Slug accuracy thoughts

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10-08-2018, 11:56 AM
bikerbeans

Slug accuracy thoughts

After launching several hundred 260g LWNPB slugs with my 410 +P+ Marlin lever gun i am finally getting decent hunting accuracy. What finally became clear to me is reloading this 410 like it is cast boolit rifle does NOT work. The faster burning powders like SR4759 and I4198 fail because of the long forcing cone. The boolit (slug) in a roll crimped hull must travel 0.7" before engaging the rifling. The faster the powder the more velocity the boolit had when it engaged the rifling and tries to start spinning. My proof of this is watching groups become patterns as i increased the powder charge.

Couple weeks ago i switched to medium burn rate powders and accuracy immediately improved. I now have one load that will shoot less than 2" @ 100 yards. A lot more testing and load workup is needed before i hunt with this 410, but i can see the light at the end of the tunnel. I just hope the light isn't on the front of Casey Jones locomotive.

I have a target pic but i wrote the load data on it and i ain't smart enough to redline a photo.

BB
10-08-2018, 12:52 PM
megasupermagnum

When it comes to revolvers, they have the same long jump. The guys that get the really good accuracy claim a hard bullet and slow powder is the way to do it. Myself, I consistently get better accuracy with Blue dot than H110 in revolvers.
10-08-2018, 01:21 PM
bikerbeans

My slugs are WQ hardball alloy.

BB
10-08-2018, 02:18 PM
gpidaho

In comparing your 410 to rifle loads I've always found the slower powders to be a much better choice. Shoving the bullet (slug) into the rifling about .010" and letting the bullet slowly (relative) gain velocity in the bore usually works much better than slamming the bullet (slug) into the rifling with a jump and fast powder, it's a sure way to strip the rifling and you're back to a smooth bore and a mess to clean up. I'm speaking only from rifle experience BB, as you know more about slug shooting than I do but the right BHN of a projectile is very important also. It's as common to have pattern (group) problems with too hard an alloy as it is with one that is too soft. All this is easier to do with a rifle of course. The COL being much easier with a rifle chamber than a shotgun. Just more Jokers in the deck. Gp
10-08-2018, 03:57 PM
Drm50

I was heavy into slug business at one time. Ohio use to be slug only until 3 yrs ago. Me and couple
buddie's were always looking for the edge. We did 12g and 410. This was before rifled barrels. No
matter what we did with 12g we couldn't get any better results than Brenneke slugs. We used every
thing available, made sabots and patched slugs. Even brass casings. We had a Brit 303 rebarreled
with a smooth bore rifle barrel that had been bored and polished to spec. We had it chambered for
444 Marlin brass with 3/8" neck to crimp 41 cal bullets. We modified a 41 mold into a quasi Minnie
Ball. Poured them with pure lead and WW while experimenting. After all this our loads and gun shot
no better than a old Savage 24 with Brenneke slugs. In all our slug experiments the main thing the
slug requires is uniformity. Not only in the slug but in loading pressure, wads and shot cups. We didn't have a Marlin lever but I would be willing to bet that brass casings and uniform crimping of
the slug will tighten up groups considerably, reguardless of powder and charge. Rifled barrels put a
stop to our ongoing slug fest.
10-08-2018, 04:48 PM
Hogtamer

"less than 2" at 100 yds." That's not too shabby right there BB. Open or scoped sights?
10-08-2018, 05:19 PM
bikerbeans

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hogtamer

"less than 2" at 100 yds." That's not too shabby right there BB. Open or scoped sights?

Scope on 6x.

BB
10-08-2018, 05:35 PM
bikerbeans

This 410 project is something i want to do with a regular metal/plastic 410 hull. If i were to use all brass hulls it would create a problem because s 410 bullet would be way lose in the thin walled brass hull. Also finding dies for seating/crimping the brass might be a problem.

I have eliminated a number of the load variables.

No gas seal, fillets or wads are used.
Oversized bullet fits tight in the hull.
Loaded hull fits very snug in the chamber.
Each round is compressed to 60 pounds
Each round is immediately roll crimped after compression.
Bullet weights are +/- 0.5 grain.
Every boolit (slug) is carefully inspected before loading.
Boolits are unsized and pan lubed.

Another note, i do not shoot from a rest. I shoot standing using an elevated platform. My fighter pilot son generally can best my groups using my rifles and handloads by about 50%. I still classify the 410 marlin as experimental so he doesn't get to shoot it.

BB
10-09-2018, 03:10 PM
bikerbeans

1 Attachment(s)

Target pic

Attachment 228526

Figured out how to crop an image.

BB
10-09-2018, 07:36 PM
Hogtamer

That's outstanding. Make you some homemade shooting sticks just right for the chair you'll be sitting in.
10-09-2018, 08:45 PM
bikerbeans

HT,

I've got sticks but never take them hunting cause i prefer to sit on the ground. I do shoot a lot better sitting in a folding camp chair using sticks but i can sit still for much longer on the ground than in a chair.

BB
10-09-2018, 09:38 PM
Hogtamer

How do you fare when yo thin **** be froze to da ground BB? I likes my comfort and my naps!
10-09-2018, 09:58 PM
bikerbeans

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hogtamer

How do you fare when yo thin **** be froze to da ground BB? I likes my comfort and my naps!

HT,

I buy disposable hand, feet and body warmers by the case. I wear expedition grade base layer if the temp is below 40F. If the temp is below 20F i stay inside and nap on the couch.

BB
10-10-2018, 12:16 AM
gpidaho

Sitting on the ground while shooting will be over for a few months up here in a week or two. LOL. Gp
10-10-2018, 01:34 PM
MT Chambers

If you snooze here at this time of year you will prolly wake up dead.(Saskatchewan Canada).
10-10-2018, 04:03 PM
W.R.Buchanan

You's guys around Atlanta are getting a nice bath right now Huh? Panama City getting it pretty good right now on the News as of 4PM your time.

Stay safe,,, don't want to see any of you floating down the streets in boats or canoes on TV tonight or tomorrow .

Randy
10-10-2018, 05:30 PM
bikerbeans

Quote:

Originally Posted by MT Chambers

If you snooze here at this time of year you will prolly wake up dead.(Saskatchewan Canada).

I hate it when that happens!

BB
10-11-2018, 09:00 AM
centershot

Quote:

Originally Posted by bikerbeans

HT,

I buy disposable hand, feet and body warmers by the case. I wear expedition grade base layer if the temp is below 40F. If the temp is below 20F i stay inside and nap on the couch.

BB

It is safe to say that I am also guilty of all of the above!
10-11-2018, 10:00 AM
Hogtamer

BB, you know who will appreciate that gun if something happens...
Attachment 228671
Quite a likeness!Attachment 228672
Ole Hatxhet Jack would have appreciated some of those newfangled warmers! But then Jeremiah wouldn't have gotten his Hawken.
10-11-2018, 11:58 AM
bikerbeans

HT,

If my wife hadn't made me get a hair cut before our hog hunt i would have scared those piggies to death.

When i was younger (tougher) i had my beard freeze like that while hunting. Nowadays that weather finds me indoors. I am planning to hunt fox squirrels tomorrow and i am going in the afternoon when it warms up. Supposed to be near 40F tomorrow morning, i think i have grown a bit weak in me old age.

BB