Before I drop over a $1,000, some verification please

Many of you have probably seen some of my posts inquiring about the 327 Federal.
Here is where I stand on my future project.
I am eyeballing a savage 340, chambered in 222 remington, which I understand to be one of the easier guns to rebarrel.
My goal is to have a barrel blank installed for 327.
I know the magazine won't function without major alterations, if even possible, and that is not overly of any importance.
Can someone tell me exactly what needs to happen to accomplish this?
In my mind, the barrel blank would have to be machined to fit the receiver and stock first, blued, then chambered for 327, then head spaced correctly.
Next would be installing sights or a scope?
Or both.
The only thing I have ever done is turn a 357 mag into a 357 max, so maybe I am overthinking this.
I know there are some damned fine gunsmiths on this site, and would really like a detailed chain of events that need to take place to create my first customized rifle before I start throwing money at it.
And or suggestions.
I also know that turn around time is WAY out there right now.
Any and all comments are welcome.
Thanks in advance.
John

Before you do all that you should talk to JES. Take a look at his web site. Not only might it save some money, but rebored and re-rifled barrels are often more accurate than new barrels.

http://35caliber.com/

What do you plan to use the rifle for? That can determine a lot about what you have to do and how much it will cost.

You may want to compare the bolt face depth on the Savage 340 in 222 to where the case head and webbing end on a 327 federal case to check to make sure there is no unsupported area. Have never looked at a 340, but if the 222 is the standard 1/8"ish deep bolt face you can still headspace it by leaving a rim on the chamber mouth or less ideally it can be headspaced on the case mouth. Hopefully the 222 is set up like the 30-30 versions where the bolt face pocket is not deeper than the rim is thick.

I have seen the 340 rebarreled to 300 Blackout on Gunbroker previously. Those had started out as either 223 or 222 rifles if I recall.

I'm no expert, but I believe the 45,000 PSI spec for 327 should be safe in the rifle even with its one locking lug, since the original .222 spec is higher still.

Interesting project; I like the 340 rifle, and will be following along to see what you come up with.

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Originally Posted by JohnSmiles

I am eyeballing a savage 340, chambered in 222 remington, which I understand to be one of the easier guns to rebarrel.

My goal is to have a barrel blank installed for 327.

Can someone tell me exactly what needs to happen to accomplish this ?

In my mind, the barrel blank would have to be machined to fit the receiver and stock first, blued, then chambered for 327, then head spaced correctly.

Next would be installing sights or a scope - Or both.

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You're entirely on track with your premises of the work needed - except that the issue barrel needs to be removed.

As noted above, I would contact a good re-bore gunsmith like Jes (there are others), since a rebore would cost less than $300 - leaving only the magazine issue.

IOW, K.I.S.S. ;)


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+1 on checking into the fit for the bolt face and feed lips.

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Originally Posted by Tatume

Before you do all that you should talk to JES. Take a look at his web site. Not only might it save some money, but rebored and re-rifled barrels are often more accurate than new barrels.

http://35caliber.com/

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Jesse is only set up to rebore to 338 or larger (actually .330 for the top of the lands according to his website).
I have several of the little 325, 340 rifles, and want one of them in .32 special - not available from him.
I plan to get in touch with John Taylor, and see if it's something he can help me with.

Good luck, and keep us in the loop on your project!!

I believe Taylor moved to Idaho and its going to be several months before he gets his shop going.

I think I might go the route of stubbing a barrel to use on a NEF action.

Seems like a lot of money to invest. Why not find one in .30/30 and download it?

I doubt the 340 type rifles will ever be super accurate no matter what barrel you use.

I have a little Howa Mini-Mauser and I think they used to be available in 7.62x39. Not sure if they are offered in .300 BO but a much better rifle at a lower price and it does not need a funky scope mount system. Might look at the CZ's as well.

The question you need to ponder, "What if I spend $1000 and end up with a single shot 3 MOA rifle I cannot sell?"

I'm curious as to what you intend to do with this rifle?

If I was going to spend that kind of money on a rebore or rebarrel, I would probably pick a caliber that would return a bit more bang for my buck. 350 Legend or something along those lines.

I'm with dverna on the moa potential, it's still a pistol caliber boolit so at it's best it can't compete with the 30-30 at 100yds.

Contact henry and see if they are going to make one in 327, they sure would sell a bunch of them.

Unless I’m terribly mistaken (for the first time since 1978?) Henry has one or more lever action rifles and carbines chambered in 327 Fed Mag. If you have decided a repeater is in your future, I would humbly suggest you look there (for well under that $1000 budget.)

The Frugal Frog

https://www.henryusa.com/caliber/327...num-32-hr-mag/

I suppose the Henry is OK if you put wheels on it and had a pony to drag it around for you.

Geeesh they are HEAVY!

