Never go in the woods unarmed...

[Tazman1602]

Black Bears don't attack and aren't dangerous............UH-HUH. After teasing me for many years about always having a large bore handgun or rifle with me WHENEVER I go into our woods, even if it's only to cut firewood, my lovely wife of 30 years is now packing EVERY time herself....just 'cause I'm paranoid doesn't mean someone's not out to get me.

Story here: http://www.9and10news.com/Category/Story/?id=260617&cID=1

I'm guessing the kid had bacon grease or something on himself from baiting but am not sure. I would 'reckon that he happened upon a sow and some cubs since there were four of them.

Blackberries here were a bumper crop this year and I've seen beer spore in our back woods all over.

I'd rather lug a gun and not need it than to not lug it and need it....

Art

:bigsmyl2:

[jsizemore]

Heck, I don't go to town unarmed either.

The gun don't do you much good at home. Unless you happen to be home.

[2wheelDuke]

:holysheep

I don't think they allow you to have a sidearm when you're bowhunting though.

[jsizemore]

:holysheep

I don't think they allow you to have a sidearm when you're bowhunting though.

That's why I don't bow hunt.

[frankenfab]

:redneck:I wish I had Bear 'sammich right now!

I only had Black Bear meat twice, but it was fried tenderloin the first time, and a front shoulder cooked as a roast the second time I ate it. Very good!

[missionary5155]

Good evening
I carry a 5 foot spear with me bowhunting... seems the state released numerous panthers years ago to aid with the deer population. Makes a good tool to pick up trash paper.

[hoosierlogger]

In Indiana you can carry while bow hunting if you have a CCW permit.

[jsizemore]

A fella from here (NC) went to Michigan to bow hunt. He arrowed a monster buck ( at least by NC standards) and he and his 2 buds tracked it to a drain ditch/stream. He went one way and his friends went the other. About 200 yards downstream he found the deer when he came from cover and gored the stuffing out of him. Literarily. He spent 3 monthes in ICU. Damn a bunch of bow hunting and running with the bulls. Now gator wrestling is the ticket.

[Old Ironsights]

:holysheep

I don't think they allow you to have a sidearm when you're bowhunting though.

Depends on the State. Indiana "allows" CCW for Self Defense while Bow Hunting.

Gaak, should have read down farther.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

:holysheep

I don't think they allow you to have a sidearm when you're bowhunting though.

Well, I assume it's allowed in Wisconsin. A Friend of mine is bow hunting in some land (a friend of a friend of a friend's Dad's land). He's said he's a little afraid out there, and says he carries a .357, unless he's breaking the law ?
Jon

[thx997303]

Black bears.

They're bears.

Don't tell me they aint dangerous.

They're bears.

[Mal Paso]

..But on my property they do it right in the middle on the road. This pile is about 12" x 14". Sorry about the focus but that's a Fir seedling on the side. And that's why I carry a BFG!

[Johnch]

:holysheep

I don't think they allow you to have a sidearm when you're bowhunting though.


Legal to carry concealed while doing all types of hunting here in Ohio with a CCW permit

Not many bears in my part of Ohio
And not many in the state

But I still carry while hunting
Because of the other nasty critters found in the woods
Normaly they walk on 2 legs

John

[ktw]

Well, I assume it's allowed in Wisconsin. A Friend of mine is bow hunting in some land (a friend of a friend of a friend's Dad's land). He's said he's a little afraid out there, and says he carries a .357, unless he's breaking the law ?
Jon

Wisconsin is not a 'shall issue' state and concealed carry isn't allowed there for the general public. Open carry is legal. I'm not a WI resident, but I'm pretty sure open carry is legal during archery season for personal protection as long as you don't try to take game with it.

Shooting at a game animal with a handgun during archery season without the appropriate tags and outside of the appropriate firearms season would be breaking the law.

