My homemade black powder

[Hotfxr]

I have tried many times to set off BP with a single jack and anvil but to no avail. I have shot through a couple of containers of BP trying to set them off like tannerite, but again, no joy. Even with the old trusty 25-06 traveling at 3840 fps.

Of course even hammering C-4 won't set it off, even if it is burning. But a det cap from flash powder sure will.

[Vettepilot]

One hundred and sixty two pages!! And I've read every single post! But I can't remember where ball mills and media were covered. (I don't much care for the "search" function on this site...)

Anyone remember when/where/what page we talked about ball mills and media a lot??

Thanks!
Vettepilot

[Froogal]

One hundred and sixty two pages!! And I've read every single post! But I can't remember where ball mills and media were covered. (I don't much care for the "search" function on this site...)

Anyone remember when/where/what page we talked about ball mills and media a lot??

Thanks!
Vettepilot

I agree. It would be very helpful if someone could provide a condensed version, with just the facts.

[ButchC]

I agree. It would be very helpful if someone could provide a condensed version, with just the facts.

While I second (third?) that, I suspect it would be quite the undertaking to filter through 162 pages for all the gems. I hope someone proves me wrong though...

[Vettepilot]

Well, I think I accidentally made my ball mill jar too dam big. It's a beauty, but BIG! I made it out of 6" diameter tubing instead of the more normal 4". It's 6" x 10", and has 3 "trippers" as I call them glued inside.

I've cast up a ton of 1/2" x 1/2" copper tubing pieces filled with Wheel Weight lead for my milling media. Common wisdom says you should have your milling jar 1/2 full of grinding media, 1/4 full of product, and 1/4 of air space. At that, my monster jar is going to weigh a ton!!

My mill is (going to be) hell for stout and should turn it ok, but still...

I don't know if I should continue, and try out this jar, or "discretion being the better part of valor", make a smaller jar??

This project is a long stretched out deal, because until recently I didn't have any time to work on it. I can't remember why/what possessed me to make the jar so big. I made the decision quite some time ago though, as I've had the pieces to make it for over a year.

???

Vettepilot

[Vettepilot]

Guys, I don't know if this has been posted by anyone else. I just had some lime delivered to my farm and was talking to the fertilizer plant and asked if they had pure Potassium Nitrate. Why, yes, yes they do and I can buy 50 pounds of 99.8% pure KNO3 for under 25 dollars. I bought my last from Seed Ranch and 10# cost me 18+ dollars and it has gone up to $29.95. Just passing the word in case you live in farm country....

Yeah. I've got a farmer friend I went to high school with that I keep wanting to ask about this very thing. Trouble is I now live 8 hours away from his farm!!

Vettepilot

[Vettepilot]

Well, maybe my large milling jar isn't far off base after all. It has very close dimensions to the Thumbler Tumbler I just looked up. I like everything about that jar except the price, and that's probably where I got the idea for the dimensions of mine.


Vettepilot

[Vettepilot]

So here is this cool pipe closure I am going to use in a tumbler jar I made out of 4" PVC. This one I actually made for tumble cleaning brass cartridge shells.

However, I might also like to use this particular jar and it's closure for smaller runs of BP. My question to you all is, if I change that steel carriage bolt in the center out for one of bronze, do you think it would be safe to use?? (Also keep in mind my tumble media is lead inside copper tubing.) My first thought was a bolt made of brass, but it's a 3/8" carriage bolt and I can't find one in brass; only bronze.

So is there any chance of static discharge with a combination of PVC, lead, copper, and bronze going roundy round in BP mix??

Thanks,
Vettepilot

[MUSTANG]

VettePilot:

I made a Tumbling "Jar" out of a 3" Gray PVC Pipe for my Harbor Freight Tumbler. (Replaces the two rubber jars). I used rubber 3" rubber end caps without the stainless steel band that comes with them (Pressure grip onto PVC from the rubber only). I tumble brass in this with Steel Pins/Dawn Dish Soap/- works great for this application. Thinking about using it for making Black Powder; I have already begun grinding charcoal from woodstove to fine powder.

For the end caps see: https://www.homedepot.com/p/Fernco-3...-103/100372304

[freddyp]

I don't believe that black powder will detonate from a gun shot. You would need a tracer!

I didn't think it was possible either. A buddy of mine grabbed a can of Goex and had me shoot it with a 223. I was very surprised to see the giant smoke ball after pulling the trigger. He is on the bomb squad and said they get that to happen every time. Possibly a tiny spark is created when the bullet punches through the metal can and ignites the powder. He also showed me that Bullseye, 700X and 2400 detonate when you set them off with a blasting cap. It's very impressive to hear a pound of of either one of those powders go high-order.

[LAGS]

If I remember correctly from back when I was a mechanic.
Stainless bolts came in different grades, like 200 , 300 and 400 series.
The ones that a magnet would stick to , would be the ones that could spark.