My John Taylor .32 Bunny Gun weighs 4 pounds. Of course it isn't a .327, but I like to be able to eat up to the bullet hole and subsonic loads disturb the neighbors alot less.

I never did see what the gun was primarily to be used for. Unless the barrel is worn out, .222 can be a fun and accurate gun. All depends on intended use.

getting a rimmed case to feed may be a bit of fun. I have a small Remington bolt action I was thinking of making into a 32 auto and using a mag from a pistol. Several years ago I converted a Cadet to 32 S&W. It's all done except the butt plate. I have not had it to the range yet to see what it will do.

Fellers, I chose this project because a .204, 222, 223 and a few others have almost the same rim diameter as the 32 caliber cartridges.
Bolt face should function with little, if any, modification.
The savage 340 is supposedly one of the easier guns to rebarrel.
I had entertained thoughts of stubbing a handi barrel, then came across this angle.
RESALE value had no place in this equation.
I have never bought a gun for it's resale value, and certainly wasn't worried about my first project gun having resale value.
I would have no intention of selling it to begin with.
I simply wanted a bolt action gun, barreled in 327 federal. Something different and fun to shoot. This was to be my first customized rifle.
But as this seemed to be viewed as just an exercise in folly by some, I didn't follow through and purchase that 340 deluxe with the sweet stock I was looking at.
But someone else did. Good looking gun at a fair price.
I did however purchase a Liberty 64T gun safe.
Which means it will be some time before I have any extra cash to pursue a project gun of any bent.
Thanks for all the input.
John

Maybe research using a 77/357 for your project if you have to have a repeater. If not, MGM makes real nice barrels for Contenders. Just a thought.......

Nice safe!

Maybe you should consider doing a .350 legend instead of the. 327. JES reboring can rebore your rifle for 250.00 including return s&h and the bolt face would require no modification either and the magazine might work as well.

Nothing wrong with wanting / building something different. I have done it several time for self and customers.

What a guy wants is his business. If I was going to spend major bucks on such a project I would first invest in a donor rifle that would be more likely to provide optimum results for my buck. That rifle would not be a 340 series Savage.

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Originally Posted by Jeff Michel

Maybe research using a 77/357 for your project if you have to have a repeater. If not, MGM makes real nice barrels for Contenders. Just a thought.......

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I had, and still have, the hots for an accurate .38/.357 rifle. I was set to buy one of the 77's and saw a lot of negative reviews as to accuracy. Wish one was available. Looked at one of the "baby" rolling blocks, but not seeing many reviews on them. I do not like shooting break open guns so a bit limited in options.

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Originally Posted by 45workhorse

Nice safe!

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Thanks! The wife thought so as well.

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Originally Posted by 1Hawkeye

Maybe you should consider doing a .350 legend instead of the. 327. JES reboring can rebore your rifle for 250.00 including return s&h and the bolt face would require no modification either and the magazine might work as well.

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Kind of defeats the purpose.
The intent is to have a 327 Federal to play with.

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Originally Posted by Drm50

What a guy wants is his business. If I was going to spend major bucks on such a project I would first invest in a donor rifle that would be more likely to provide optimum results for my buck. That rifle would not be a 340 series Savage.

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I had seen a very nicely stocked 340, and understand they are relatively easy to rebarrel.
What is wrong with the 340 series? I have never owned one.

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Originally Posted by Jeff Michel

Maybe research using a 77/357 for your project if you have to have a repeater. If not, MGM makes real nice barrels for Contenders. Just a thought.......

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I had mentioned using a ruger m77 as a rebarrel project on another thread. It wasn't met with much enthusiasm either.
Before it is all said and done, I may just throw caution and common sense to the wind, and take a safari grade ruger #1 and have it rebarreled to 327.
Far cry from originally considering just stubbing a handi rifle, eh?
I am patient though. Been looking at various options on this idea for some time now.
In the end, I want a top quality stock, excellent trigger(I really like double set triggers like on my Renegade muzzle loader) and either falling block, bolt or break action. I intend to feed it 32 acp, 32, 32 long, 32 magnum and 327 federal. Just because I can...lol
I know up front I will have more invested than the finished gun will be worth.
But I will have what I want if I am going to have a gun basically custom made.
Some nice peep sights would be an added touch, but these old eyes might not be up to that anymore.

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Originally Posted by JohnSmiles

What is wrong with the 340 series? I have never owned one.

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I've owned several of the 340's/325's in .222 and .30-30, and they are probably the last gun I would spend money on "customizing". The actions aren't the slickest/most rigid, triggers have a lot of creep (and not user friendly to adjust), and they all use the side mount scope base. That being said, the .222 I owned was a pretty good shooter....but I could never make myself like the gun (or any of the .30-30s).

They feel clunky, aren't very refined, and simply not the action I would want to build on.

