your post too.

Jack

[LEADLUBBER]

I recently bought a Belding & Mull powder measure off one of our members, here is the report. Have had RCBS uniflows, Lyman 55, Herters, Dillon measures. All good and were OK at the time. After using the B&M , there is no comparison. I put it through the paces using anything from Data 2200 to IMR 4350. Measure never hiccupped once. Same charge everytime!! You could feel it shear grains with 4350, but charge was the same time after time. I love IMR 4350 but have never found a measure that would throw consistent charges. Hopper is not large on the B&M measure but with this one you are going for accuracy, not volume. I will buy another one of these!! Jack thanks a lot wherever you are.

Rich

Would you post a pic of the powder measure so I know which one to look for?

Thanks!

[rmcc]

LEADLUBBER,

Sure will!! You won't be disappointed. Will try and get posted today.

Rich

[STAR4ever]

I have used the B&M visual Powder Measure for many years, especially with black powder loads. It is quite safe in that application and also very accurate with larger grain loads. In fact, I have perhaps 15 such measures having collected them over the years from reloader friends who were downsizing.

There are two sizes of drop tubes, the standard and the magnum. In addition, each size had an option of a "micrometer" adjustment for fine sub grain graduations.

There is a sub chamber or lower chamber that is filled by the powder reservoir. This sub chamber has a glass pane so you can see the powder in it and check for functioning. Thus the name .. Visual.

It is an accurate measure in a volumetric sense when used by a good operator. The powder charge tubes (which are brass tubes with metal inner cylinder) are the key measurement and dispensing assembly. There can be variances in thrown weight, these variances are most often caused by moving the charge lever at different speeds from charge to charge or letting it bang back on return on some throws and not on others. A certain cadence and touch needs to be maintained with this and pretty much all powder measures to insure good consistent throws. Also, certain smokeless long grain or tube powders will meter differently due to stacking and cutting. Lastly, you should keep the upper powder magazine as full as possible. Many BPCR (Black Powder Cartridge Rifle) shooters have replaced the short standard upper powder magazine with a much taller (18" or more) copper tube to gain throw to throw consistency with black powder settling and kernel size.

A trick I have learned using the B&M was to take a small piece of fabric softener paper and wipe down all the inner working parts and the inside of the charge tube and lower visual chamber. This softener somewhat eliminates static cling, especially in the dry winter months.

Back in the day, many reloaders would order slews of measure tubes from B&M. One for each caliber and charge. They would put masking tape on the tube and write down the caliber, powder and grains. Thus the tube would be totally devoted to that charge and never adjusted again. I purchased a B&M which had upwards of 25 such annotated tubes.

As far as comparing it to a Harrel's or Jones or Seeley Masker brenchrest type of "click" measure, well... ahem... I would suggest that pretty much none of the benchresters would give up their more modern instruments for a B&M in this day and age. The B&M was and is however a viable and practical measure and worth seeking out. It is nice to use old, time tested, equipment.

[Kevin Rohrer]

Here is a B&M:


And here is a product-improved clone, my Vega Tools 'Schutzen':

[Kevin Rohrer]

In response to an allegation in a thread on another site that Unique didn't meter well out of B&M measures, I ran a test using three methods of dropping the powder. Here is the info I collected:

To test the allegation that Unique does not meter well from a Belding & Mull powder measure, I filled my Vega Tools Schutzen B&M clone half full with Unique, set it for a typical .45ACP load of 6.2 grains, and ran three sets of tests using the measure and an RCBS 750 electronic scale. The drop tube is an original B&M micrometer tube.

Air temperature in my basement reloading room: 62.9F. Humidity: 42%.

Prior to the test I tapped the measure ten times to settle the powder. In all the tests I made sure that all granules had exited the drop tube and lay centered in the pan:

Test-1: Cycling the measure one time per powder drop:
1. 6.2gr
2. 6.3
3. 6.1
4. 6.2
5. 6.2
6. 6.1
7. 6.1
8. 6.1
9. 6.0
10. 6.2
Average/Mean: 6.15gr
Mode: 6.1gr & 6.2gr
Range: 6.0-6.3gr
Median: 6.15gr
Variation: .3gr (-.2 to +.1)
Variation range: +-2.5%

Test-2: Cycling the measure twice per powder drop:
1. 6.1gr
2. 6.3
3. 6.5
4. 6.3
5. 6.2
6. 6.2
7. 6.2
8. 6.4
9. 6.3
10. 6.3
Average/Mean: 6.28gr
Mode: 6.2gr & 6.3gr
Range: 6.1-6.5gr
Median: 6.2gr
Variation: .4gr (-.1 to +.3)
Variation range: +-3%

Test-3: Tapped the measure vigorously five times between drops, then cycled the measure once per powder drop:
1. 6.2gr
2. 6.1
3. 6.0
4. 6.0
5. 6.1
6. 6.2
7. 6.2
8. 6.2
9. 6.1
10. 6.0
Average/Mean: 6.11gr
Mode: 6.2gr
Median: 6.1gr
Range: 6.0gr-6.2gr
Variation: .2gr (-.2 to +.0)
Variation range: +-1.5%

The larger the charge, the more accurate it will be. The fact that I was testing a very small charge and the largest variation range was only +-3%, means that the B&M does an excellent job and can be depended on to be uniform in its metering, as long as you are consistent in your methodology. I am going to remember to tap the measure between drops.

