How to soften pan lube

When I press the boolits out of the pan lube not enough is staying in the lube grooves. I think my mixture is too stiff. The original mixture from several years ago was 50/50 beeswax and parafin, but that was too stiff, so I added some Vaseline. Over time, it stiffened up again, so I added in some olive oil. It's stiffening up again, and I've had suggestions to add Lee Liquid Alox to it. I have four bottles that came with my push through sizing dies.

Good idea? Or is there something else I should try to keep the lube in the grooves when I push them out of the wax mixture?

Thanks in advance.

First, dont rapid cool the lube after you pour it in with bullets, let it cool slowly. This allows the bullets to heat up thoroughly to the lube temp, and seems to retain the lube better. Or preheat your bullets. I usually dont have to.

Second, take a spent shell casing of the proper caliber, and drill out the primer flash hole (or cut off the case head with a hack saw, thats what i did). Use it as a cookie cutter. Makes a nice clean cut and actually compresses the lube into the grooves a bit. Use a dowel, or a pencil, or something to push bullet back out through case mouth. When you get good, you can stand up every one for a final cure. I let them sit for a couple of hours for the lead to reach room temp. This all works beautifully with the 6661 lube.

Also, how far in advance are you lubing your bullets before you load them? Maybe try to load them sooner. Once they are seated in a case, it could take a decade (or more....or less... depends on lube and storage conditions) to dry out.

Credit for these ideas go to other members on this site. Lots of good ideas here. These work for me.

edit....... Let lube cool too room temp before cutting them out. But it prob does depend on the recipe you are using.

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Originally Posted by cpaspr

When I press the boolits out of the pan lube not enough is staying in the lube grooves. I think my mixture is too stiff. The original mixture from several years ago was 50/50 beeswax and parafin, but that was too stiff, so I added some Vaseline. Over time, it stiffened up again, so I added in some olive oil. It's stiffening up again, and I've had suggestions to add Lee Liquid Alox to it. I have four bottles that came with my push through sizing dies.

Good idea? Or is there something else I should try to keep the lube in the grooves when I push them out of the wax mixture?

Thanks in advance.

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Bullet temp is your friend when pan lubing, the lube I use will wick up the side of the bullet when the temp is correct. If you see it happen to one boolit, watch close and you will see it happen to the rest pretty quick. Also I agree with the use of a "cookie" cutter and letting the lube cool slowly. This creates a better adhesion to the lead. Hope this helps ya. Good casting & Safe shooting. - CASTER

Yes, I think it has to come down to temperature and the use of a cookie cutter to pull the bullets out. A cartridge case is good. I have seen... all right, bought... purpose-made bullet cookie cutters tapering down from rather thick aluminium, and they may cool the lube in the grooves excessively.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by cpaspr

The original mixture from several years ago was 50/50 beeswax and parafin, but that was too stiff, so I added some Vaseline. Over time, it stiffened up again, so I added in some olive oil. It's stiffening up again, and I've had suggestions to add Lee Liquid Alox to it. .

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Trying to make up a repeat batch of a lube which came into being by evolution rather than creation can be difficult. But this complexity does have one advantage. It is likely to spread the temperature range between too fluid and too hard. A lube made from just one or two substances can go from one to the other very quickly.

The wax used for a protective coating on cheeses is very useful, as it must never smear and never become brittle. It used to be only on Dutch cheeses, which are mostly horrid bland rubbery stuff, but plenty of small cheese factories are using it now.

Also, look up some lube recipes that incorporate soap in the mix. It is supposed to act as a binder, helps it to stick to bullet, and might make it less likely to dry out. Soap is also supposed to make it less messy. Search for 6661 lube. 6 parts paraffin, 6 parts beeswax, 6 parts unscented Vaseline, and 1 part ivory bar soap. Pretty close to the recipe you are using now. Works damn good for me.