-ktw

[leftiye]

In Indiana you can carry while bow hunting if you have a CCW permit. Hoosierlogger

Heh, Heh, The fishy gamey service in utah will cite you if you're in the field with a gun during any open season that you don't have a license for. They're incompetent, can't catch poachers, so they ticket us for exercising our 2nd Amend. rights. Friend of mine was out plinking with a .22 during Elk season, and got cited. Just does wonders for my respect for my state govt.

[waksupi]

I have a feeling some here may be afraid to walk out to my outhouse in the dark. Black bears, grizzly, mountain lions, and moose around me. Never been bothered by them. Although I did have a friend in an outhouse, with a griz outside looking in through the window. He said he was in an appropriate position for the encounter.

[Three44s]

Washington state finally came to it's senses and allow a sidearm with Bow or Primative weapon.

It was about time!



Three 44s

[Bret4207]

My suspicious nature noted the young fellow was "...at a family party..." earlier in the day. That says booze to me, and booze and bears? I can picture someone, say myself 35 years back, with a load on maybe thinking it'd be bright to chase a cub and ending up treed and then coming up with a story like this to cover my stupidity.

Not saying it happened, but booze and hunting don't mix.

[45 2.1]

Good evening
I carry a 5 foot spear with me bowhunting... seems the state released numerous panthers years ago to aid with the deer population. Makes a good tool to pick up trash paper.

You would be right on the release......... we have them and see them. The neighbors see them fairly often, but I only get to hear them snarl while in the woods while turkey hunting. Here kitty kitty...........................

[Three-Fifty-Seven]

Well at least according to the story . . . he let someone know where he was planning on being . . .

[cptinjeff]

In Florida, they made it legal only 2 years ago to ccw carry (with permit) on the WMA's. I got a warning two years before that for ccw carry during bow season (the officer asked and I told him):roll:. I just couldn't see myself out there with the gators, bears, panthers, and the most dangerous .....two legged drunks.... without a gun. Didn't make sense that I could carry to the woods but then have to go unarmed once I arrived. At least they got it right now.

[GP100man]

Black bears.

They're bears.

Don't tell me they aint dangerous.

They're bears.

I agree with thx !!! A Bear is a Bear !!!

I`ve even had possums stand there ground & charge me !!

Animals do strange things when protectin young or cornored or hungry !!!

:redneck:

[Hurricane]

A bow and broadhead arrows makes a powerful weapon. Why would you need a handgun if you are armed with a bow and arrows, are hunting , and ready to use them?

[DLCTEX]

We don't have bears, but a wild hog can be even more unpredictable.

[Old Ironsights]

A bow and broadhead arrows makes a powerful weapon. Why would you need a handgun if you are armed with a bow and arrows, are hunting , and ready to use them?
Because on a bear they make a powerful irritant unless you get a good Vascular/CNS hit.

[MtGun44]

I had a friend near me attacked by a 6 dog feral pack while deer hunting. Fortunately she
was hunting with a 10mm Delta Elite 1911. Came into a 25 ft clearing and the dogs were
bunched up at the base of a tree on the far side . When she stepped into the clearing,
they turned in unison, silently fanning out to a semicircle and coming in on her in a clear
attack crouch. She shot at the two extreme ends of the semicircle then the center
(in front of her) and hit at least one, I saw it leaving the area with tail between it's legs
and blood on the chest. She is an IPSC shooter, so shot very fast.

She believes that with a bolt action rifle (which she uses most of the time) she would have
been seriously hurt or killed.

Back to the original point - don't go into the woods unarmed. Until that point, I had
not considered feral dogs as a threat. I like dogs, but they are pack predators and when
dumped and hungry - there you are - made out of meat. I was nearby, I saw one wounded
dog leave and talked to her a couple minutes after (I heard the shots and figured she had
a deer down, I usually field dress her deer when I am there) and she is normally pretty calm
and was really shocked by the attack.

