BPC Rifle bore care ???

I shoot a Browning BPC Highwall in 45-70. I am fairly new to this black powder cartridge shooting. Recently at a match one of the other shooters told me I should be using Ballistol on my bore after final cleaning. He claims it protects the bore of a BP rifle better than many of the normal gun oils that contain petrochemicals. Something about black powder barrels developing a seasoning, and ballistol protects this seasoning. I do use ballistol as a general lubricant and in the bores and cylinders of my revolvers, but they are smokeless powder, not black.
Should I be using ballistol on the bore of my 45-70?? Pros vs Cons??

Use what works for you. Ballistol is a very good product. but there are as many recommendations on what to use on your rifle as there are shooters.

There are many different lubes that work to protect a rifles bore. I have used Balistol, Kroil. Barracade, Sheath, light oils and various bore cleaners. They all work for me so I just use whichever one is handy when I am cleaning my rifle. I will say that I regularly use a 50-50 mix of Balistol and water to clean my rifle but usually follow it up with a patch with Kroil on it to see if I got any lead in the bore. If non shows up I usually wipe the bore with a loose clean patch and leave it at that. Even products that contain petrolium products do not seam to affect my rifles bore and as for cleaning they usually wipe clean with one or two patches at the end of the day.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Moondawg

I shoot a Browning BPC Highwall in 45-70. I am fairly new to this black powder cartridge shooting. Recently at a match one of the other shooters told me I should be using Ballistol on my bore after final cleaning. He claims it protects the bore of a BP rifle better than many of the normal gun oils that contain petrochemicals. Something about black powder barrels developing a seasoning, and ballistol protects this seasoning. I do use ballistol as a general lubricant and in the bores and cylinders of my revolvers, but they are smokeless powder, not black.
Should I be using ballistol on the bore of my 45-70?? Pros vs Cons??

---

the main thing your looking for is to protect the metal surfaces from the harmful salts developed with the use of black powder...[not subs...don't know much about them].

there are....as has been suggested...many ways to skin this cat but i agree with whomever told you that ballistol is a very good product to use for cleaning most anything ... including bp fired weapons. i use a mix of 25% ballistol///75% water in all my bp guns. it removes the fouling lickety split and then the residue left over has enough of the ballistol that it oils as has been mentioned.

i finish up with a bore protecter like 'bore butter' to seal off the air to the cleaned finish of my bore. i have never had rust stains develop with this care and i will continue with my regimen till something better comes along. my revolvers that i shoot bp in clean up well with such a mix when sprayed on and soaked for a bit then immersion in a warm/hot water bath with the scrubbing with a nylon brush both inside and out....then drip dry and spray down generously with rem gun oil in an aerosol can....when im done they are exceptionally clean and dripping oil from the spray inside the action and out...a wipe down and they are ready for storing till i have need of them again.

so a long winded answer is YES the ballistol works well in bp fouled arms!

Cleaning is easy if the bore is good. Just plain water works well, or Ballistol and water, or Windex with Vinegar (not regular Windex or anything with ammonia), or even antifreeze and water. The important ingrediant is water to dissolve and remove the rust causing parts of the residue. Follow with dry patches and then a decent oil - I use Ballistol or Ed's Red with lanolin. Cleanup is actually easier than for my smokeless powder rifles. Removing leading is another issue but not usually difficult.

Jerry Liles

A lot of people think that black powder residue is corrosive in its own right but that is not true. What it is is hygroscopic which means that it attracts moisture. The water in the moisture is what causes rust in a black powder rifle. So what you need to do is remove the fouling so it wont attract moisture then put something on the metal to avoid moisture condensation from starting rust. Most light oils, balistol, bore butter, and many other products work just fine. I have also heard that you should not use petrolium products in BP rifles. this is true for lubes but to protect the bore it is not true as the oil residue leaves with the first shot. As I have never seen a BP rifle that will shoot the first shot from a clean barrel into the same place as subsequent ones I always fire a foulig shot before I start shooting for group or score.

