Lee upgraded APP press is actually a downgrade in quality

I purchased the Lee APP press a few years ago, and it was wonderful for depriming brass, and sizing bullets. It worked so well in fact that since then I have been going to buy another one so I do not have to convert over from depriming brass to sizing bullets. I finally purchased one last week. I got the APP deluxe because I had the roller handle and even though I was not going to use the priming option I figured I could take that off and put on a regular slide base. When I unpackaged it, I thought this feels lighter than the last one, but it’s been so long since I mounted the last one I wasn’t sure. I got to looking at the vertical slide rods. The new rods are made out of sheet steel rolled and not welded with a long threaded screw running through the center holding it down to the press. The old style were solid steel rods, drilled, and tapped at the end to hold bolts for mounting. The new rods are also quite a bit smaller in diameter than the old rods were.

There is also a cut out in the back, stamped connecting link. It is probably a holdover from one of the automatic priming presses that fed from the rear. This isn’t as big of a deal however, I’m sure some of the rigidity is gone from what once was not even a rigid press to begin with. There were a few other changes but nothing noteworthy.

I called Lee and they no longer support the old press. If you need parts to replace the old carriage or vertical rods, they will give you 50% off an upgraded new press to replace it.

In paid 75.00 for the original press and upgraded the handle for another 16.00. The one I bought last week I paid 99.00 for. I would have sprung for another 20.00 for a press like my original one. It just feels more solid….. for as solid as it can get with that type of press.

So disappointing Lee. Very disappointed in Lee. I think Lee streamlined instead of upgraded.

Attachment 323681Attachment 323682

“Good things don’t last.”

Bean counters at work.

For some reason I bought 2 of the old model press after reading this post I am glad I did. It seams to be this way with everything you buy now days. SAD

I also have 1 of each they both have things I like about them .

i don't have any problems with redding equiptment. "buy once, cry once"

I really like my Dillon 550 that I started with in 1988.

I have a 550 that I got back in 1990. It is my reloading tool. The lee APP is to do processing work. It sizes my bullets and deprimes my dirty brass so I don’t have all that crud getting on my 550. I used to clean with primers in place and then run them through the 550. Deprime/size, powder/flare, seat, and then crimp. I found that even with lean brass, depriming caused a lot of primer grit in and around my ram.

I now can deprime 1000,s of pieces of brass in short time with the APP and all the mess stays away from the Dillon. I then can clean them, primer pockets and all.

The important thing of this thread is to hopefully let Lee know that there is dissatisfied consumers that are disappointed in Lee reduced the quality of what was a great product.

Richard and John Lee understood reloading, manufacturing and what reloaders wanted. I don't think the third generation Lee has that. I'm not trying to make a negative statement about them its just the way it is.

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Originally Posted by Iowa Fox

Richard and John Lee understood reloading, manufacturing and what reloaders wanted. I don't think the third generation Lee has that. I'm not trying to make a negative statement about them its just the way it is.

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Have to disagree. I've never seen Lee or any other company in this hobby do what they are doing now. The APP was and still is a great tool....way better at processing brass than anything up to now.......and the new 6000 pro is very well thought out too. Six stations that actually work well at that price? Lee has always aimed at providing affordable tools to allow more people to be a part of this hobby. I'm thankful for them....and all American made to boot.

Now they are even beta testing products for all to see at the THR forum where reloaders give input and actually effect decisions. You ought to see their new inline bullet feeders....which came about because people on that forum asked about it and suggested such a thing was needed for more calibers at a reasonable price.

Lee spokesman said that yes, replacing the original tubes on the APP was an attempt to keep from having to raise prices, but assured us that it in no way affects or diminishes performance.......and the cut out in the back strap was necessary for the ACP's primer feeder. But they have improved the primer feeder and no longer even produce the ACP, which is now redundant. The APP deluxe does both jobs.

The new APP's are using those parts still.....whether the cut out will eventually go away (would require new tooling....again) now that it's not needed is a moot point. It's still strong enough to do it's job. We will see, I guess. Kudos to Lee for attempting to keep prices down when everyone else is raising them to new heights.

I do understand you GWS. I have a lot of lee stuff because it was extremely affordable. It just surprised me that Lee took a really good product that had hordes of great reviews and then started making it with half the steel and trying to sell it as the same thing or an upgraded product because it does more stuff now. I’m not sure how much they saved going with the hollow tubes but to one consumer it would probably only be an extra 5.00 but to lee, it was 5 dollars more profit on every one they sell.