Bill

[Mallard57]

A guy from the coast got chewed up the other day by an eight year old, 148 lb.black bear sow at his Lake Wenatchee cabin. A poor huckleberry crop is the reason given that there has been numerous bear encounters recently. The bear tore that gentleman's face up. A while back Washington state voters passed a measure making bear baiting and hound hunting illegal, lots of bear and cougar encounters are now the result.
Jeff

[500bfrman]

I have a feeling some here may be afraid to walk out to my outhouse in the dark. Black bears, grizzly, mountain lions, and moose around me. Never been bothered by them. Although I did have a friend in an outhouse, with a griz outside looking in through the window. He said he was in an appropriate position for the encounter.

your feeling is correct

[Recluse]

Legal to carry concealed while doing all types of hunting here in Ohio with a CCW permit

But I still carry while hunting
Because of the other nasty critters found in the woods
Normaly they walk on 2 legs

John

Likewise, in Texas if you are hunting are fishing, you don't need a CHL to have a handgun on or near you.

I always take either a S&W 686 or Mod 29 with an 8 3/8" barrel in a shoulder holster with me hunting. Rattlesnakes are thick down here and wild hogs can be on you almost before you know it.

Handgun is still handier to wield than a long-barrel shotgun or bolt action rifle.


I have a feeling some here may be afraid to walk out to my outhouse in the dark. Black bears, grizzly, mountain lions, and moose around me. Never been bothered by them. Although I did have a friend in an outhouse, with a griz outside looking in through the window. He said he was in an appropriate position for the encounter.

Maybe so, but remember that you live in a remotely populated area. Almost twenty years ago, we could go to our camp in northern Maine and see evidence of bears and moose, but never actually see one. But as the citiots and M*******s continued to move in and encroach (and leave their trash and their messes), encounters, especially with bear, started becoming more frequent.

Only saw a moose one time and he was fifty or so yards off. Fortunately it was not during rut but after spring thaw. He was too busy chomping on the vegetation to care what this Texas flatlander was thinking.

Black bear in Maine? Ran into them probably a bit more than half a dozen time at our camp late evening. Yelling or throwing a small firewood log at them did the trick. A few times I fired a few feet in front of them at the ground and THAT did the trick. We had a big blueberry patch on the backside of our land, with Roach Pond being on the other (we were right on the water), so the bears would eat blueberries then stroll to the lake for a cool sip.

Whenever we would have the dogs up there, we never saw or even saw signs of bear anywhere around the camp--even with the increased presence (and trash and mess) of the citiots and M*******s.

I considered the city-idiots (hence: citiots) a bigger threat than I did the wildlife.

:coffee:

[Lloyd Smale]

There have been only two reported cases of bear attacks in Nothern MI that i know of in the 45 years ive been hunting. Now considering how many bear are probably wounded by bow and gun hunters every year and arent recovered and that out of them im sure some recover and are wondering the woods pissed off id say that in reality you have about as much of a chance of getting mauled as you do being hit by lightning when the suns out. Im not saying it cant happen and i know a few people that were mock charged in the spring by sows with cubs but guys i have a neigbor lady that has chased them off her porch with a broom! Weve had them eating out of the bait pile in the middle of the day at camp while the kids were playing in the yard. They are normal a very docile animal and living up here I know for a fact that the locals are much more nervous about the increasing wolf population then about any bear bothering them. I usually have a sixgun on my hip when i go into the woods but its because i like sixguns not because i think i need to protect myself from bear. Another point is that anyone who would go bow hunting for deer smelling like fried food sure isnt much of a deer hunter and is lucky it was a black bear that came for him and not a wolf as the wolves would have finished the job.

[hickstick_10]

Carry a can of spray and stay the hell out of dense bush if your alone.......HELLO[smilie=s:

Not to be callous but what do people THINK WILL HAPPEN? Say all you want but most people aren't going to draw there pistol and fan off 5 shots if a bear sneaks up and ambushes you for food. Heres a shocker, BEARS CAN BE QUIET AND SNEAKY!!

