1897 Shotgun - Need opinions

So i've been looking for an 1897 for sometime and recently found one at the local gun shop and a decent price, but not quite the steal. Its a 12g take down model, which i wanted, but someone had their name engraved on the side. bluing is non-existent with just rust patina now. I've got it taken completely down and but everything is functionally all there. Barrels a full choke and not modified so its not a rare piece, made in 41 as well.


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I don't need a shotgun with a 30 inch barrel and was thinking of getting it reduce to around 20 or so? I hunt mostly grouse, some pheasant but if i get a chance at duck i take the 11-87 out. I don't care for bluing, but with it being a classic i might have it reblued but prefer cerakote due to its utility in protecting parts for just under several lifetimes. I also don't need to make it into a trench gun either,

I figure its already pretty jacked up and modifying it to what i want would not anger the gun gods but thoughts and opinions?

I’m assuming you are not a Cowboy Action Shooter and just want a usable gun. That being said, you could cut the barrel to 20-24” and install screw-in chokes. Finish can be whatever you like - Cerakote is good.

I bought a takedown ‘97 some years ago that had been cut to 18”. I sent the barrel to Briley’s in Houston and had them back bore it to provide a bit of choke - probably between improved cylinder and modified now. It’s a great quail and varmint gun at close range but 25-30 yds is around the effective limit. I could install screw-ins but it’s just not a priority for me right now.

I left the finish as-is so it looks fairly original. Didn’t see a need to make it pretty.

My first ‘97 is a mismatched gun [barrel and recvr have different sn’s] but with decent bluing. I replaced all the rough wood, don’t remember if I cut it or it was already cut for cas. Been using it for many years but it needs a tuneup. I actually prefer a Marlin Model 24 but I can only use that one at my home cas club. Make sure your 97 will take down though. I bought a Stevens Model 620 pump and didn’t try to separate it at the show and had to beat it apart after I got it home. Had I tried there I would have paid less or walked. Took a lot of work but it works correctly now.

Depending on the construct of the barrel itself, it may be suitable for threading for screw in chokes. So cut it to whatever length you like for general use. All depends on how thick it is. Pakerizing might also be a choice for a final finish. Kinda hides slight imperfections in the surface metals and if all the parts are done the same the overall look of the shotgun will be very nice. New front beads can be installed easily, and usually wood stocks can be refinished to match the new gun finish. Good luck. Picture are always enjoyed by the site. :)

My take down 1897 was made in 1931. I bought it with a cut 19" barrel around 1973. The gun had been refinished to a very nice deep blue. I bought it the second I saw it. I love this shotgun and use it for all around shooting and rabbits. On yours I'd have the receiver gone over and see if the name can be removed. Good luck with your project!!

There are a few variations on the 97 so some parts may not be interchangeable. I have a couple frames in the shop if you want to try and swap it out. I have seen a few without S/Ns, seems Sears and Winchester had a disagreement at some point and Sears took the S/N off a bunch of guns way back when.

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Originally Posted by Dutchninja

So i've been looking for an 1897 for sometime and recently found one at the local gun shop and a decent price, but not quite the steal. Its a 12g take down model, which i wanted, but someone had their name engraved on the side. bluing is non-existent with just rust patina now. I've got it taken completely down and but everything is functionally all there. Barrels a full choke and not modified so its not a rare piece, made in 41 as well.


Attachment 296842

I don't need a shotgun with a 30 inch barrel and was thinking of getting it reduce to around 20 or so? I hunt mostly grouse, some pheasant but if i get a chance at duck i take the 11-87 out. I don't care for bluing, but with it being a classic i might have it reblued but prefer cerakote due to its utility in protecting parts for just under several lifetimes. I also don't need to make it into a trench gun either,

I figure its already pretty jacked up and modifying it to what i want would not anger the gun gods but thoughts and opinions?