NICKSS...as a beside to this thread i wanted to write of a strange thing that happened to me concerning the clean-bore shot compared to the rest of the group. i loaded for my browning bpcr a 520 gr lyman lubed with my lube over 70 grains 2f goex and sparked with a cci #200 lr primer inside a Winchester case with a .080 card wad over powder.

my surprise came when after the clean-bore shot and a spit ball thru the bore i shot the second shot expecting it to be lower and to the left as usual but SHAZAM...it cut the first hole. the third shot following another spitball made this a clover-lief cluster. after 5 of these spit-ball shots i stopped to recon what was going on as i had never NEVER had this kinda accuracy with this rifle. this was the first time i had loaded the boolit out to touch the rifling. in a general grown-up and distinguished fashion i lept to my feet and proceeded to do a small jig around my spot on the firing line.......looking up i see three or four gawking folks looking at the deranged feller making all the smoke n such. some were guarding their young from exposing them to such an array of unbridled ecstasy.

anyway just wanted to allow that for some UN-justified reason ... this rifle will shoot this load to point of aim every time i need it to at least at the 100 yard line....with the clean/oily bore shot being in the same group as the rest. i find this to be exhilarating as ive always wanted a load to do so for hunting purposes.

then as always i clean with my ballistol mix and finish with the squeaky clean bore and add a messy bore-butter patch for the transport home and back on the wall

not trying to undermine your statement...just wanted to brag some about my find...UN-likely as it may be...i'll take it and grin and maybe next time i shoot this kinda group i will try to kinda restrain myself from scaring the women n chillin at the range.

Quote:

---

Ballistol is a very good product

---

* Ballistol is primarily mineral oil and alcohol. In the long run (weeks) has been proven to be one of the worst rust preventatives.

Ballistol MSDS
* pharmaceutical white oil: CAS RN 8042-47-5; Mineral oil
* Oleic acid: CAS RN 112-80-1
* C-5 alcohols: CAS RN 78-83-1; Isobutyl alcohol
* CAS RN 137-32-6; 2-Methylbutyl Alcohol
* CAS RN 100-51-6; BENZENEMETHANOL (9CI)
* different essential oils to perfume Ballistol

*

Quote:

---

... harmful salts developed with the use of black powder

---

Ted ... name these harmful salts. Believe you better learn what is in the foul of BP! The major percentage in the foul of black powder is potassium bicarbonate - potassium sulfide and charcoal. None are salts

Ok, all BPC shooters, if you can better this - Show Me!
The 38-55 was shot for 50 consecutive rounds with no blow tubing or patching and no degradation of accuracy. Here's what one water and 3 dry cotton balls looks like that cleaned the bore of that rifle ...
http://i222.photobucket.com/albums/d...1/DSC00399.jpg

If ANYONE has a better picture of what they use to clean BPCR's- post it because pictures don't lie

Further, for a rust preventative, lubricant and cleaner, the product is Eezox - proven by independent test and myself as the best rust preventative there is ...
Eezox Rust Prevention Test - for 9 Months!
Plus it does an excellent job as a cleaner & lubricant

John Boy, I agree with you 100% as I have been using EEZOX since you performed your steel wool saltwater test on the shore.
I do believe however that Ted advised that he only cleaned with Ballistol and after he used bore butter.
I don't think that Bore Butter even comes close to being as good as Eezox but everyone has some other favorite.
I just received a order of EEZOX this week as I get nervous when my supply gets down to 2 cans left.
I have shown several people in SASS the advantage of Ezox but some people think you are selling snake oil. I had one guy tell me that he put it on his gun and then it dried up and went away. I tried to tell him that is the way it is designed as it is a dry lube that is there even if you can't see it. My last thing to do after cleaning my guns is to run a EEZOX soaked patch down the bores. Later David aka Fairshake

srry there john boy...didn't mean to ruffle feathers with the salt thing...im no chemist but i know what ive seen and bp residue collects rust the same as any salted metal ive seen...may not be salt but collects rust the same and if i made a mistake i firmly opoligize for stepping outta line.

here is my meaning PLAIN AND CLEAR...BALLISTOL WORKS VERY WELL ON BLACK POWDER FOULING FOR CLEANING....PERIOD... i believe this was the original question so now allow me to humbly slide away!....dh

Quote:

---

... im no chemist but i know what ive seen and bp residue collects rust the same as any salted metal ive seen...

---

Ted, I'm no chemist either. But I do know this: The BP foul comprised of potassium bicarbonate, potassium sulfide and charcoal will not rust a bore - unless the foul is exposed to moisture which forms iron oxide that turns into rust

And to prevent any slight rust from forming in the bore it is always best to run a patch of good rust prevention chemical as the last patch.

As for the capability of Ballistol to be a good rust preventative, you might want to read the results of this independent test of various chemical compounds ...
Corrosion Protection Products
As the article says ...

