I've been eyeing the Glock 20 in10mm. Who has one and is reloading with lead boolits? Theresslways the ongoing debate about Glocks and lead. I imagine if you clean it regularly, it shouldn't be a problem but let's hear your experiences.
Siamese4570
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I've been eyeing the Glock 20 in10mm. Who has one and is reloading with lead boolits? Theresslways the ongoing debate about Glocks and lead. I imagine if you clean it regularly, it shouldn't be a problem but let's hear your experiences.
Siamese4570
Could always get a standard rifled barrel with a more supported chamber, should put the debate to bed as well as being a bit easier on your brass with more chamber support. If going that way, I think I would look at an extended one to get a bit more FPS out of it.
I'm not sure on the lead/glock debate but I refrain from putting lead out of mine. I may be wrong though.
There's a couple previous threads covering this in more detail than I can recall, as far as my G20 I shot some cast from a guy selling coated bullets at an old club I belonged to, and I forgot the cardinal rule, slug the bore and measure the bullets. I didn't get leading, but they shot terrible, there was no size consistency, in the 50 I had went from .400 to .403, same with the 45's I got from him.
I plan to try again but no time and no money for a mold. I did grab a 100 commercial cast and checked them, but I haven't touched Mt reloading stuff in months.
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I've been shooting 10mm since 1991 when it became my daily carry. Since I used to be a regular IPSC shooter, attending the local weekly match like religion (before IDPA even existed), I've put over 100,000 rounds of reloads through my various G20s since then. Most of it with cast lead projectiles, in all available weights. I have never experienced poor accuracy in the stock polygonal rifled barrels, nor have I had any kabooms or ruptured cases.
In my opinion and experience, you should take notice that the vast majority of the catastrophic failures of Glocks while shooting cast bullets (and most failures in general) have been with .40S&W models. I am convinced that the reason is (despite what the shooters claim in order to preserve their dignity) ignorant handloading practices. .40S&W is one of the least forgiving handgun cartridges to load for by it's nature. Operating at modern pressures (35,000psi vs. 18,000 in the .45acp for instance) and with short interior dimensions, slight variances in seating depth and charge weight can produce dramatic pressure differentials. More so than you might observe in other handgun calibers. In fact, when I download my competition 10mm loads to equal .40S&W ballistic performance, even though I am throwing same weights at same velocities, the 10mm is just milder to shoot, with less pressure and blast and even recoils less "snappy". (And of course, when it comes to feed reliability, longer auto cartridges perform better than short stubby ones because the feed angles during the bump and shove process are not as severe. With 10mm being basically a stretched .40S&W, it feeds more reliably. Not that that is an issue with Glocks.)
To be fair, I have not yet begun loading powdercoated cast boolits in the 10mm. I will soon. I've been loading plated projectiles in this and .40 for the last 12 years. The reason has merely been one of me being tired of the drudgery of cleaning up the greater residue of shooting old school waxy-lubed cast boolits. Back when I was earning young man's lower wages, I HAD TO shoot plain cast, or dial back my shooting volume. Once I was able to afford shooting more cleanly, with gun maintenance taking up less of my time, I chose to go with plated. But now, as I have recently discovered how much less residue is left inside suppressors when shooting polymer-coated projectiles,...I am motivated by the same desire; to lessen the time I spend cleaning, and have already completely switched over in my 9mm loading.
I suspect the mistake that the individuals who experienced KABOOMs in their .40S&W Glocks with cast boolits has been misapplying the powder charge data for jackets bullets to use with cast. The difference in friction and lubricity against the interior walls of the barrel as these two different types are flung forward produce different velocities and correspondingly different pressure curves. You can see very plainly in published load data today that maximum charge weights with cast boolits with same powder and same projectile weight are less than they are with jacketed. But if you mistakenly use the data for the jacketed bullet powder charge maximum and load a cast boolit over it,...you have now exceed the safe maximum. Do that enough, and you will experience karma.
So when it comes to loading full power sizzling 10mm, I usually load lighter projectiles (135-155grn.) and usually jacketed or plated. I do this for 2 reasons, neither of which is out of fear of using cast resulting is a KABOOM. #1 - Glocks have a slightly less supported chamber mouth than other pistols, and getting bulged brass is a real result once you cross a certain pressure threshold. It shortens brass life and can be a pain to use such brass later with only standard resizing. If you are using pressures high enough to severely bulge brass, you are toying with pressures sufficiently high enough to potentially experience a kaboom, so I prefer to not go there. Lighter projectiles, even at maximum loads, tends to not bulge brass as readily as heavy ones do. #2 - early plated bullets back in the 90s were not as well engineered as they are now, and if you pushed them past 1200 or 1300 fps, they would often strip themselves in the rifling and would fly inaccurately and even sideways. Many cast boolits from various suppliers would also do this back then, when a lot of local small scale commercial casters were still using readily available wheel weights and constantly messing with their alloy mix. So jacketed projectiles when doing magnum velocities was the answer.
Back when I began, I used primarily BlueDot powder. But today I prefer spherical ball powder for it's ease of metering in my Dillon presses, so I use primarily CFE Pistol or AA#5 or AA#7. In my experience, they burn cleaner than most other powders which are also suitable.
the debate is shooting lead in the Glock factory barrel... I shoot lead in my G20 and I use a replacement barrel.... use hardcast and keep the velocity no more than 1000 fps and you are good to go... I had an accurate custom mold made for it as my woods sidearm .401 220gr RNFP square base
OK Lets get something strait. That debate has been settled here for nearly 15 years! See sticky "The Truth about Glocks and Cast." https://castboolits.gunloads.com/sho...locks-and-Cast
There is nothing to debate unless you want to debate it with people who don't know what they are talking about and only are only regurging what they have read or been told by people who didn't know what they are talking about !