[STAR4ever]

Very good data Kevin, thanks for that work. Appreciated. If you were to drop 54g of powder (ie BlackPowder) the variance would be so small as to be "static" I recon. In other words a variance of .2 to .4 grains in a 6.0 grain charge is a larger percentage to the overall than the same variance in a 54g charge.

That Vega Schutezen appears to be a really nice modern variant of the old B&M. Thanks for sharing.

When setting a B&M or any other measure, what I do is drop 10 charges and weigh all ten as one unit... in other words throw ten 6.0~ charges and weigh that once.
If you are "ON" you should get 60g....
This kind of eliminates alot of the busy work, and also, to some extent, the variance of you scale.
Using the 10 throws allows you to simply move the decimal point over one digit.
In other words, 61.5g would be 6.15. Note this allows you to get a bit more accuracy by adding another digit to the scale.
You loose the drop by drop variance data but the effect is the same.

[d garfield]

I have used a B&M for 40yrs. You only have to learn how to operate it. It works as good as my $300 Harrels, just not as fast.

[Bret4207]

I have used a B&M for 40yrs. You only have to learn how to operate it. It works as good as my $300 Harrels, just not as fast.

That's the thing with a lot of equipment- operator finesse or error will alter the end result.

[jazzman251]

I too am a huge fan of B & M powder measures having used them for over 20 years. I currently own 3 of them. I prefer the oldest (brass hopper) with Aluminum hopper as my second choice and the plastic hopper my third choice.

I have found that by turning the drop tube 1/2 turn prior to the return stroke eliminates tapping the hopper and yields extremely accurate loads, even IMR 3031

If you find one,buy it.

[Green Frog]

Prior to the development of the Harrell type measures which are themselves a development of the Culver types, the B&M pretty much ruled the benchrest roost. The ultimate iteration of that was to take a micrometer head (Starrett or other quality manufacturer) and put it in a properly dimensioned brass tube to make the drop tube. As has been stated, this aint very fast, but accurate? You'd better believe it. I still use this setup with my cast bullet benchrest gun and H-108 powder.

Froggie

[STAR4ever]

Prior to the development of the Harrell type measures which are themselves a development of the Culver types, the B&M pretty much ruled the benchrest roost. The ultimate iteration of that was to take a micrometer head (Starrett or other quality manufacturer) and put it in a properly dimensioned brass tube to make the drop tube. As has been stated, this aint very fast, but accurate? You'd better believe it. I still use this setup with my cast bullet benchrest gun and H-108 powder.

Froggie

Oh My.... H108, nice... I have only one 8# jug left. Use it in my Cast Bullet Schuetzen breach seated bullet rifle, chambered in 32 Dell. (38 Maximum case is the donor). There were only a few of us here in the NorthEast that got on the H108 bandwagon. Boy that powder meters perfectly. I have not seen any for sale since 2007 ish time frame. After that it will be time to experiment again... ah the joy.

[Kevin Rohrer]

There are always several B&M measures on Ebay. They go for $55-75.

[Green Frog]

Oh My.... H108, nice... I have only one 8# jug left. Use it in my Cast Bullet Schuetzen breach seated bullet rifle, chambered in 32 Dell. (38 Maximum case is the donor). There were only a few of us here in the NorthEast that got on the H108 bandwagon. Boy that powder meters perfectly. I have not seen any for sale since 2007 ish time frame. After that it will be time to experiment again... ah the joy.

Hi Art,

I'm using my carefully hoarded supply of H108 for benchrest events in ASSRA matches. It goes through a Charlie Dell-built Peregrine in .32-357 that he chambered as tight as any he ever built... it won't take brass from other Dell rifles I (including the one he built for himself) without FL resizing. I usually shoot 185 gr. pseudo-Hudsons or 200 gr. Barnetts cast from pure lead and tin at 25:1 with either formed StarLine .357s or some of those nice RWS cases from the 5.6 X 50R cases that seem to last forever.

I put in an group order for 48# of H108 about 2006 or so and got the last 4 kegs that Powder Valley had... I still have about 15# or so of it and at 11.5 gr per shot, should be able to continue using it for a long time.

Regards,
Froggie

PS Some of the other ASSRA guys have been talking about suitable replacements, but I haven't paid that much attention yet since those powders may become unavailable by the time I actually need them!

[Newtire]

Wow, that Vega Tools measure looks like a winner.

I changed the return spring in my B & M from the heavy one that was in there to a little lighter one and now like it much better. I don't use anything else unless I'm loading shotgun shells and have even used it then.