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My first thought is you are indeed a lucky person to have the gun you now possess! Bion I was gifted one -- Winchester Takedown Brush Shotgun 26” Bbl. S/n 279,xxx. It is of 1906 manufacture and it is quite the favourite! I'm happy to note you hunt grouse and pheasant, as the one *BIG* caution I might add is to NOT load potent/hot shotgun rounds! I limit mine to light bird-shot loadings, which I buy (I don't reload scattergun shells), and IT has performed well. As just typed, my barrel is twenty-six inches of length...
Congrats again!
geo

If the price is reasonable , see if you can use the Engaving and lack of finish to lower the price $50...
If so ...Jump on it with both feet ... I can tell ... you would like to have it ...
And trust me ... they aren't getting any cheaper any time soon and if you don't get this one now ...
... You might never see another ... Go For It !
Gary

What about a "cover up tattoo"?
How deep is the engraving? Could a lazer image be burned over the top to cover it up?
I know a great gunsmith with a laser engraver. PM me if you are interested.

While a '97 is indeed a wonderful thing, there are better, cheaper ways to create a house gun that would be far less painful to give up as evidence in the event it needs to be used. In short, Mossberg makes a 20" barrel with a 7 shot mag tube.

The choice is ultimately yours, it's your money. Without seeing it more, I have no way to know what you mean by "jacked up". You say it is functional. Certainly that little bit of engraving isn't a big deal. That little bit of speckling rust is no big deal. I'd be more worried about the bore, but being made in 1941, it may have seen little use of corrosive primers.

Here's my opinion if what you are looking at is a fully functioning gun, stocks good, and no other major issue. I wouldn't be hacking off that barrel. There is no shortage of 20" barrel 97's from people who had the same idea decades ago. Those are usually even cheaper, unless they are trying to pawn it off as a trench gun. Most were 30" full choke barrels, but good condition examples are getting harder to find. The 2 things I've learned about these is that #1 if it has bluing, it is not original, #2 if they say it is a trench gun, it probably is not. It is probably sawed off. The other thing about the takedown models, most of them are takedowns. Very few were made as solid guns, so there's little concern there.

If you wanted a cool upland gun, I wouldn't do anything except open the choke if you really wanted. I measured my barrel, and they are plenty thick enough for threading for chokes, but I wouldn't mess with that. There is nothing wrong with the 97 design strength wise, you can shoot any 2 3/4" shell. They handle 11,500 psi no sweat.

One last thing is the price. You never really said what it was. I know prices are all over the map at the moment, but I wouldn't fall for that trap. These aren't $1000 shotguns, except for a black diamond trap. If one was in exceptional shape, $800 wouldn't be unreasonable. Most 97's are closer to $500-$700. Cowboy action versions are their own thing, I don't know about them. If you are looking for a cool older gun for upland, there is a 97 here in Aberdeen, 30" modified barrel, looks pretty good on the outside, bore is lightly pitted, but shouldn't effect performance. They were asking $400. I certainly wouldn't pay more than $400 for the one you have pictured.

Appreciate the feedback, I did end up picking it up, they wouldn’t haggle at all in the price so just bit the boolit. I’m fine with what I paid, and it takes down fine and is all there. Only jacked up think is the engraving and lack of bluing and rust patina.

1. Cerakote is cheaper than having it reblued or parked, unless someone knows a good place?

2. Thinking I find another barrel that’s allready cut and have the two barrels,

3. I have Plenty of other shotguns set for home, this is just one of MANY…..

4. I know most of the trench guns are faked, did a bit of research, don’t need an 1000+ $ shotgun.

5. With another take down barrel does that have to be fitted correctly for the front bead? Thought I read somewhere that might be an issue….

6. Anytime got a cut barrel lying around?!?

Thanks everyone, been in this site for years now, amazing place and people…

I'd clean it up and refinish it myself just for the novelty of doing a cool and unusual project.

For using it- I'd get a barrel like you'd want and swap it out when I went hunting with it.

I cut down the barrel on a H&R Topper 20ga years ago to make a truck gun... My buddy found a single shot 20 ga and did one also. he used a hacksaw to cut the barrel, then filed it smooth. I used a pipe cutter and it kind of swagged the barrel down a little bit while it was cutting it off. Dad said I should ream it out, but I shot it as is and it patterened great, so I left it alone. I've killed a pile of grouse with that $35 shotgun.
So if you end up getting another barrel, you might consider trying a pipe cutter on it if you want a little choke vs. cylinder bore...

