bp gun cleaning

[cajun shooter]

Big Ted, I have yet to find any firearm that is leaded that a barrel plugged with Kroil inside won't help. I wish you had someone who was close enough to help out first hand. AS KW said there are so many people that don't even shoot BP that will give advise. I have had several jump in on the SASS and Cas City forums that are telling BP shooters that they only need the soap and water all the time. It was done over a hundred years ago and we have better things to use in this day and time. I think you should try the Kroil if you have not done that yet. The big cases are totally different and that is where I will step away as I have no time with them. KW has years of experience in that area and would be one of my first people to seek out. You might not like his answers but they will the truth.

[bigted]

i could certainly use the truth and i dont see that ive been turned away from it on this forum...unlike others where i have gone to solicite info. im still kinda sound in the head so i take with a grain of salt the advice on other forums that begin with "i dont have" or "ive never shot" or "if it were me even tho i dont" ...these kinda posts just cause me to flick past without reading the whole thing as they are full of armchair advise without any experience to back up their theory.

at least when charlie [ who seems to like to UN-CANDY-COAT his advise] and don mcd as with kenny wasser and doc hiwall write something i can take it for real and think that these and people like em have been down the road before me will not steer me down a bumpy road.

i bounce around some but it all comes back somehow for the education im recieving here. i have experimented with stuff that peeks my interest and just plain sounded like fun with payoffs that are huge for me. the "patched ball" thing was informative and i did come away with the kind of accuracy i was looking for [minute of rabbit head at 25 to 35 or so yards] and had a blast doing it...maybe the ball shooting can be simpler but now i know firsthand that a patched roundball inside a 45-70 case will work well without any lead touching the barrel or case.

i also recieved a ruger #1 [also 45-70] with the 45-120 trade but it will set for awhile till i get some bag made with this 120 beast. i also have ashamedly shot the j-words thru this hiwall 120 with mingled interest and this is why sir i used the amonia cleaner to swab out all the leftover copper for sure.

a question here is about the "butches bp cleaner" tho. ive never used this in anything so am wondering if the potion in it takes the lead n burnt powder out like is advertised? also "kroil"? this is the first place ive heard of its use....yes im under a rock...tyvm.

[montana_charlie]

also "kroil"? this is the first place ive heard of its use....yes im under a rock...

Kroil is "Krano Kroil" and it is primarily a penetrating fluid. It is also found in spray cans, and that is called AreoKroil.
http://www.kanolabs.com/

As a penetrant, it is believed to have the ability to work under leading...getting between the lead and the steel...to help in pushing the lead fouling out of the bore with a tight patch.

Pure gum turpentine has a similar ability, so some use that instead of Kroil when deleading a bore...and sometimes it's easier to find locally.

The thing about removing lead with 'tight patches' is that the patch/jag combination is so tight it has to be driven through the bore with a mallet...or pounding the rod on the floor using the rifle as the hammer.

The mental image of that is truly frightening, but the method works and there is no damage to the gun.
It does require a quality cleaning rod...that's for sure.

CM

[bigted]

well i did finally discover what the cause is for the lead mining with this 120 barrel.

to begin it has a chamber that is some .100 of an inch too long. then the cases that started out as around .120 inch too short now are for sure .220 inch short in the existing chamber. the chamber is also around .0045 too large at the mouth of the chamber [rite behind the leed area]. so this poor barrel has seen its better days and its to the dumpster with the barrel to be replaced with either the 38-55 green mountain barrel or the 45 cal badger barrel that ill chamber for the 110 cartridge with a more "proper" chamber.

so i say ho hum and lessons learned. ill stop the passing along of this *** and "fix it" before it ever leaves my hot hands.

also thanks Charlie for the tip about the turpentine. ill find some to keep on hand and ill also find some "kroil" to keep on hand as well.

[smoked turkey]

bigted:
Just want to say that I have read and reread your posts and those replies to the various situations you found yourself in. This whole topic on proper cleaning was very informative to me. My reason for jumping in was that I wanted to compliment you on the way you responded to the other posts. I thought everyone did a great job of passing on information. I wanted to say this because on some posts big egos seem to get in the way of the discussion and I didn't see that here. I have no experience in this area so I'm just reading to learn.

[Crash_Corrigan]

I bought a new Winchester Mod 1885 BPCR rifle in 50-90 Sharps two years ago.

The firs cleaning revealed orange on the patch and less as I went along. I had never fired the rifle. Apparently the factory did but did not do such a great cleaning job on the bore.