[Vettepilot]

Couldn't find that 3/8" diameter carriage bolt in brass, but McMaster Carr does have it in bronze... That's what I'm wondering would be safe to use.

Vettepilot

[John McCorkle]

So here is this cool pipe closure I am going to use in a tumbler jar I made out of 4" PVC. This one I actually made for tumble cleaning brass cartridge shells.

However, I might also like to use this particular jar and it's closure for smaller runs of BP. My question to you all is, if I change that steel carriage bolt in the center out for one of bronze, do you think it would be safe to use?? (Also keep in mind my tumble media is lead inside copper tubing.) My first thought was a bolt made of brass, but it's a 3/8" carriage bolt and I can't find one in brass; only bronze.

So is there any chance of static discharge with a combination of PVC, lead, copper, and bronze going roundy round in BP mix??

Thanks,
Vettepilot

My metallurgy may be a bit foggy, but brass and bronze are both alloys of copper...brass is typically alloyed with zinc and bronze is alloyed with tin. You get all sorts of grades if both....and alloys containing aluminum and tin AND zinc and all sorts but end of the day all the alloys are non ferrous....bronze would fall in that non ferrous copper alloy too. Unless I'm way off base I believe a bronze bolt would be fine.

However, if someone here knows otherwise please speak up, I'd hate to be misinformed or have a misunderstanding about it and cause a kaboom in your nice tumbler

Sent from my moto g(7) power using Tapatalk

[Eddie2002]

I've been going with a mix of soft and hard lead round balls for my tumbler medium. Think I'm using about 2 dozen .45 and .50 caliber along with a few .69 caliber and three or four 2 oz lead fishing weights. So far the mix of sizes and shapes work great and really didn't cost anything since I had everything on hand.
All the sources I checked stated that copper, brass and bronze are classified as non sparking and safe to use around explosive atmospheres and gasses. I would think that aluminum would be way too light weight to be effective as a tumbler medium. Not sure if I would trust any type of stainless steel as a tumbler medium for BP, there are too many grades of stainless out there and some can spark under the right conditions.

I did a little research on Brazilian Pepper which I used for my last batch of charcoal and found that it is in the Sumac family which is interesting since other types of Sumac have been identified as producing good charcoal also. Don't know if I would recommend it since apparently the sap can be toxic like others in the Sumac family.

[Vettepilot]

Yeah, I agree with all that's been said. It agrees with the knowledge and experience I have. Thanks for the input!

One little nagging doubt relates to static electricity. Lead and PVC are quite good at creating and storing static electricity. Thanks why "shake and bake" powder coating of bullets works so well. So my worry about that center bolt is that, even if bronze, it might create a focal point for a static discharge inside the jar.

???

Vettepilot

[Vettepilot]

P.S. I know that it's been shown that a static spark can't light off black powder. (Supposedly.) But that's AFTER it's been treated with graphite, which serves to conduct the electricity over the surface of the granules.

A static discharge through a cloud of raw meal would be a very different thing I'm thinking...

Vettepilot

[Eddie2002]

Handle the PVC pipe with a damp piece of cloth to pull any static charge out or put a dedicated grounded wiper on the PVC pipe while it's turning. If you are worried about building up a charge in the raw meal put a bolt held in place with a nut through one end of the tumbling container and keep it grounded with a wiper or contact as it turns.


I went back and looked at the caps you are planing to use for the tumbler and setting up a wiper shouldn't be too much trouble to discharge any static if you use a regular nut instead of the wing nut on one cap.

[Hotfxr]

Wrap the head of the bolt with electrical tape and if you have it, finish it off with some shrink tube. That will take care of any metal sparks from the bolt. I would be more worried about static electricity from the PVC. I had a cabinet shop years ago and the guy who helped set up our exhaust system made everything our of PVC and ABS. The sawdust running through it caused so much static that it blew up one day. We solved it by wrapping the plastic with a grounded wire, but every time you got close to the pipe while it was running, the hair on our arms would stand up.

I might not remember correctly, but I think it was determined much earlier in this thread that static electricity will not light off BP.

[Firewize]

Great abbreviated description of the process. It's no wonder they blow up factories going to all THAT trouble.
But, they forget to put one thing in that we have more of than they do, and it is reflected above.
That key ingredient is................


(wait for it)...............................


Dumb Luck!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think you can KNOW too much, and cause yourself more grief- just ask the factories that involuntarily expanded operations and relocated to the other side of their property.

Seems like if you keep it small, you'll probably be less likely to find the "Illudium Q-36 space modultor" formula before finding the mix for good BP.
I'm going to give it a shot this summer, I hope.

Well said

[swamp]

I make 1 pound at a time. Make sure I mill all ingredients before measuring and then mill all together till well blended. Use as little moisture as possible to press. When working with powder that is all I do. Don't multi task. When you are cooking, cook. Don't do something else.
swamp