Soft lead value problems using it?

Have a friend that has a few hundred pounds of soft lead from a medical facility. I've never used soft lead for anything as I've always been able to find enough wheel weights to do what I needed (wheel weight lead running low). I have close to 100lbs of linotype and a some straight tin I could mix (stuff I've accumulated but never used). I'm just not sure if it's worth the effort to mix up an alloy from pure lead or just look for some more wheel weights. Also have a hundred pounds or so of hard #9 bird shot I could use in an alloy.

How much is raw lead scrap wort these days?
How much linotype would I need to mix with the pure lead to make a useable alloy of light pistol and rifle bullets? I don't push anything..
Could the lead be used straight up for light .38 wadcutter loads?
Need to make a decision what to offer (if it's worth getting), friend so I'd like to offer what he might get at a recycle facility.

My normal mix is roughly 50% COWW and 50% either soft lead or range scrap with 1% tin or pewter added for fill out.

But it does depend somewhat on how hard your pushing them.

Doesn't take much if you want to alloy it. 4 or 5 parts pure to 1 part lino should be in the ballpark of COWW. Or get a muzzleloader and cast up some round balls with the pure. Charcoal burners are fun to shoot.

as said many mix half WW with pure, if you water drop or heat treat its pretty hard even though its only ~2% antimony it responds well to heat treat because WW has arsenic, or use air cooled as a soft alloy makes it versatile. and mixing extends WW supply.

i would definitely buy some if I were you since you have lots of hard alloy, cant say how much for though, for me its hard to get so anything around market value im happy cause online costs more

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Originally Posted by GhostHawk

My normal mix is roughly 50% COWW and 50% either soft lead or range scrap with 1% tin or pewter added for fill out.

But it does depend somewhat on how hard your pushing them.

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Ditto, & have gone so far as 60-70% Pure/Soft lead & 30-40% COWW proportionally to 100% and have pushed up to 1100 even in an SR9 9mm with minimal leading to no leading.

For your questions & my opinions:

You asked: How much is raw lead scrap wort these days?

I pay .25-.28/lb. for COWW, and around .75-.80/lb. for sheet lead like you describe, as well as linotype. My supplier doesn't differentiate from the last two so the price is the same. (and I am glad. ;) ) Although I live in MN & you look to be in TX, so prices may not be similar there as compared to here & my source is a pretty good feller & we get along, so I would not know if I am getting a better deal than anyone else or not. I give him painted fishing jigs & weights to sweeten the deal, so that could be a factor in the prices as well.

You asked: How much linotype would I need to mix with the pure lead to make a useable alloy of light pistol and rifle bullets? I don't push anything..

Personally I would save the Lino for other uses like rifles. You could use that #9 shot to harden up the soft if you wanted to use it in larger calibers though instead of the lino

You asked: Could the lead be used straight up for light .38 wadcutter loads?

You could, Just think about the soft lead used in a .22 cal rifle that go about 1200 fps. You don't see much leading in the rifle there after firing that softer lead. ( obturation. ;) ) You could tweak an alloy using COWW or the 9 shot and some of the pure to get he pure up from about 5-6 BHN to 7-10 bhn & use that. ( Like mentioned above & See links below)

You asked/said: Need to make a decision what to offer (if it's worth getting), friend so I'd like to offer what he might get at a recycle facility.

You can ask about the price at a recycle center to find out, or you could offer him the 75-80 cents I mentioned & he would not be hurt by it nor would you. The going price for lead right now is hovering around $1 a pound on the market, and I bet he won't get 75-80 cents from the recycle place, so you are kind of meeting in the middle on price.


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Here are the links:

Source article for chart & a good read:http://www.lasc.us/castbulletalloy.htm#UNS

There is a really good alloy chart about 2/3 way down page . Look for "Alloy Recipes" or use the search feature in your browser to find it on that page...