To test a lube to see if it is too stiff I'll take a dab and hand lube some bullets. If it works it isn't too stiff. If it doesn't I'll add a little lanolin. To pan lube I always pre-heat the bullets. It's quick, it's easy, it's uniform. Whatever method you use to melt the lube be aware it has a limited life and needs to be totally replaced eventually. Every reheat "cooks" out essential compounds and changes the characteristics of the lube. Don't believe that? Then what's the odor you smell every time you re-heat?
Definitely let the lube cool at room temperature. Don't put it in the frig or freezer. Slow is better.
Some lubes harden nicely and you can pop the bullets out of the cake (i.e. SPG). A cookie cutter is much better. I use a fire-formed case that had an oversized primer pocket. The cutter leaves a little excess which is beneficial if you size your bullets.
Experiment, test, write it down, learn and then share the successes AND the failures with others so they can learn too.
HAVE FUN.

the mineral oil in the vasoline evaporates a little over time.
just add some more or some more vasoline.
lot's of lubes harden up over time and re-adding a little oil rejuvenates them.

Thanks all.

I'll try to add a bit more in answer to some of the questions, and maybe ask a few more of my own.

Rapid cool? After I water quench the boolits I dry them out in an electric skillet then let cool back down to where I can handle them. I then stand them in a pie pan while the lube melts in a different pie pan that I put in the electric skillet set to about 150-200 degrees. Once the lube is fully melted I pour it into the pan with the boolits till it covers the lube grooves. Then allow everything to air cool. So, if I'm reading some of these responses correctly, I should then put that pan back into the skillet to bring the boolits back up to temp, then allow boolits and lube to air cool back down together. That will help the lube stick to the boolits better, right?

Once the lube and boolits cool to room temperature I've usually had to put the pan in the freezer for about 10-15 minutes to get the lube to break free from the pan. Once everything warms to room temp again I push the boolits out the bottom of the lube. If I use a shell to cut the boolits out I suppose I won't need to break the lube free from the pan first.

You were doing it right. Just dont put them in the freezer. Cut them out with fired shell casing and you might eliminate most of your problems. By putting them in freezer to get lube to break free from the pan, you might also be shrinking the lube away from the bullets.

The preheating bullets was referring to heating them BEFORE you add the lube. You might not have to do that.

One point of clarification please.

I want to use an unsized shell for a cutter, right?

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Originally Posted by cpaspr

One point of clarification please.

I want to use an unsized shell for a cutter, right?

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A once fired case.....yes. Find a case that a bullet can easily slide in and out of the case neck.

I reuse the lube tray in the pan simply sitting bullets in the existing holes. Then sit the pan in the water pan and heat to melted lube. This double boiler heats bullets and lube at the same time making them the same temp and the mass of the 200 or so bullets in the pan slows the cooling rate considerably. WHen cooled I cut the bullets out with a home made cookie cutter and store them away. Once the holes are in the lube in the pan its simple to drop bullets in and on smaller dia bullets helps keep them upright and supported while moving the pans around. Also this way there is little "guessing" since the lube is already there and all that needs added is what was used in the last batch of bullets.

My method that drops excellent lubed bullets from the cake:
* Put bullets is hard cake from previous lubing
* Put pan on top of pot of water - heat water to boiling and the lube is completely melted
* Put index finger on one of the bullets in the cake - when hot to touch (lube will be melted)... turn stove off
* Put a floor fan in front of the stove to cool the cake to a soft consistency
* Put lube pan in freezer and leave until when the bottom of the pan is tapped - the cake frees from the sides of the pan
* Remove cake from pan and set it on a piece of 1/2" siding insulation (to keep the cake from breaking)
* Push out the nose's of the bullets onto the piece of insulation using a piece of leather under my thumb (no cake cutter)
No issues with no lube in the GG's! :)

I'm back. Two more questions:
1) Should I size them before lubing? Can I size them without lubing? I ask because my boolits drop enough oversize in several calibers that I can't use an unsized, previously fired case as a cutter. The boolits are too big. And I don't have any shells bigger than .45, and that's what I'm primarily casting.
2) Depending on the answer to #1, if I need to lube before sizing, then I suppose I can lube, press out with my thumb, size them, run them back through the pan process again, use the cookie cutter, then run them back through the sizing die to clear the excess lube from the outside. Seems like a lot of extra work for what are mostly plinking boolits.

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John Boy - What's a GG?

the sizing shouldn't remove the lube from the groove.
I'd lube then size the lube will make sizing easier.
the lube should only harden up to a softish squishy solid.
if it's hard you'll play havoc keeping it in the groove.