Jason280 +1 also the ejection port is very short. Any bullet of seated over factory specs has to be hand loaded and has a hard time being ejected unfired.

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Originally Posted by JohnSmiles

Kind of defeats the purpose.
The intent is to have a 327 Federal to play with.

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This thread has brought out several fairly strong dislikes for the donor rifle, and listed it's lesser liked features, so I wonder what responses you would get if you put up another thread saying "For A RIFLE In 327 Federal, Where Would You Start?" And ask some suggestions as to what rifle might make the best donor, the least expensive conversion, the best trigger or scope mount, etc...

And keeping in mind this is a revolver boolit, so it's only going to be but so accurate regardless of how well made the rifle is.

I would think a levergun would make a fun project for 327. I lot of them are chambered in pistol calibers so we know they work quite well.

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Originally Posted by DougGuy

This thread has brought out several fairly strong dislikes for the donor rifle, and listed it's lesser liked features, so I wonder what responses you would get if you put up another thread saying "For A RIFLE In 327 Federal, Where Would You Start?" And ask some suggestions as to what rifle might make the best donor, the least expensive conversion, the best trigger or scope mount, etc...

And keeping in mind this is a revolver boolit, so it's only going to be but so accurate regardless of how well made the rifle is.

I would think a levergun would make a fun project for 327. I lot of them are chambered in pistol calibers so we know they work quite well.

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Not sure how it being a 'handgun cartridge' makes it any less accurate.
Less powerful, yes.
Shorter effective range, yes.
But I wasn't looking for a powerful long range rifle. I have those.
Straight up, all I know about the 340 is what I have read, mostly on here.
Everything that has been posted in the negative, I wasn't aware of until this post.
I am aware I can go buy a Henry lever gun, but I don't particularly want one.
I have 3 lever guns already.
And I did actually ask what the people on here with knowledge of such things would suggest as a 327 project gun 2 days ago.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...r-me-327-rifle

The Contender Carbines are dandy little rifles for the purpose you describe. Acquiring and mounting another barrel for the next cartridge you get the itch to try is quick and painless.

-ktw

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Originally Posted by JohnSmiles

Not sure how it being a 'handgun cartridge' makes it any less accurate.
Less powerful, yes.
Shorter effective range, yes.

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It's a shorter stubbier boolit compared to rifle boolits of the same caliber, so it doesn't have the ballistics of the rifle boolit. At 100 yds a rifle boolit will go through the same hole over and over where the revolver boolit will open groups considerably. That is what I meant by my comment.

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Originally Posted by DougGuy

It's a shorter stubbier boolit compared to rifle boolits of the same caliber, so it doesn't have the ballistics of the rifle boolit. At 100 yds a rifle boolit will go through the same hole over and over where the revolver boolit will open groups considerably. That is what I meant by my comment.

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I've shot bullets up to 167 grains in a revolver. I see no reason why you couldn't easily shoot 150 and 165 grain rifle bullets in the 327 federal in a rifle. This caliber is awesome because it doesn't require stubby bullets. I'd even go so far as to say bullets under 125 grains are a waste of time for anything other than mouse fart loads.

JohnSmiles, at this point I’ll quote the great philosopher Ricky Nelson who said, “You can’t please everybody, so you’ve got to please yourself.” When I’ve done my various builds including two pistol class low walls (a 32 Long Colt and a 32 H&R) I finally had to quit listening to everybody else, look at what I wanted and what was available to work with, and just do it!. If we go back to one of your earliest musings, using a monobloc barrel on a tip up Handi Rifle or something similar would be the cheapest, most straightforward way to get something “to play with.” If I were working under the conditions you describe, I’d buy a rifle barreled H&R/NEF, etc in whatever caliber was most readily available and a surplus Military rifle barrel in 303 British. Gunsmithing would involve profiling the barrel to suit the application, sawing off the original tip up barrel in front of the locking lugs, then reaming the stub to monobloc the 303 barrel into place. Make a 6 o’clock extractor cut and make an extractor (or build up the original.) Cut your chamber and fit the extractor, and you’re good to go.

If you really like the product, you can consider an infinite range of options for sights and stocks. Again, you’ve got to please yourself! This is all my own opinion of course, but I would certainly encourage you to go for it.

Froggie

I have one customer that I made five different caliber barrels for the same folding beretta shotgun. While I have stubbed a few barrels over the years, it's sometime just as easy to make a new lug and silver solder it to the barrel. One of the more difficult jobs I did several years back was to make a mono block for a Winchester model 21 so it could be made into a 416-500 nitro express. Lucky for me the barrel regulated very fast so I only had to shoot it a few times. Even using a lead sled and hearing protection it was not fun to shoot.

http://www.homegunsmith.com/cgi-bin/...0;t=28099;st=0 Check out this rifle on a variation of the action I mentioned in a previous post.