Boolit fit is key here, just like it is in virtually every firearm we talk about. The post with over a 100,000 round count from "atfsux" above, is just one of the many posts that have appeared here on this one single subject which has been discussed Ad Nauseum.
I got into it with a Asst. Range Master at a 3 Gun Shoot who wasn't going to let me shoot my Lead Boolits thru my G35 at the Shoot because "He knew for a Fact," "that my gun was going to blow up and hurt someone or me!!!." All he could do is Regurg BS that he had read or been told, and was finally overruled by the "Real Range Master" who knew me and knew about firing Lead Boolits in Glocks.
My G35 and G23 run stock barrels and the G35 has 20,000 plus thru it and the G23 has about 10K thru it and at least half been Cast Boolits I made out of tire weights, and sized to .401 and with Regular Alox Lube.
IE: nothing special here!
This all started when someone Regurged the Disclaimer that Glock would not be responsible for any gun blow ups with Reloads of any kind. Just like every other gun Manufacturer Does! Then that got mutated into Lead Boolits in Glocks and Blah Blah period! Based on Stated Opinions from people who didn't know what they were talking about!
Also Note: Glock fixed the chambers and barrels on their guns around 2005. I bought my G35 in 2006, and it doesn't bulge cases or do anything bad. all the Glock Kabooms were eventually attributed to Weak Federal Cases that the web of the case didn't extend far enough up the case wall to reinforce the feed ramp groove in the chamber.(which all Semi Autos have!). Mistakenly called "Unsupported Chamber?" Like it was something bad. I had a Para Ordinance 16-40 that had a larger Feed Ramp cut in the chamber than my G35 did. It ran fine too.
Those cases were marked "FC" and "FC10." and I have commented about this many times and as recently as 2 days ago.
The point of all this is the fact that all the Problems with Glocks was finally attributed to Bad Factory Ammo, and has all been fixed.
My Re-Occurring .02 on this subject.
Randy.
Some of the 9mm Glocks have HUGE leades, like 359 diameter and unusually long, to boot. This is one of the primary reasons for the myth of polygonal barrels not getting along with cast bullets. I have one of these, and once you get the bullet size right (and cases expanded right, for 9mm), mandrel forged polygonal barrels are the cleanest shooting barrels you can get, for cast bullets.
This might be due to weird standards in 9mm. Some countries historically made 9mm barrel and bullets a couple thous larger than what is standard, today. I don't believe this is an issue in any other Glock caliber. The current Glock 9mm's still have a large diameter leade, but it's at least more normal in length.
The challenge for 10mm is the pressure. You may need to use a bit harder alloys compared to some other handgun calibers. I use soft alloy but with gas checks. When I shoot cast in Glock barrels, there is zero cleaning needed.
I keep my G20 around so I won’t buy another Glock. When I get to thinking I was too harsh in my rejection of Glocks, I pull it out and re-fresh my memory.
But….all three that I’ve had shot cast boolits. No problems there. None blew up. None leaded the bore.
I did get the G20 to tumble boolits by pushing them too fast for the hardness of my boolits. I wanted to keep the velocity and the softness so bought a KKM drop-in barrel with standard rifling. It worked. The standard rifling grabbed the boolit better than the polygonal factory barrel.
Also I discovered on top end loads the G20 had large velocity swings. Turns out the action was unlocking early. Went up to the highest pound rated recoil spring. Can’t remember exactly now but it was up over 20 pounds. I’m thinking maybe 24 pounds or so. That cured the velocity swings. But….i couldn’t keep from limp writing the gun with the heavy recoil spring.
So now I happily shoot my 10mm boolits from an Sig 220, Ruger 1911 or Springfield XDm. The G20 sits idle.
If you get along with Glocks and think they’re great, I say good for you. Fit your cast boolits to the throat diameter and shoot happy! Lots of people do.
I noticed Glocks unlock and kick the case out after very short slide travel, compared to most other semiautos. I'm surprised the action would unlock while the bullet is still in the barrel, though.
Were you shooting bullets heavier than 200 grain in that G20?
Gloob, I was using Accurate 40-165A and 40-172F (monster stopper masher meplat). Both pushed above 1350 fps. The swings were to the negative side. Meaning the average velocity with the swings was lower than with the stiffer spring.
Turns out I’m not the first to find this out. I read the idea on the net, ordered some springs, shot my loads over my chronograph alternating factory spring, heavy spring and found it was real and repeatable.
My Glock is a gen 3. It’s never made any smiley brass.
I’ve been casting for my 10mm G20 and a carbine for several years now. Slug barrel. Suggest getting a 38-40 M Die if boolits hang up. G20 has a somewhat loose chamber and my boolits kerplunked good. In carbine, it has tight chamber and had to use the M die. Powder coating Lee 401-175-TC. Zero leading, zero problems. Pushing carbine to 1600 fps. G20 around 1200’s. When done with lead, clean bore good if you’ll shoot Jacketed. BHN of 11.3.
Close to my experience with my Glock 20. I use the Lee 175 gr, sized .401", 50/50 COWW/Pb, powder-coated, Bluedot powder gives me 1200-1250fps, no leading, barrel wipes clean with a patch or two. My G20 is a Gen 4, and fired brass is normal, NO Glock smileys!Quote:
Originally Posted by Cast10