fireforming 30-30-38/55

anybody have any recipes for making fire-forming loads for taking the old 30-30 to 38-55 without using lead or projectiles. I have a ton of experience in the reloading and firearms field and was employed there during the 1980's. Unfortunately projectiles were usually supplied so when fire-forming to a different caliber was necessary I just did it with normal loads and cheap projectiles. Now I don't want to waste any lead so finding a recipe that I can use to fireform in the shop safely with is my objective. I have made the transition from 3030 to 3855 using expanders and sizing dies successfully but the cases come out real short. I think fire-forming will help retain some length. I'm thinking a small amount of fast/shotgun powder, but what to use for filler or a wad...thanks for whatever help I get...

I used Bullseye in Remington .30-30 cases and only about 50% of the cases blew out without wrinkles at the shoulder.
I will not repeat the charge I used because I was attempting to blow out the cases with no filler or bullet. The charge used was much higher than most people would think is safe.

Based on that experience I think you would need a wax plug or some sort of filler to insure the neck gets ironed out. You probably will need to work up your own fire forming load.

The next time I try such an exercise I think I will try stuffing plastic peanuts into the case mouths for a filler. If you try any sort of filler start it out on a rifle with a junk barrel if you have one.

One of the guys here mentioned that he expanded cases with a long tapered expander. If that works you could fire form the cases with cast bullet loads.

good reason to go to the range and shoot some lead and form completely
dig up your lead and make more boollits to shoot

i do 30 30 to 32 40 this way

My recipe when doing this was 10gr. of Unique and finish filling the case with Cream of Wheat, plug the end of the case with a wax plug. This recipe forms almost 100% of them. Be advised that the cases come out way short, if my memory serves me, after trimming to a square case end, about 2.000". Will it work, sure does, but not ideal. For all of the work involved, just makes the cost of new Starline Brass look cheap. Will fire forming work, sure will.
Chris

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Originally Posted by cwheel

My recipe when doing this was 10gr. of Unique and finish filling the case with Cream of Wheat, plug the end of the case with a wax plug. This recipe forms almost 100% of them. Be advised that the cases come out way short, if my memory serves me, after trimming to a square case end, about 2.000". Will it work, sure does, but not ideal. For all of the work involved, just makes the cost of new Starline Brass look cheap. Will fire forming work, sure will.
Chris

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I do this only use tissue instead of wax. If you use undersized cast bullets to blow out cases to a larger size. I hope you like cleaning a severely leaded barrel.

i take 30/30 brass and put 10 grs of B-EYE in the 30/30 case and fill it almost to the top with RICE CRISPIES, CREAM OF WHEAT, FARINA, PABLUM, you get it then insert the neck into a bar of IVORY SOAP, that soap is great be cause it is very firm and shoot it straight up into the air in my 32/40 and they come out ready to go, FIRE FORMED 32/40, just a tad short but it is not a problem.

I did it with 5 grains of Unique and cream of wheat with a short piece of crayon in the case mouth.

I use IVORY SOAP be cause first as said it is firm and any residue left after fire forming can be rinsed out with hot water and a brush. some use canning wax, but it leaves a lot of wax residue in the barrel and water doesn't touch it.

Thanks for the answers, not going to put food thru my rifle as it is intended for food gathering. I did talk to local gunsmith he said just use tissue and small amount of powder...and do it in 2 steps, fire twice to get it where I want...if I can get 2.0" I will be happy.

Once, years ago, I needed some .375 X 2 1/2 in. flanged. A .30-40 Krag with a slightly reduced rim was a fine but short parent case. I bought a box, turned the rim with drill and file, loaded the .375 up and steped to the door. Some of the case necks were crooked but all cases survived. Trimmed the cases square, loaded for .375 and seated the bullet for proper OAL and went shooting. That was 1970. Still using the same cases.

I typically use about 6.0 to 8.0 grains of fast shotgun or pistol powder (I've been using Nitro 100 lately since I have a quantity of that) a quarter sheet of toilet tissue over the powder charge, bulk yellow cornmeal up to the case mouth, and then another quarter sheet of toilet tissue to hold it all in place. They "snap" right out to straight very successfully and I've used this method to form .303 British into straight cases for my Lee Enfield No. 1 MK III in .410 Musket, and .30-30's into slightly short .32-40's and .38-55's. Then I finally broke down and bought a Kal Max Case Stretching Jig from Red River Rick out in Winnipeg so that I can stretch them out to full length.

http://i.imgur.com/FToT3vI.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/Emiz2p3.jpg

http://kal.castpics.net/CaseStretcher.html

iF YOUR USING OLD OR MANY TIMES RELOADED BRASS, YOU MAY WANT TO ANNEAL FIRST sry 5-10 grn pistol powder, cream or wheat to fill, twist of TP tissue to hold/handle, point straight up to shoot.
One shot and done

shooting straight up is the only method, the atmospheric pressure increases the resistance to the load, works every time.

Pointing the muzzle straight up into the air yields a case that is pretty much square to the chamber, while cases fired horizontally tend to end up being a bit "lop sided" and not square to the chamber. Plus it's fun to watch the shredded toilet tissue and cornmeal come drifting back down like confetti. It makes it a shooting party!

:lol:

8 gr Herco did the job with a wad of tissue...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Reverend Al

Pointing the muzzle straight up into the air yields a case that is pretty much square to the chamber, while cases fired horizontally tend to end up being a bit "lop sided" and not square to the chamber. Plus it's fun to watch the shredded toilet tissue and cornmeal come drifting back down like confetti. It makes it a shooting party!

:lol:

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Absolutely fire vertically, I used unique, don't recall the load. Ten sounds right. On top of the powder was a quarter square of toilet paper then the nibs from under a friend's grain drier with another quarter square of TP. Looked like an explosion at a confetti factory after a hundred rounds. I used once fired range find Remington brass. After going to firing vertically I lost zero pieces of brass.

I bought new Starline 38/55 brass. I'm not exactly over-burdened with 30/30 brass to convert.