Every couple years some woman on her time of the month decides to go hiking or some idiotic man goes hunting alone with a half closed bottle of deer p!$$ in his coat pocket and gets chewed on some. Better yet are hikers with some dog they let off a leash in the bush, dog harasses the bear and comes back to the owner.........bringing the bear with it.

A gun isn't going to save you in the likely event you don't shoot with benchrest accuracy at a charging bruin, and you end up wounding him and end up lunch. Cloud of that spray blinds him and he can't smell you (the stuff hurts, trust me on this).

Best bear defense? Hunt with a friend, hike with a friend, be aware of your surroundings, make your presence known and keep the damn dog on a leash.

Of course if you can make the snap shot on a bears tiny sloped skull and brain pan moving at 30 miles an hour your good to go. Most men can't do it though, myself included.


For some reason, I've never run into to many trappers toting a 500 S&W

[thx997303]

Well, by your reasoning I ought not carry a gun anywhere, at all.

Better to have a chance than just be screwed.

[waksupi]

Carry a can of spray and stay the hell out of dense bush if your alone.......HELLO[smilie=s:

Not to be callous but what do people THINK WILL HAPPEN? Say all you want but most people aren't going to draw there pistol and fan off 5 shots if a bear sneaks up and ambushes you for food. Heres a shocker, BEARS CAN BE QUIET AND SNEAKY!!

Every couple years some woman on her time of the month decides to go hiking or some idiotic man goes hunting alone with a half closed bottle of deer p!$$ in his coat pocket and gets chewed on some. Better yet are hikers with some dog they let off a leash in the bush, dog harasses the bear and comes back to the owner.........bringing the bear with it.

A gun isn't going to save you in the likely event you don't shoot with benchrest accuracy at a charging bruin, and you end up wounding him and end up lunch. Cloud of that spray blinds him and he can't smell you (the stuff hurts, trust me on this).

Best bear defense? Hunt with a friend, hike with a friend, be aware of your surroundings, make your presence known and keep the damn dog on a leash.

Of course if you can make the snap shot on a bears tiny sloped skull and brain pan moving at 30 miles an hour your good to go. Most men can't do it though, myself included.


For some reason, I've never run into to many trappers toting a 500 S&W


I see we are basically "neighbors", and have the same impression of bears. The further one lives from the problem, the greater the misconception.
I have the belief that the only real use of a pistol in a bear attack, is when the bear has you down, you can put a round into the side of the skull as it is chewing on you. Hitting the brain on a moving bear most likely isn't going to happen, considering how narrow the brain pan is.
And like you say, they are FAST!

[hickstick_10]

Well, by your reasoning I ought not carry a gun anywhere, at all.

Better to have a chance than just be screwed.

A gun makes some people belligerent and emboldens them to wander off the beaten path, and a less perceived feeling of vulnerability in the woods.

Bad stuff since it = (I dont give a damn if its cubbing time, as long as I got my trusty 44 I can go anywhere I want)

Wrong.

And like I said, most men (myself included) would likely only end up wounding a bear, and then your chances of being screwed go up pretty damn fast.

You do realize that spray blinds you for damn near a half hour and you can't smell. I'd rather have a unwounded, blind and sentless bear after me then one who can see, hear and smell me that was wounded.

But to each there own[smilie=1:

[rhead]

If you do manage to get up the tree it may get you back down quicker.

[Old Ironsights]

...You do realize that spray blinds you for damn near a half hour and you can't smell. I'd rather have a unwounded, blind and sentless bear after me then one who can see, hear and smell me that was wounded...
What spray is that? I take LE grade OC and CS direct face hits frequently (training) and occasionally (use of force) for work in Corrections.

Just makes my eyes sting a little, but I can still fight, restrain, &/or shoot without too much problem.

IMEX "bear spray" has less punch than the stuff I train on. So I'm not so sure a bear will really care all that much.

[hickstick_10]

What spray is that? I take LE grade OC and CS direct face hits frequently (training) and occasionally (use of force) for work in Corrections.

