1960's Colonel Wesson took elk, grizz with 357 swc's

Now this was an 8" barreled Smith, with the full load 160 gr swc, at 1550 fps. Charley Askins, ever the naysayer, said that the critters were small and unimpressive. I don't recall seeing any info on their size/wt. But Lewis and Clark took elk, bison and grizz with Ky rifles, which don't provide any better performance. Elgin gates took a Cape Buffalo with a 357, but IIRC, that was with a brain shot. Ted Nugent has supposedly taken a Cape Buff with a 10mm auto, utilizing a spine hit. I wonder fi that was from a tree stand? Bill Cody supposedly took Bison with a .44 Russian revolver, but that was by means oif shooting them in the ear hole, again, IIRC while riding alongside of them on a horse. The revolver was supposedly chosen rather than being limited to a single shot rifle.

When I was in Rhodesia, 1977, I was introduced to a man who had taken 3 Cape buffs with a 357 and an elephant with a .44. Since it's illegal to hunt dangerous game without a pro hunter present, you can bet that an elephant rifle was being aimed at the critter as the client shot it with his pistol! :-). Water buffalo are "commanded" all over Asia with nothing more than a stick, guys. Very few animals charge after being shot. The natives poach elephant with AK's, you know. It's been filmed for TV. They simply stalk to within 10m, fire a full auto burst into one lung, and run like hell. They then wait 24 hours and look for circling buzzards.

Larry Kelly, he of Magnaport fame, said that he took a tusker with a .44 mag, too. So there is no reason to believe that a hot .45 L colt can't handle Cape Buff just fine, actually. When you put a 1/2" diameter hole thru both lungs, that critter is a goner in a minute or two. Its demise is faster if there is an exit wound, to cause collapse of the lungs. The exit wound also produces a more reliable blood trail. The skin of the critter shifts over the entrance wound, quite often, and that means little or no blood trail.

http://www.riflemagazine.com/magazin...d=321&magid=24

Ross Seyfried's Cape buffalo with the .45 warhorse. I would say they are certainly capable of way more than some people think they are, and with most big bore handguns with WFN boolits, penetration certainly is not an issue.

All though I don't doubt any of the mentioned exploits, I adhere to the principal of "Take enough gun", not just barely enough.

No one doubts that you can. The question is whether you should.

Hunting is one thing but defending one's self would be the real issue. If Nugent can hunt a Cape Buffalo with a 10mm then a .357 will work as there is little/no difference between the two.

Just be sure that when your following him up you don't make anyone else be out front. If a person would be silly enough to stunt hunt dangerous game they better have the guts to clean up their own mess.

IIRC Lewis & Clark used air rifles to gather wildlife specimens and to supply meat for the men. They aren't the .177 air rifles we think about but they weren't terribly powerful either.

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Originally Posted by TXGunNut

IIRC Lewis & Clark used air rifles to gather wildlife specimens and to supply meat for the men. They aren't the .177 air rifles we think about but they weren't terribly powerful either.

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Do you suppose they went hunting brown bear with them?

You can kill polar bears with an ice pick. It's just that your margin for error is very small...

There are some hunting venues to which light tackle fishing regimens DO NOT correlate. Just sayin'.

I believe Col Wesson did it in the 30's after the continued use of 38-44 loads. At that time the 357 was loaded factory to around 40,000 CUP +, IIRC. It is currently loaded around 27,000. In a recent Handloader Magazine Mike Venturino shot some loads from a heavy framed 38 special that he refused to shoot from a J frame S&W as he was concerned about the strength of the gun. The gun was a 357 J frame with a titanium frame. Just because something is chambered for a cartridge doesn't make it the right one to use all the time. Also on the N.A. Safari, there were rifles backing up the shooter and no one else ready to slap their tag on the critter over the next ridge. Things change, I am a 357 fan but sometimes we all have to move on.

When hunting in So.Oregon for Bear or whatever I keep a GP100 6" stoked with 200 gr.LFN's. I don't hunt with it but it's my go to if things go awry with my artillery. I wouldn't even think of pulling it on a Cape Buff or a Griz unless I had absolutely no other choice including out running somebody else. I do believe though that it is an awesome cartridge capable of great feats especially in the hands of someone else.

Lewis and Clark discovered that their regular guns were not quite up to grizzly bears. Their 'stopper' on the big bruins was a 20 gauge ball gun.

Lewis and Clark discovered that their regular guns were not quite up to grizzly bears. Their 'stopper' on the big bruins was a 20 gauge ball gun.


L&C air rifle

http://www.beemans.net/lewis-assault-rifle.htm

Fred bear killed everything with a bow, but I recall reading that he shot 4 polar bears before he could call one a bow kill. His backup guys had to shoot the first three.

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Originally Posted by 300savage

Just be sure that when your following him up you don't make anyone else be out front. If a person would be silly enough to stunt hunt dangerous game they better have the guts to clean up their own mess.

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Dittos to that! "Stunt" is the operative word and it would include all game.

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Originally Posted by starmac

Fred bear killed everything with a bow, but I recall reading that he shot 4 polar bears before he could call one a bow kill. His backup guys had to shoot the first three.

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When you saw Fred you had to look close to see the 44 Mag he was carrying as backup.

I would like to have the money it must have cost just so he could say "I killed it with my bear magnum 48"."

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Originally Posted by Bad Water Bill

When you saw Fred you had to look close to see the 44 Mag he was carrying as backup.

I would like to have the money it must have cost just so he could say "I killed it with my bear magnum 48"."

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It paid him back rather quickly I believe. In the 60's everybody wanted a Fred Bear bow.

And mine is still here. :bigsmyl2:

You won't see me bad-mouth the 357 Magnum revolver cartridge--ever. It remains my favorite handgun caliber, period. I was quite happy in 1991 when my old agency approved its use by personnel as a carry caliber in all venues, and have had at least one such revolver in service since that time.

Now as a retired guy, my back-country carry caliber/platform is a S&W pre-glory hole Model 686 x 4". The approved load is now the FBI-touted Federal #357B, a 125 grain JHP running 1425 FPS from my revo. Federal Ammo deserves props for truth-in-advertising here--their ad copy clains 1440 FPS, the 1% fall-off in my revolver is just about meaningless. I prefer the former load for back-country carry, the W-W 158 JHP that ran about 1235 FPS from the 686. It was likely a better big-critter load, and was substantially more accurate at distance.

But big critters AREN'T why the 357 is on board. I have a rifle behind the truck seat if those needs arise. The 357 Magnum goes along because of 2-legged predators, and their numbers at large are on the upswing due to the idiot wind that blows from Sacramento and the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals, demanding that convicted felons spend less time locked up. Meanwhile, the same Legislature that gave California AB 109 is hard at work making firearms and ammo more difficult for law-abiding citizens to obtain. Rucking fidiculous. Yuma, here we come.