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Thread: My homemade black powder

  1. #1681
    Boolit Master
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    Dam Indian Joe you taught me a lot about sulfur & I thank you my friend about that. We never stop learning.

    Fly

  2. #1682
    Boolit Master
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    Thanks Indian Joe, I'm trying to source my materials locally and have three or four feed stores in the area as well as the usual big box stores. I'll swing by them and see what's available for sulfur. Adding dirt (bentonite) to powder just doesn't seem right.
    The only reason I was going to use a 1 lb plastic jar for a tumbler is because I have them on the shelf, maybe I should save them for storing the different components and finial product and go with a PVC pipe tumbler. Still trying to get my ducks in a row before taking the plunge.

  3. #1683
    Boolit Bub
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    I got my sulfur and potassium nitrate from dudadiesel. Shipped to your door.
    10lbs kno3 17.99
    3lbs sulfur 5.50
    Shipping was reasonable I think

  4. #1684
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfmanjack View Post
    I got my sulfur and potassium nitrate from dudadiesel. Shipped to your door.
    10lbs kno3 17.99
    3lbs sulfur 5.50
    Shipping was reasonable I think
    Not bad prices I think - if you make your own charcoal you are under two bucks a pound
    I get nitrate for right on a dollar a pound, buying greenhouse grade fertiliser by the bag - but I pickup (easy I drive past the place regular)
    Sulphur in the feed store or garden shop - about $8 to $10 per kilo - again I pickup - have not tried hard on sulphur - probably could get that down to a third in bulk if I can find it right.

  5. #1685
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie2002 View Post
    Thanks Indian Joe, I'm trying to source my materials locally and have three or four feed stores in the area as well as the usual big box stores. I'll swing by them and see what's available for sulfur. Adding dirt (bentonite) to powder just doesn't seem right.
    The only reason I was going to use a 1 lb plastic jar for a tumbler is because I have them on the shelf, maybe I should save them for storing the different components and finial product and go with a PVC pipe tumbler. Still trying to get my ducks in a row before taking the plunge.
    The plastic jar should be ok - downside of the bigger PVC jar is the quantity of ball needed to make it work.

  6. #1686
    Boolit Buddy fishingsetx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg G. View Post
    Here are my questions, would it be possible to use a plastic 1 lb smokeless powder jar for a ball mill?

    Fly is right on this, it is what I use to make smaller batches.
    Would work fine, but not sure how it would last. I use a harbor freight dual drum rock tumbler. The canisters are smooth rubber with no paddles and it pulverizes just fine. I replaced the crappy belts with a better one purchased from a local belt place and have zero complaints about the tumbler. I use it for powder and polishing brass (SS Pins).

    Fly recommended cutting a 1/2" copper tube into 1" sections, filling with lead and hammering the ends for tumbling media. This workes AWESOME! Much better than lead balls.

    As for sulfur, an MSDS is your friend. A lot of garden sulfurs are sulfates, sulfites, etc. Pure sulfur will be bright yellow, will not dissolve in water, almost neutral PH, and take a long time to break down in the soil. SRB (sulfur reducing bacteria) in the soil are required to break it down. If it will dissolve in water, it is not pure sulfur. Even the bentonite mix shouldnt dissolve. I have a practically limitless supply at work (we burn sulfur to make acid), but if I didnt, id be shopping the ag places and checking MSDS's.

    I get my salt peter from tractor supply. Its labeled as stump remover and is on the shelf by the chain saws. Its a bit expensive, but its quick, easy, and on my way home. Again, check the MSDS as some "stump removers" are sodium bisulfite and not KNO3



    Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it. - Mark Twain

  7. #1687
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfmanjack View Post
    I got my sulfur and potassium nitrate from dudadiesel. Shipped to your door.
    10lbs kno3 17.99
    3lbs sulfur 5.50
    Shipping was reasonable I think
    I get mine at Duda Diesel too... picked up in person! I'm glad they're nearby.

    Btw, I use copper plated .45 bullets as tumbling media.

  8. #1688
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tracy View Post
    I get mine at Duda Diesel too... picked up in person! I'm glad they're nearby.

    Btw, I use copper plated .45 bullets as tumbling media.

    Now I like that idea. It was somewhat of a pain to fill the copper with lead and then cut into pieces, not to mention the mess it made of my band saw.
    I am the one your mom warned you about!