I’ve got them side by side now on the bench and the old style does feel a bit more solid than the new one. We will see how the new one compares to the old style. One will size bullets and one will deprime brass. I’ll put the beefier one on the bullet job. Now I have to draw up and print a base rail without the primer feeder arm as I’ll never be priming with it.

And I agree that that move may bite them. I'll be honest.....if I was looking at the APP for the first time today with the hollow ram supports.....I may have passed buying one, and missed out on the most unique and useful tools for brass processing Ive ever seen...even at 4 times the price. What sold me was that it is the only single station press with a bullet/case feeder. I have an RCBS summit press, having a similar open face design, but with no feeder.....I mean what other single station press has a bullet/case feeder?....so I bought that original APP and liked it so much, I copied some of it's abilities by a little modding on my Summit. The Summit does have some serious steel in it....;)

https://youtu.be/qfCKRaScrA0

That’s pretty sweet GWS. I built my own bullet sizing press out of a car strut and some 1/8” steel, boxed into a press shape and then was trying to build a self feed to feed in bullets when I saw the lee APP on midway for 78.00 with my birthday pricing. I had a bunch of bullet sizing bushings made for it and everything. That home built press took longer to build than the time it was in use. I got the APP in the mail and the other went to the scrap pile. Still sitting at the top of the pile reminding me how little I think my time is worth.Attachment 324505

Our time we spend is best spent on things that teach us something, or to keep building brain cells........at my age, just watching TV in the recliner is worthless and eventually fatal. Scrap piles are evidence continual learning improves us.....I have one, heck, we all should have one. ;)

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Originally Posted by flybyjohn

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Just dump some JB-weld down those roll pins if you think it's not enough
:groner:

One of the things Lee has done over the years to cut back on costs is to cut back on areas where the strength is not needed to keep the end product within the means of the beginning reloader who may not have the funds to purchase the fancier higher priced units.

Well I just got done depriming half a container of primers worth of 9mm cases. The only thing that broke was the little hook on the case inserter carriage. I 3D printed another one and completed the job. The case inserter on the new press was really tight and wouldn’t slide good so I used the old case inserter and it worked great. Might have to wear the new one down a bit so it slides freely. Attachment 324706Attachment 324707

Anyway, for the way I’m using this press (depriming brass), the skinnier hollow tubes will work fine. I wouldn’t want to be sizing a bunch of bulged cases or resizing a bunch of rifle brass with it. I don’t think it would be study enough for that kind of repeated use.

Another thing is that if your not ever going to use the primer option, the silly priming rail is right in front by the handle. Several times I had the handle up loading brass into the collator and my hand caught the primer rail and almost broke it off. I’ll have to leave the handle in the down position to protect it. I would just get the old style rail without the primer and use that but the depriming base has the lock under the primer rail.

One thing I can appreciate is that the new depriming base works pretty good without the problems the x shell holder had with accepting the brass easily. The problem with the new system however is that on some dirty brass and brass with small primer holes, the brass will get stuck on the depriming pin and get lifted up with the press and then either shoot out when fully lifted , shooting the case out somewhere or stay stuck and come down hard on the next case ready for depriming. Maybe I could get a stronger internal spring that would prevent this.

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Originally Posted by flybyjohn

One thing I can appreciate is that the new depriming base works pretty good without the problems the x shell holder had with accepting the brass easily. The problem with the new system however is that on some dirty brass and brass with small primer holes, the brass will get stuck on the depriming pin and get lifted up with the press and then either shoot out when fully lifted , shooting the case out somewhere or stay stuck and come down hard on the next case ready for depriming. Maybe I could get a stronger internal spring that would prevent this.

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Yes, this is very annoying, I absolutely hate it when this happens. This mechanically happens because the spring overrides the anemic round ledge on the app decaping pins. I think this can be remedied with a small washer in betwixt the deprime pin & spring. I keep forgetting to take the parts to the hardware store every time I go there to test this.

The dirty 45 brass I just deprimed yesterday had about every round sticking. I stretched out the spring ( boy was it hard getting back in) and got down to about every two sticking. I then gave the cases a quick spray of my alcohol and RCBS case lube mix and ran them through and only had about 1 in 20 stick. The 45’s did stick a whole lot more than the 9mm though. So on top of the brass being dirty, the larger diameter also was part of the problem.