A good read as well: https://www.grantcunningham.com/2008...-cast-bullets/

G'Luck! Hope I helped out.
:)

The shot also has arsenic in it and a decent amount of antimony. You have quite the selection and you can easily make up what ever you needed.

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Here are some common ratios to blend linotype with pure lead, such as that used for xray shielding:

Linotype-plumber's lead blends are ideal for most bullet casting and enable excellent fill-out with good strength and predictable repeatability using simple weight ratios which can be produced at moderate cost. You can estimate the hardness of your blend easily:

[LinoPounds(22)+LeadPounds(5)] / TotalPounds = EstBHN

A 50-50 linotype-lead blend at 13.5 BHN is slightly softer than commercial hardball or Lyman No.2 alloy. (22)+(5) /2 = 13.5

A 1:2 linotype-lead blend at "about 10.5 BHN" approximates 1:20 alloy and is well suited for revolver and black powder cartridge "smokeless" applications. (22)+2(5) /3 = 10.6 BHN

A 1:4 linotype-lead blend at 8.5 BHN approximates the hardness of 1:30 alloy and is best for black powder cartridges, in subsonic, smokeless revolver loads, or with plain based rifle bullets below 1300 fps and is satisfactory up to 1700 fps with gas checks in rifles for hollow-point hunting applications. (22)+4(5) /5 = 8.5 BHN

A 1:5 linotype-lead blend at 8 BHN approximates 1:40 alloy and is the frugal shooters best bang for the buck to make your alloy go far as possible in revolver, cowboy loads, black powder cartridge, and subsonic hollow-point hunting applications. (22)+5(5) / 6 = 8 BHN

Similar ratios and BHN estimates blending linotype and wheelweights:

Linotype and Wheelweight blends, to estimate hardness:

[Lino-Pounds(22) + WW-pounds(12)] / TotalPounds = BHN

1:10 linotype to wheelweights 1(22) +10(12) = 142/11 = 12.9 BHN
1:5 linotype to wheelweights: 1(22) + 5(12) = 82 /6 = 13.6 BHN
1:4 linotype to wheelweights: 1(22) + 4(12) = 70 / 5 = 14 BHN
1:3 linotype to wheelweights: 1(22) + 3(12) = 58 / 4 = 14.5 BHN
1:2 linotype to wheelweights: 1(22) + 2(12) = 46 / 3 = 15 BHN
1:1 linotype to wheelweights: 1(22) + 1(12) = 34 / 2 = 17 BHN

Thanks, some great info there. Makes me think I should get wheel weights for 1/3 the price of pure lead. Also a lot easier to deal with in a small pot. I do have a a local dealer that has around 1000lb of wheel weights. That would be a lifetime supply and a lot cheaper than the sheet lead.

An alloy calculator and a sharp pencil for notes, helps me.
https://castbulletassoc.org/download/Alloy12.xls

Most of my current lead is 26# shielding bricks. To one of those I add a 5# ingot of RotoMetals Super Hard, which is 70% antimony/30% lead, than I add a pound of pewter.

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Originally Posted by Rcmaveric

The shot also has arsenic in it and a decent amount of antimony. You have quite the selection and you can easily make up what ever you needed.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

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A really good source of info and hardening alloy is roto metals. Even has programs for amount you need. I use the copper babbit as a source of copper for really fast velocities similar to jacketed and they have one c allied super hard. That really hardens up soft lead.

They are vendors at top of sign in page

I casted up some 44 mag Lyman devastator 265 grain HPs using lead flooring which has a BH of 5 along in a 16:1 ratio with pewter. It took it to a BH of 7.5. I PCd and GCd them. I’m running them at 1750 FPS with zero leading and shooting sub MOA at 100 yards out if my Ruger 77/44. Plan on using them for deer this year. Very rapid expansion in water testing and made a nice big mushroom at 25 yards in my dirt backstop. If you PC and GC you can Run them softer like I do. The high ratio of tin/pewter makes it stay together better.