I had this picture laser engraved onto a floorplate for the rifle my son's Grandpa gave him when he was 12.
http://www.lsstuff.com/pics/guns/flo...floorplate.jpg

The no bluing is no issue. None of them have bluing on the action, and most barrels are well worn too. That patina looks minor. If refinishing, you could use just about anything. Steel wool will probably do you fine. If you are painting in Cerakote, that engraving should be no issue. I've seen fillers that would work really well for that. They are basically bondo for guns. Then cover with Cerakote, and you would never know it was engraved.

The barrel is a trickier matter. Get a gunsmiths opinion first before attempting this. I am no gunsmith, and do not claim to be an expert. What I know about the model 97 and 12 is they use a very similar takedown setup. Both use a ring mounted inside of the frame to set headspace, do not mess with this. Their barrels mate up tight against this ring, assuming everything is right. There is an adjuster lock on the barrel extension that can be loosened, and then the barrel turned. It is a limited adjustment, maybe 1/8 turn of the barrel, the lock mates into teeth on the barrel. This may or may not be enough to fit a barrel to your frame, I have never tried. In general, these are not considered switch barrel guns, and most people send them to a gunsmith to have them fitted. I have never seen just a barrel for sale, although I'm sure they pop up sometimes from destroyed guns.

It's way easier and cheaper to just have your choke reamed out to something more suited to upland game, or if you load ammo, make spreader loads.

If I had my heart set on a hack and spray job on a shotgun it wouldn’t be an 80 year old Winchester. Maybe a rusty JC Higgins.

My opinion.

I think a 97 with Parkerizing would be sweet, but if cost is a concern, Cerakote isn't a spray job. It's a serious bake on coating. It isn't like he is defacing a relic. If anyone didn't like it in the future, Cerakote can be bead blasted off with no harm done. I agree though, I wouldn't hack that barrel off. I think you will find the 30" suits the 97 very well considering the compact frame.

There’s a complete cut down 1897 20 inch front end on fleabay for 300.00 or bo. Looks like an old reblue to me. [Not my barrel.]

I would not go less than 25" myself . Watch the pawn shops and older gun shops for the older Remchoke tubes , I have bought a pile of them new in the package for $2-$3 each . I'd do either regular blue or Parkerizing one or the other . Either would look more at home on that gun.

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Originally Posted by Eddie Southgate

I would not go less than 25" myself . Watch the pawn shops and older gun shops for the older Remchoke tubes , I have bought a pile of them new in the package for $2-$3 each . I'd do either regular blue or Parkerizing one or the other . Either would look more at home on that gun.

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Starting to lean towards park now

Saw the one on eBay….made several offers on the eBay option, price is…up there….

Had s 97, s great 12 ga. zonly it would go off half cocked,sometimes if bumped. be careful!
BD

Well solved my problem, my gun club had a gun show today, went to see if anyone had a barrel, I’m walking around and find a norinco 1897 for 500, tell the guy I’ll think about it, walk to the back, see the husband of the wife I worked with for years and am friends with, he’s got a table there and his buddy has a gun case on the table talking to another guy, they finish up guy takes the case and under it is an 1897…….$400…..take down…….. holy $&&@. Life’s strange sometimes.

I’m going to keep that one original and cut and modify the first one without guilt.

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Originally Posted by Dutchninja

Well solved my problem, my gun club had a gun show today, went to see if anyone had a barrel, I’m walking around and find a norinco 1897 for 500, tell the guy I’ll think about it, walk to the back, see the husband of the wife I worked with for years and am friends with, he’s got a table there and his buddy has a gun case on the table talking to another guy, they finish up guy takes the case and under it is an 1897…….$400…..take down…….. holy $&&@. Life’s strange sometimes.

I’m going to keep that one original and cut and modify the first one without guilt.

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Fitting a barrel to a takedown 97 can be tricky, due to the fact that rear 1/8 inch or so of the chamber is in the receiver (heading ring), while the rest is in the barrel.
If the part of the chamber thats in the barrel is slightly larger in diameter than the rear part that in the receiver, there will be a slight bulge that keeps a fired round from extracting. This can be corrected by someone that has the proper tolling, but that person might be somewhat had to find.
So before you dump a bunch of $$$ buying a barrel, it would be prudent to test to see if works on the receiver you're putting it on.

Concur with Eddie, 25 or 26" is as short as I would go. Should be plenty enough barrel for the screw in chokes is also what I would do. It also would need a higher bead installed than the original.