  9. #1689
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    Well what about when the bass wears off the steel & it will. Steel on steel can cause sparks. Then BOOM.
    The copper tube is cheaper than a new shop?

    But that's just me, do what you think is OK. Fly

  10. #1690
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fly View Post
    Well what about when the bass wears off the steel & it will. Steel on steel can cause sparks. Then BOOM.
    The copper tube is cheaper than a new shop?

    But that's just me, do what you think is OK. Fly
    Steel? Who said anything about steel? I am talking about FMJ lead bullets. I was given a couple of pounds that were damaged and this would be a good use for them. I was using them for grapeshot in the cannon, but milling might be a better use.
    I am the one your mom warned you about!

  11. #1691
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    Sorry my mistake, I thought you guys were talking copper coated steel cases like some of the Russian ammo.

    My mistake, I showed my butt (wink) Fly

  12. #1692
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    Quote Originally Posted by fishingsetx View Post
    Would work fine, but not sure how it would last. I use a harbor freight dual drum rock tumbler. The canisters are smooth rubber with no paddles and it pulverizes just fine. I replaced the crappy belts with a better one purchased from a local belt place and have zero complaints about the tumbler. I use it for powder and polishing brass (SS Pins).

    Fly recommended cutting a 1/2" copper tube into 1" sections, filling with lead and hammering the ends for tumbling media. This workes AWESOME! Much better than lead balls.

    As for sulfur, an MSDS is your friend. A lot of garden sulfurs are sulfates, sulfites, etc. Pure sulfur will be bright yellow, will not dissolve in water, almost neutral PH, and take a long time to break down in the soil. SRB (sulfur reducing bacteria) in the soil are required to break it down. If it will dissolve in water, it is not pure sulfur. Even the bentonite mix shouldnt dissolve. I have a practically limitless supply at work (we burn sulfur to make acid), but if I didnt, id be shopping the ag places and checking MSDS's.

    I get my salt peter from tractor supply. Its labeled as stump remover and is on the shelf by the chain saws. Its a bit expensive, but its quick, easy, and on my way home. Again, check the MSDS as some "stump removers" are sodium bisulfite and not KNO3



    Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it. - Mark Twain
    I use the copper tubing filled with lead as well, works like a charm.
    I cut the scrap tubing I had laying around with a tubing cutter. Drilled a piece of scrap wood so the tubing fit in the holes and then filled them with lead, easy peasy.

    Bob
    GUNFIRE! The sound of Freedom!

  13. #1693
    Boolit Buddy fishingsetx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hotfxr View Post
    Now I like that idea. It was somewhat of a pain to fill the copper with lead and then cut into pieces, not to mention the mess it made of my band saw.
    You cut the tubing, then fill with lead, not fill with lead then try to cut!!!! Mushroom the excess lead on the ends and you have your media.

    As for the copper plated bullets, id be worried about the plating wearing off and the soft lead contaminating the mix. I know soft lead balls dont work well at all! Now if they were copper jacketed instead of plated, you would be good to go.

    Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it. - Mark Twain

  14. #1694
    Boolit Master
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    Well I do as Bob does. It will last for years.

    Fly

  15. #1695
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    Quote Originally Posted by fishingsetx View Post
    You cut the tubing, then fill with lead, not fill with lead then try to cut!!!! Mushroom the excess lead on the ends and you have your media.

    As for the copper plated bullets, id be worried about the plating wearing off and the soft lead contaminating the mix. I know soft lead balls dont work well at all! Now if they were copper jacketed instead of plated, you would be good to go.

    Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it. - Mark Twain
    When the plating wears off I'll replace them. In fact that's why I used plated instead of jacketed: fmj bullets have exposed soft lead at the base.

  16. #1696
    Boolit Buddy fishingsetx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tracy View Post
    When the plating wears off I'll replace them. In fact that's why I used plated instead of jacketed: fmj bullets have exposed soft lead at the base.
    No prob here. Let us know how it goes. My tubing media has exposed lead on both ends! I do know it mills way better than the hard lead balls that were given to me. Not sure what the alloy is, but they are harder than any lead ive ever delt with!



    Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it. - Mark Twain

  17. #1697
    Boolit Buddy
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    I use an old Tumblr two canister tumbler and one of the Harbor Freight tumblers. I don't like the canisters on the HF one and the 2nd motor on the Tumblr is wheezing and gasping for breath. I have enough of the lead filled copper pipe pieces to load up almost two of the canisters. I have been using a mixture of those harder milling balls and the pipe sections. I have also found that after a couple years of milling powder, those .500 milling balls are just about .490 now, perfect size for any of my .50's. When shooting at a metal target at our shoots, they hit with an attitude that gets everyone's attention. I figured that I will continue to use the milling balls from time to time and since I had several (about 16 pounds) of the FMJ .45 bullets that are no good for shooting, I will use them in place of the milling balls to fill up the canisters, mixed in with the pipe pieces. I figure that given their irregular shape they will work better than the round milling balls and when they get to a point where they are ineffective for milling, grapeshot! Next time (if there is a next time) I decide to make more of the copper pieces I will definitely pre-cut the pieces (I have already drilled out a piece of wood to hole them) as Boz330 pointed out, and pour over them. Just trying to not waste anything and keep my powder making on the cheap, as always. It is kind of funny how someone like me who has a fair mechanical mind can bu unclear on the concept from time to time. Thanks for the advice Boz330.
    I am the one your mom warned you about!

  18. #1698
    Boolit Master
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    You know what is fun? Many of you guys knew nothing a few years back. But now the students have been exploring
    new ways to make powder. It is exciting to see the group expand & come up with new ideas. That's what made our
    great county what it is. Please never stop sharing your thoughts, for it will only make what we do better.

    Fly

  19. #1699
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fly View Post
    You know what is fun? Many of you guys knew nothing a few years back. But now the students have been exploring
    new ways to make powder. It is exciting to see the group expand & come up with new ideas. That's what made our
    great county what it is. Please never stop sharing your thoughts, for it will only make what we do better. Fly
    Fly, I knew less than nothing when I happened up this forum a little over 4 years ago. Thanks to the abundant help , tips, and advice, I have become one of the leading black powder experts in my county and the next one up. The only certified gunsmith left here calls me on a regular basis to find out how to fix muzzleloaders and when I show up at a shoot everyone lines up to play with my powder. I'm not all that smart nor am I all that talented. I owe my knowledge of the black powder dark arts to the folks here in this impossibly long thread. Thanks you all, and like Fly said to the new guys, keep on learning and sharing.
    I am the one your mom warned you about!

  20. #1700
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    Fly - I am one of those of which you speak - dont really know what was the trigger to get me doing this - maybe my stash of good powder running out - see I almost ran out of powder soon after I started shooting black (1989) - I still remember travelling my part of the country and buying every can of goex I saw in any gunshop I could find - then a friend from another club offered me a split deal to share 50pound bags of GoEx 5FA - he did the work - I took all I could handle and built a supply that lasted me most of 20 years (didnt shoot as much in later times either) - that stuff was real nice powder made in the Moosic plant but eventually we came to the end of it - what to do - Swiss is the good stuff but over 100bucks a kilo - Wano is out there available but I never liked it - anyway something set me going. I read all I could, first on a pyro forum then later found this place, as luck would have it we have willow growing on the farm - that was major - but attitude was part of it too - we (all of us humans) tend to overcomplicate things - and part of my approach the last several years to anything is look for the basic process - and here my thought was - well they did it in a cowshed in year1700 so the basic process is simple - just use the best ingredients you can find and do the basic process really well ... I made my first powder early 2015 - It shot clean and I was hooked !! .. I went to a major ML shoot in july that year and walked off the stage with three firsts shooting my flintlock against the caplock boys and using my own powder - that was screened powder not pressed and if I only shot muzzle loaders I dont believe I would change - last year I bought a chronograph and went to work testing it in cartridge rifles - made some pressed powder but that is so much more effort .. then just recently some of the guys here posted (or reposted) info on the ceramic coffee grinders - along the way Fly told me my pucks were too thick - that made sense cuz busting them up was my main headache - still is really. I have made a lot of stuff - screens, made my ball mill, press and dies for making pucks, made a workstand for the coffee grinder, still figuring something to bust up those pucks - some kind of a spiked roller affair (brass or aluminium) is rolling round in my head - I processed three kilos of dried pucks a few days ago - took most of an afternoon with the screening. Anyway at this point I can make powder thats right up close to Swiss in burn rate, shoots cleaner than any powder I ever used, we get good numbers over the chronograph. Theres a few tweaks left to find for sure but I know where to come to for info and ideas now so it will fall into lace easy I reckon.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check