Just makes my eyes sting a little, but I can still fight, restrain, &/or shoot without too much problem.

IMEX "bear spray" has less punch than the stuff I train on. So I'm not so sure a bear will really care all that much.

What was the point of this info session?:veryconfu Run into a lot of bears in a prison? As all I got from this post was your ability to go "Steven Segal" on someone with a face full of mace.

Lets leave the "He man" **** out of this discussion.

I honestly can't tell you what the spray was because it was over 15 years ago and I was playing with a can that my dad kept in his truck, and was spraying it at bees and a gust of wind came up....(stupid kid).....and it was most horrendous.

I can also tell you I put up a cloud of it when a bear was downwind near a foot bridge, the damn smell of it was enough for him to leave, very weak and dispersed cloud when it got to him (wasn't a big bear I'l admit).

But like I said to each there own, some like there guns and if it makes you feel better in the bush no ones stopping you.

Although this article would be superior to mace I admit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3CzYw5-qdA

[thx997303]

A gun makes some people belligerent and emboldens them to wander off the beaten path, and a less perceived feeling of vulnerability in the woods.

Bad stuff since it = (I dont give a damn if its cubbing time, as long as I got my trusty 44 I can go anywhere I want)

Wrong.

And like I said, most men (myself included) would likely only end up wounding a bear, and then your chances of being screwed go up pretty damn fast.

You do realize that spray blinds you for damn near a half hour and you can't smell. I'd rather have a unwounded, blind and sentless bear after me then one who can see, hear and smell me that was wounded.

But to each there own[smilie=1:

So, you spray the bear, and the unthinkable happens. You get it in your eyes.

You're screwed.

And you're going to qualify your argument with morons? Please.

Anybody who carries a gun and assumes the "god mentality" is a moron.

You see, either you are screwed with a chance, or you're screwed.

I'll take an extra chance myself.

[Finster101]

Sorry, why would I go into the woods without a sidearm when I don't leave my house without one?

[hickstick_10]

Sorry, why would I go into the woods without a sidearm when I don't leave my house without one?

Lot of grizzlies in Florida?

No one says don't go into the woods without a gun (although I can see how you may have deduced that)

Just suggesting spray may be a superior bear deterent then a pistol.

But I should have known better then to do that on a gun forum:groner::groner:

[firefly1957]

This is a local story and whether the guy smelled of bacon grease or not the bears showed NO FEAR of him and attacked while he was in a tree stand. DNR ( it stands for Damn Near Russians) does not care a bit about the publics safety but our law makers told them our concealed Pistol Licence(s) are good while we bow hunt so we can carry while in woods even while bow hunting. I have had a dog pack stock me while in the woods but on sight of a pistol they ran in all directions. Have also been approached by people up to no good the sight of a gun has a good effect even though it was still holstered.
The DNR decided they are going to track the bear(s) down and destroy then this needs to be done before they decide a kid at the bus stop with lunch in hand is food. I suspect this whole problem may have been caused because some FOOL thought it is neat to feed the bears and they lost the fear they need of man. The really sad thing is the number of people who blame the hunter and say this is natural for bears any bear that does not fear man should be in a zoo or in the ground after meat is processed. :groner:

[fishhawk]

is this really some thing worth arguing over? any thing is better than nothing. steve k

[Finster101]

Lot of grizzlies in Florida?

No one says don't go into the woods without a gun (although I can see how you may have deduced that)

Just suggesting spray may be a superior bear deterent then a pistol.

But I should have known better then to do that on a gun forum:groner::groner:

Did'nt say I would not gear up appropriatly. You assumed too much from my post. I just rode a motorcycle from Florida to Alaska. The Canadians would not be too friendly about my hand gun at the border so I bought bear spray. Figured it would work on man or beast till I got legal again. If I were to be in an area where bears are common I would carry spray. If I am dove hunting, boar hunting, quail hunting, or walking any where, I am carrying a side arm.

