Printable View
If other was a choice I'd have mentioned several. That being said I've shot many whitetails with the .357. As mentioned earlier shot placement is paramount. Stay away from ultra lite j bullets. 110 and 125 gr bullets cant offer consistent penetration. I have had good results with the 140 gr XTP on about a dozen deer. A wide nose cast 158 to 180 will penetrate deeper. just my 2 cents.
45 with a heavy cast bullet.
357/45 Colt......Whichever one can place a bullet in this 8" x 8" area and perform at least with the same ballistics as a generic hunting arrow.
Attachment 253615
Big slow boolits kill them deader
But what do I know
I live in a shotgun only state :(
Something I have not noticed is how big are the deer where you hunt ? If I was hunting up north where the deer are almost twice the size of deer in the south and only had a week of hunting season a 45 would really matter to me. I live in the south small deer long season 357 is what I use main reason I own one along with a 44 both have taken deer without a issue. The 357 is light weight and easy for a kid to use so when my boys were young they both used it as their starter deer rifle.
I don’t like 357 for deer and I don’t like 45/70 either. 357 is minimum that is practical and 45/70 is over kill. Not that either one won’t get the job done. I’ve never killed a deer with pistol cartridge in carbine but have killed several with handguns. It has always seemed funny to me that the pistol cartridges in carbines are considered marginal by the gun scribes. In handgun it’s just short of atomic.
I’ve done a lot of deer hunting in eastern states and run into many other non residents. The common thing where I hunt is the mountain terrain. A 100 yd shot is a long one. Having said that and having hunted with dozens of parties I can only remember a few guys hunting with pistol cartridges or straight cases. When it gets right down to it they are toys compared to bottle neck cartridges. That’s the reason for the millions of 30-30s in the deer woods. Can pistol cartridges kill deer? Yes, but there are much better choices.
Open sightlines -- 357
Brushy woods -- 45 (heavier boolit)
Killed deer with 45 colt in both revolver and rossi lever gun, all were dead with little trailing them, also a few with 44 mag rossi, missed a couple with 357 revolver now I stick to the 45 or 44. I used 255 gr flat nose in the 45 big hole in bigger hole out except for one big doe that I shot that was facing me. 255 gr went in under chin and found the bullet in the hind qtr. expanded to the size of a half dollar. It tok out the heart lungs etc. on the way. I like the 45.
BD
What people don't understand is that it is not only about shot placement but about bullet design and impact velocity. No matter what bullet one uses, funny how they all expand to about a 1/2" ay? Then there is speed, weight etc.
Funny, folks been killing deer for 1,000 years and for some reason we keep trying to improve death! Geeesh guys, it is a marketing scheme and the sheeple fall for it!
Pick the rifle, caliber you like and then perfect your skills shooting it. In order to get perfection, you may need to spend thousands finding that sweet load!!! Like I said, just accurate enough to hit the 8 x 8 area, velocity per bullet weight/design....will bring'm down.
If you are a good hunter, you should be able to get close enough to knock'em over the head with a club like the caveman did.....that's HUNTING!!! Shooting a deer at 1,000 yards is not hunting, that's a SNIPER!
Here is a vintage 1880's 44-40 (44WCF). 50 yards with an impact velocity of about 1,300fps
Attachment 253666
Here is a replicated example of the above, killing game for over 140 years
Attachment 253668
8x8 square? At what distance? And is this anywhere on a deer or maybe you would like to place your shots in the kill zone.
Most people have a higher standard, say 3"x3" @100 yards.
But, a person happy slopping shots into a deer without regard to shot placement will loose a lot of deer.
If you think for one second the millions of just deer hunters in the eastern USA shoot 3" x 3" groups, you are highly kidding yourself. We are talking reality here....but if you will ease up to post #83....that should work pretty good at a 100 yards....but we all know that was from a bench rest looking at paper and not some monster buck with our hearts pounding out of our bodies like Bugs Bunny on Saturday morning comics!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Hickory
I guess I am on double secret probation cause I am not allowed to upload any more photos.
I've used slug guns on deer for many years. Only in the last few years has the State of Ohio allowed the use of pistol caliber (.357 and larger) rifles for deer. So far, I haven't noticed any real difference in the efficiency between a shotgun slug and a slow moving 230 gr. bullet from a .45 Colt. They still drop in their tracks "iff'n ya hits dem rite".
:goodpost:Quote:
Originally Posted by jimb16
Here is a funny one for ya. Winchester doesn't even list the 357 "Super-X" as a "Deer" cartridge on the box but it lists it as a "deer" cartridge on the website. Winchester does not list the 45 Colt as a "deer" cartridge on the box nor on their website. Buffalo Bore has some nice factory hunting loads when used in the correct weapons. Best thing to do is open up a Lyman's #49th, turn to the rifle data...find what works best in your rifle and enjoy. You don't have to blow a deer's guts out in order to be an ethical kill, ask any bow hunter!!
Winchester's so called "Deer Rifle" Calibers,
350 Leg
223
22-250
243
25
25-06
25-35
257 Rob +P
264
270 series
280
284
30-06
30-30
30-40
300 series
303
307
308
32 Win
384
35 Rem
356
357
375
38-40
38-55
41 Rem Mag
44 Rem Mag
44-40
45-70
450
6.4
6.5x55
6mm
7.62x39
7.62x54
7mm series
Interesting list!!
When it comes to engines, there is no substitute for cubic inches. When it comes to cartridges, there is no substitute for caliber.
Jack, the list mentions "450". 450 what? There's a LOT of 450's out there!!
I think you put too much faith in bullet design and not enough in shot placement.Quote:
Originally Posted by Savvy Jack
An 8x8 square is not good enough!
In the 70's & 80's I shot at Camp Perry and could keep ten shots in the 8-9-10 and X ring at 200 yards off hand with open sights.
You said its "not about shot placement" well, it is about shot placement.
An expanding bullet will kill a deer even if you shoot it in the guts or shoot its lower jaw off, but will you find it or will the Coyotes?
Shot placement is paramount in any hunting endeavor!
You said practice, practice, practice but, I say never be satisfied with just keeping your shots in an 8x8" square. Have higher standards!
About the 8 X 8 kill area I feel the same that I shoot for a small spot like 2-3" and also don't believe in maximum point blank range where the yardage given is based on a 8" circle.
I hunt with a lot of calibers that have a rainbow trajectory and if I have it sighted at 100 yards and get a 60 yard shot I aim 5" low to hit that 2-3" spot.
Giving a MPBR of some long distance such as 173 yards and telling someone to hold dead on at any range in from point blank to that maximum is just wrong for me. You will be wounding much more game than killing !
Jedman
Where did I say that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Hickory
Did I get that wrong?Quote:
Originally Posted by Savvy Jack
Well, you know what you meant.
Yeah, here is exactly what I said, and I meant it exactly the way I said it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hickory
Quote:
What people don't understand is that it is not only about shot placement but about bullet design and impact velocity.