.38 spl and H lil gun

i was wondering if anyone has tried loading a CB over Hodgdon 'lil gun in .38 spl?

i was looking through the lee load manual and noticed in the 32H&R magnum data that lil gun is interesting for a "magnum" powder. for an 85gn jacketed bullet it has the highest velocity, and gets there with about 20% less pressure, 16,800 CUP compared to 20k +/- for the other powders. the other thing i noticed is that the starting charge is a full 12.5% reduction from max, which without doing the math, is some SERIOUSLY low pressure for such a slow powder to be properly burning at.

then, for something more relevant, i flipped over to the 158gn xtp in 357 mag. and all i can say is WOW. lil gun sends that slug zipping along at 1577 fps while only making 25,800 CUP, while H110 only gains 14fps at 40,700 CUP :shock:

all this is making me think that 'lil gun might be a good option for developing an updated "fbi" load, as well as for magnum CB loads in general.

1st question are these going to be fired in a gun chambered in 357 mag or 38 special ?
Ive used a few pounds of LG powder in the 22 hornet , 357 mag and 454 casull with excellent accuracy and in the 22 H & 357 mag a velocity increase of 200 to 300 fps higher velocity than you can get with powders such as 296/ H110.
those two usually require almost a full powder charge to burn correctly , i think they state do not reduce charge weight more than 10%. im not sure about LG ! all 3 that ive used LG in had chamber pressures in the 25,000 + psi/cup range . i guess you may have to be the gini pig on this one

I haven't tried it, but even HS6 is too slow for standard .38 Spl. loads. Dirty and inconsistent in my experience. I would suspect Li'l Gun to be even worse.

Gear

Joe; never used it in 38 spcl but have in 357, it will push 190RD(195 grs full dressed) to 1200 from 4 5/8 BH. I have read internet chatter of rapid forcing cone errosion and strap cutting, I keep checking for it but nothing yet after a couple pounds.

I use Lil'Gun as a go-to powder in .357 Max loads, and have used it in the K-Hornet. It wants to work at pressure that is well beyond what most .38 Specials can stand. The stories of forcing cone erosion may prove true. Lil-Gun burns longer than other powers of its' "speed", giving higher velocity for lower peak pressure. Not something that a revolver would be happy with.

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Originally Posted by swheeler

Joe; never used it in 38 spcl but have in 357, it will push 190RD(195 grs full dressed) to 1200 from 4 5/8 BH. I have read internet chatter of rapid forcing cone errosion and strap cutting, I keep checking for it but nothing yet after a couple pounds.

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LilGun approaching 58,000 psi will erode your leade and move it forward.....trust me on that one.

There has been a lot of discussion over on "Freedom Arms" forum(Greybeard) about Lilgun wearing out revolver forcing cones due to extreme heat.

Sorta on topic . . .

I note that it sure does heat a gun up faster than other powders.

Guess it is the down side of long burn time, low pressure.\, high velocity

if hodgdon published a load for lil gun that maxed at 16,800 CUP with a starting charge 12.5% below max, i have to assume the powder is burning decently at that pressure. the main reason i am interested is my suspicion that this is the powder used in buffalo bore's FBI load, the one that claims to push a 158gn SWCHP at 1000fps from a 2" barrel without exceeding saami 38 +p limits.

what im after if it works out is to streamline my SHTF ammo. a hot carry load that wont blow up my older 38s but plenty of zip out of the 2" 357s would be nice. that way i could devote all the 357 i carry to the lever gun and a pistol for backup while hunting, and have one load for SD carry that will work in all my wheel guns.

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what im after if it works out is to streamline my SHTF ammo. a hot carry load that wont blow up my older 38s but plenty of zip out of the 2" 357s would be nice. that way i could devote all the 357 i carry to the lever gun and a pistol for backup while hunting, and have one load for SD carry that will work in all my wheel guns.

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Maybe something else to consider. The heavy 357s for the lever gun will be great for larger animals like deer. I have also been contemplating a light load for small game like rabbits using a 358156 in .38 brass. It would shoot to a different POI, but could be adjusted for at close range without changing the sights. The rounds could be told apart by feel if necessary.