Quote:

---

Bottom Line--Eezox and Corrosion-X Are Superior
Use Eezox or Corrosion-X to coat your firearms. Eezox has the advantage that it goes on wet, but protects dry. Corrosion-X works nearly as well, is easy to apply, and is widely available. BreakFree works very well but starts to fade after repeated extreme exposure. However, we still like BreakFree because it penetrates into recesses better than almost anything else, and it is a very effective lubricant, not just a rust preventitive. You can also use thicker coverings like Rig Grease, Military Cosmoline, or even Petroleum Jelly, but these are messy to apply and a pain to remove.

---

Then go back and read the Eezox 9 Month experiment I did. This test made me a believer in the product. And if there is a better product on the market, anyone, do a test of it with pictures for 9 months and compare the results to the Eezox test

I also did a comparative test between Eezox and Boeing's Fluid Film ...
Rust Prevention Test: Eezox v Fluid Film. You be the judge of the winner

Ted, don't slide away yet !:grin: Yes, Ballistol will clean BP fouling. But is it the best chemical to do the job? Over the decades going back into the 1800's, thousands of BP shooters have used plain water with excellent results. They all can't be wrong.
And if you are looking for one product that cleans - lubricates and is a rust preventative - give Eezox a try. Believe you will be very pleased with the results as I was when I first used it and have continued to use it

According to the "Mad Monk" the primary corrosive portion of BP fouling is potassium carbonate. Above a relative humidity of 30% it is hygroscopic and will produce an electrolyte solution that will cause surface rust of ferrous metal with a uniform film. The potassium sulfate produced doesn't cause corrosion. By the way potassium carbonate is a salt, just not table salt. It can be produced by the reaction of potassium hydroxide, a relatively strong base, with carbonic acid, a weak acid. The product of an acid-base reaction is a salt.

The primary solid product of BP combustion is also Potassium carbonate at about 3-4 times the amount of sulfate and other, minor, components. Since it is hygroscopic above 30%RH powder fouling will tend to be soft or moist on humid days (Like John Boy's 66RH above) and fouling management will be relatively easy. Below 30%RH it can get really hard and require a lot of breath moisture from a blow tube or frequent use of the cleaning rod. Some of the best, old time powders, had a small percentage of creosote in the charcoal which also helped produce "moist" fouling even at low humidity.

Jerry Liles

kewl...im larnin by leaps n bounds....as for the slinkin thing...naa think ill stay 4 a-while. i will try the Eezox tho as im fairly open to new stuff to try. if it makes my life any easier then im in.

i do know that my spit balls thru the bore clean very well and when im thru shootin the final cleaning is easy...cheesy. if this Eezox is better then my ballistol then i may switch but it will have to go some for the cleaning and i never depend on the ballistol for storing my spendy rifles...i always use the bore butter or rem spray oil for storing em away....id never take a chance on rusting at all...not even slightly...of my hard earned rifles or other fire-arms.

as for the salt thing...one says yes it is a form of salt...another feller says no...no salt! all i know for sure is that salt or no salt... i clean spick-n-span then oil for the storage....and im still no chemist...LOL.

Ted, I use Ballistol all the time for cleaning my black powder guns. I mix my moose milk with a 7-1 parts of water and Ballistol. In other words 2 oz of Ballistol with 14 oz of water. I see a lot of people use a 10-1 mix but I feel this is to light. If you try mixing it any stronger, it will not stay mixed with the ballistol floating on top.
The great thing about Ballistol when it is used for cleaning is that it may be sprayed all over the gun including the wood with out worry. I put it in a commercial style hand sprayer purchased from home Depot. Spit nor water contain any oil and Ballistol does. If you have water get into a spot that is not cleaned and dried you will have rust.
Water works but Ballistol is so much better and safer.
EEZOX is a product that I use after the cleaning with the Ballistol. It is a synthetic oil that is one of the best products I have used in my 64 years. It drys soon after application and appears to be gone but it is in a dry film stage which is what makes it so nice to use. I wipe all the metal parts down and run a patch down the bore before storing. If you need some convincing to purchase just look at the test done by John Boy that was posted on this forum. Later David

How do you remove the Eezox before you shoot? I know that if you have any oil left in the bore that my gun takes several rounds before it will group.

I've been using Eezox ever since I read the corrosion prevention tests.I believe it was a couple years ago. I wipe the bore and every other metal part with Eezox after each use and have had no rust since. I do use dessicants and will probably buy some of those "bore stores" too. We are only custodians of these rifles for the next generations.

Bob