Examination of the bore with a bore scope shows nothing now.

I use a blow tube here in the dry desert air. Upon firing 8 or 10 shots I run a patch with windex/vinegar thru the bore. It takes at least two patches to get out most of the crud. The third patch comes out reasonably clean and then I run a dry patch thru.

Then it is back to burning powder. Upon completion of the firing sequence I again clean the bore with windex/vinegar patches but I usually run about 5 wet patches thru the bore to enure major cleaning. Then I run thru a dry patch or two just to make sure it is clean. Then I soak a patch with Ballistrol and about 50% water and run that patch through the bore. Then I take a patch soaked in the same solution and wipe down the whole gun. Stock and all exposed metal.

The next day I run a dry patch through the bore and then a lightly REM OIL patch to protect the bore.

This rifle is only two years old but it looks as good as the day I got it.

[bigted]

charlie...wanted to thankyou again for the turpentine tip. recieved unto myself a can from the hardware store and as we speak the stuff is soaking in the barrel over the leaded breech area of my prize. i started to scrub the bore with patchs and got most out ... but not the stuborn hunks out this way. gave up on the scrubbing till later to allow the turpentine time to work under the lead deposites.

smells kinda good as well [ reminds me of my grandpas workshop used to smell like ] being better then shooters choice or any other amonia based cleaner.

read about the 50/50 mix [last post here] of windex/vinegar for swabbing bp out while shooting...does this clean down into the tight crevises of the rifling ? also does this affect the slight lead deposites ? these are the kind of tips that are dynamite for home doers like myself...keep em coming.

[bigted]

just wanted to revisit this post as i recently ran into a situation that has me grinning and a bit flabbergasted!

went to the one n only gunsmith in my area that is doing work in a bonified shop to inquire about a project im having built...low n behold there on the shelf was a shiloh 50-2.5 rifle with a new pricetag on it. i handled it then handed it back with butterflies swarming.

after thinking about how i didnt need this rifle i promptly phoned the smith to inquire if there was a way to shoot it before a purchase...he allowed that NO WAY but that maybe he had some downloaded shells for his own private owned rifle and he would look for them...i told him that im only interested in bp loading when out of his mouth came this strange sentence;

"after having to clean so many guns...i dont want the headacke of messing with bp fouling"

now if this were 2 or 3 years ago i would have comiserated with him and let it drop...however this is NOT 3 years ago and my education is rather larger then back then. i now understand that a properly loaded bp shell shot in a quality rifle will clean up so much faster then any smokless that there is just no comparisson.

this coming from a supposed gunsmith kinda stalled me so thought id repeat it here...

another thing that further imposed this 'truth' is that i recently did a breakin of a newer barrel on a rifle with jacketed and smokless and this JOB further convinces me that im on the rite track...wowww what a mess to clean...dirty powder [3031] and the rather stuborn brass in the barrel to scrub out with each shot...glad when those 20 were done. nearly ran outta cleaning patches before this 'job' was done...but what a nice mirror bright shine afterwards in this bore...worth every agonizing sceond...now on to the bp rounds for this shooter.

just an update is all.

[Chas]

I cleaned my blued, Iver Johnson Safety Automatic, break top, .38 S&W last night after firing some black powder loads through it. The bullets I had cast in an old Winchester mold, lubed them with DGL lube, charged the cases with Goex. At the range after firing it, I had sprayed it with Ballistol and put it in a ziplock bag.
At home, I took off the grips and screwed off the cylinder. Rinsed it off with hot water from the kitchen tap and then sprayed it down with the dish detergent and water mixture in a spray bottle that I keep at the kitchen sink. Scrubbed the exterior where it needed it with an old toothbrush. Used a few strokes of a bronze bore brush on the bore with the dish detergent. I held on tight to it and swung it hard to get the excess water out of it, and then dried it as much as possible with paper towels (twisted one up from one corner and pulled through to dry the bore and chambers). It would be nice to have compressed air to get the excess water out. A few minutes in the toaster oven with it set at 150 degrees took care of the remaining moisture.
I put some silicone spray on the hard rubber grips and sprayed Ballistol on the rest of it. Then reassembled and put it back into its vented ziplock bag with its packet of desiccant. My usual wipedown cloth has a mix of pure liquid silicone and mineral oil. Old Mr. Johnson is 105 years old and he still looks good. I hope to keep him that way.