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Originally Posted by Bama

A really good source of info and hardening alloy is roto metals. Even has programs for amount you need. I use the copper babbit as a source of copper for really fast velocities similar to jacketed and they have one c allied super hard. That really hardens up soft lead.

They are vendors at top of sign in page

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I am experimenting with zinc and coppersulfate my self. I am too cheap to order anything from roto metals unfortunately.

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Imo if you PC and GC there is no need to ever go harder than COWW. I casted up some straight COWW. I WQ, PCd, and GCd them. If I remember the ending BH was 16.5 set and done. If I didn’t PC and WQ immediately out of the oven for the second time and just WQ’d immediately after casting with ice water I had a BH of 32! I ran my boolits in my Ruger American 450 BM all the way up to max 460 S&W velocities (40 grains of h110) with zero leading issues. Never chronied the max load since the best accuracy came from 35.5 grains of h110 that averaged just under 2100 FPS with the lee 300 grain FN. I never understood the hype of harder alloys.

Rotometals sell foundry type for a little over $5 a pound, and mixed at a ratio of 5# foundry type to 25# lead will give you an alloy of approximately 2% tin and almost 4% antimony, a bit harder than COWW with 2% tin. Unless you are really pushing your velocity this alloy will cover most cast bullet applications. If your lead is free (you didn't say) your cost for a good known alloy is about a dollar a pound.

I've made low BHN (5 to 7) 38 and 45 boolits, but they are a PITA to make. I've had better luck with BHN 10, and Powder Coat with zero problems. I go 10:1 lead to Linotype or 20:1 Lead to Pewter, which yields BHN 10. Boolits drop out of the molds well, and shoot well. They will be a little heavy on the weight side, as they contain more lead.

Recently posted on CB but I can’t remember by whom. Easy way to alloy for different hardnesses

How to calculate your lead alloy blending for bullets

Lino = 19 BHN, soft = 5 BHN

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Y0raK6_Vbk


https://i.imgur.com/fVzCRdc.png

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Originally Posted by arlon

How much is raw lead scrap wort these days?
How much linotype would I need to mix with the pure lead to make a useable alloy of light pistol and rifle bullets? I don't push anything..
Could the lead be used straight up for light .38 wadcutter loads?
Need to make a decision what to offer (if it's worth getting), friend so I'd like to offer what he might get at a recycle facility.

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Soft lead or even wheel weights sell here in the swapping and selling section usually for $1 a pound. Linotype usually goes for more, around $2 a pound. Plus shipping. This is in ingot form. I would try to buy unmelted scrap for less than that.

I would probably alloy 80% soft lead and 20% linotype. There is a free alloy calculator that you can download but I'm not very good with it.

Soft lead may work ok with 38 special. After all factory loaded 38 lead bullets are very soft. It may be a challenge to get good fill out with softer lead. You can try it.

Wheel weights, or wheel weights with a small % of tin have always been my favorite. I'm always on the hunt for them and plan to never be without any. I would continue to search for them if it were me but what you have can be alloyed to work for you.

Figure on $1 a pound or less for either WW's or plain soft lead. S&S forum runs about a buck, regional prices can vary.

The WW's are generally more useful as they are "ready to go" as is or with a touch of tin. However the plain soft lead is sort of like flower in a bakery. A good useful ingredient that can be used to make anything from biscuits to zucchini bread by adding other ingredients.

You can add alloys to plain to achieve whatever hardness or toughness you desire, and load ML and C&B black powder with it. You can't really make COWW's softer except by cutting with plain.

Myself I would be budgeting money to steadily go after those 1000# of wheel weights until they were all mine if the price was decent. If those are mostly lead WW's and not zinc or steel that would be a treasure worth having. There is more plain lead in the waste stream than lead WW's and the lead WW's are getting scarcer at a faster rate in my opinion.

You would probably also find you could swap COWW lead for plain pretty easily, I think there would be more demand for the COWW lead than the plain lead so your trade options would probably be greater swapping COWW for plain than the other way around.