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I have a model 93 in 7 x 57 which I shoot using the old Rcbs 28 - 168 - FN boolit. The gas check is so far below the case neck when the boolit is touching the lands that it nearly blocks the primer orifice. Okay; maybe not that deep but it is a long slug. No problem that I am aware of.
Whenever I do my primary concern is powder sticking to the lube so I always use some dracon filler to stop powder migration.
I didn't answer your poll because the only two I gas check are 30-30 and 8mm Mauser - and the bullets I use do not require being seated below the bottom of the neck. It was interesting reading the responses though in case I should ever need to.
In my opinion there are some cases where seating the check below the neck are fine, such as seating the check, then powdercoating over the check and then sizing. But thats only if the check is held on tight and square. Alot of the designs i use for 7.62x39 seat the check so the top rim of the gas check is only engaged about .005 into the neck. So far i havent seen signs of an issue. However in standard lube i would try to avoid it for reasons already stated. Id be more curious to know how having a bullet using up case capacity and sticking into the case may change pressure and how the powder burns. Does it put pressure on the base of the bullet or does it cause the flame front to create a venturi when the bullet exits the neck. But this is all just an opinion, no facts or data to back any of it.
I figure that on a revolver, even though it is a straight case, the boolit has to go through the forward part of the chamber along with the blowby and then into the forcing cone, and they are still attached at the target, I think they should make it through a rifle case just fine. Never heard of it being a problem on revolvers.
I used to be a bit nervous when in had to seat checks below the neck .
Untill a few years ago a friend and I spent three or four weekends shooting into a big snow bank .
A few weeks after the snow melted I found about 200 of the cast bullets we had shot on the ground .
Every single one still had the gas check attached .
I don't give it a second thought now .
I load and shoot a lot of 300 Savage using the 311332. Gas check sits below neck for most cast bullets, very good accuracy with 18 grs 5744, under 2MOA at 200 yards, close to MOA at 100yds. Also same bullet in 308's with gas check just past neck to work through magazine of Savage 99, slightly better accuracy than my .300's. Using Alox-beeswax 50-50 or 45-45-10, no problem with ES or SD due to powder degradation. I do avoid very soft lubes with vaseline, other 'oily' stuff.
I seat boolits below the neck in my 358 Norma mag and it loves them. They are normally lubed and gas checked, loaded to around 2k fps. No leading and good accuracy--or at least for me. Around 1 1/2" @ 100 yds.
Well, I tried to pull a gas check off of a sized bullet. I couldn't do it. Not even with a pliers. So I think I will be fine.
I will not load a gas check below the cartridge case neck. People do it and have no trouble, but I see this as a huge potential safety problem. One gas check which becomes detached could cause a chamber obstruction with possible dire results. I see no reason to take such chances with reloading.
I seat them in the neck how else are they going to protect the lead from the heat etc?its easy enough with 223/308/3030 or am I just over thinking it?
Definitely overthinking it, the temperatures within the case are high but integrated over the time that it takes for the bullet to move out of the case the thermal flux isn't going to be anywhere near enough to melt the alloy. If it were you'd have a lot of guys here lamenting it.Quote:
Originally Posted by robg
Have you found any reports of such a thing ever happening?Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfswithwolves
I doubt a gas check would ever be able to act as a bore obstruction even if it beat all the odds and ended up partway down the barrel.
Really would have to be quite the sequence of events in order for it to end up there anyways, it would have to become detached, then end up behind the powder column such that it wouldn't be blown out of the case, nor would it remain in the case, but only partially make it down the bore? Sorry, I just don't see that happening.
There may be some rare exceptions, but I've yet to see any safety, accuracy, or leading problem with seating gas checked bullets below the case neck. I wouldn't use anything but the Hornady crimp on-type checks.
I check the tension on an installed gas check before I load it. My favorite rife is a .308 Vanguard, so I have to seat the gas check below the neck on several bullets.
One think to think about, when that powder ignites, it forces the gas check against the bullet until it is out of the barrel, with a lot of pressure. I would worry about a loosely fitting gas check that fell off in the cartridge before it was fired.
I also worry about powder being exposed to bullet lube. Any bullet that must be seated below the neck is powder coated or hi tek coated to prevent any powder reaction to bullet lube.
Mr. Peregrine- You are likely correct, and I do not mean to force others to load just as I do (this is America after all). I will continue to avoid loading gas checks outside of the cartridge neck however as I choose for my loading to remove any factors which I personally would worry about.
I rather like being called Mr.Peregrine. :)
I certainly understand where you're coming from, I prefer to keep the checks in the neck as well.
However if that's all I did i'd be seriously limited in the weight and style of bullets I could load in specific calibers, and it would preclude me from using some of my favorite loads that i'd rather miss.
But yes, do whatever works for you. However know that if you ever have the opportunity to deviate from that you likely can, my only real concern is lube and powder mingling hence only seating with the checks below the neck when I have a filler separating them.
There are times when it has to be done, 8mm Maximum in every 8mm I ever tried it in, just about everything in 7.5 Swiss K31. but have never had a problem.
I try not to but I have on occasion. I don't remember ever having a problem.
I also prefer not as many years ago I found a Lyman slip on GC still in the fired 308W case after testing some deep seated 311284s.........
Thus, if I do absolutely have to seat a GC so the top is below the shoulder/neck junction, I will only do so with tight, well crimped on Hornady GCs.......no old slip on Lyman's and no home made ones which don't crimp on either. I never got excellent accuracy seating any cast bullets below the case neck anyway.
You could drive a gas check half way down the barrel with a wooden rod and it would not cause a obstruction. While not on the base of a bullet it's to flimsy to hold any pressure.