[waksupi]

I will say, the Counter Assault spray made just down the road from me, is a hell of a lot more potent than any other spray you may have ever run across. If you are going to buy bear spray, get this stuff. I don't care how much you have been around any military or LEO stuff, this spray will take the paint off of your eyeballs.
Most of you know who Jack Hannah is. He had a run in with some griz just north of me a month or so ago. When the bear charged, he tried the bear spray. High winds, and it blew away. He was able to dodge to the side, and get the spray in an effective wind pattern. He was lucky to be able to do that, as many places around where it happened, if you had to do any dodging, that may be over the edge of a 1000+ foot cliff.

[rhead]

Take both. Better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it. Are either of them really that heavy?

[500bfrman]

Carry a can of spray and stay the hell out of dense bush if your alone.......HELLO[smilie=s:

Not to be callous but what do people THINK WILL HAPPEN? Say all you want but most people aren't going to draw there pistol and fan off 5 shots if a bear sneaks up and ambushes you for food.

For some reason, I've never run into to many trappers toting a 500 S&W

if I am not going to fan five shots wouldn't I want a 500?

[firefly1957]

I have never used a pepper spray and have been told that it is illegal in Michigan to posses "BEAR SPRAY" do they all mist? I do know to prevent the user from getting blow back from pepper spray discharge some companies use a foaming formula this would seem best in a bear spray.

[Finster101]

I Have a Kimber Guardian Angel. It is an oil base and is propelled by a pyrotechnic charge. It has two charges. I had one getting older and had my wife and then my mother use them on a cardboard target at about 20 feet. The bright yellow dye makes it easy to put the stream where you want it and it is very tacky. It did not bounce off, rather it stuck and ran down the cardboard. I think it would be very effective as I found out removing the target just how much of an irritant it is. It stayed with me for days.

http://www.kimberamerica.com/shop/product.php?xProd=2

[rkrcpa]

I first began using bear spray back in the mid 80's, in fact, I have a can of Counter Assault sitting on my desk as I type. I always carry it with me when I travel to D.C. since I can't carry a pistol.

I prefer the fog type dispenser because it does not require the precision of a stream of liquid. If you get sprayed with this stuff I don't care how tough you think you are, it takes the fight out of you.

[kyswede]

Kentucky now allows bowhunters to carry a handgun if they have a CCDW license.
kyswede

[Lloyd Smale]

had to chuckle yesterday afternoon. Ive had a bear comming into my deer blind that goes about 300 lbs. I dont have a tag and my buddy does and wants to shoot it as hes never shot a bear. Ive killed enough deer that giving up the stand doesnt bother me so we went out yesterday to put some real bear bait out. We had the truck parked about right in the bait pile and were unloading bait when i looked to my left and there was the bear about 40 yards away. He was sitting there on his rump like a dog waiting for us to leave. I had a 44 mag sitting on the truck seat and told my buddy to grab it and shoot the dam thing. He grabbed the gun and was shaking so bad he couldnt shoot. The fact that i was busting a gut laughing at him probably didnt help matters. The bear got tired of it a got up and wandered off. Now ive watched the same guy shoot probably a 100 deer through the years doing crop damage and hes a cool cucumber with a gun but that bear scared the **** out of him. He probably read to many posts like these. Just to many guys that want to think there in africa chasing dangerous game. The only bear that makes me nervous is a wounded one or a sow with cubs and even a sow with cubs will leave you alone if you have enough common sense to back away.

[firefly1957]

I know what you mean about your friend some people can not cope with even a perceived danger very well. Me and a friend were camping at Schlatters lake in the tip of the UP when my dogs hair all went up and he made the scariest sound I have ever heard from a dog. I pulled a pistol and turned as "something" we assume a bear stepped on and broke a branch about thirty feet behind us. My fiend froze could not move could not reach for the 357 he had in a holster for about 2 minutes ! With good flashlights and a couple of road flares we never did see what it was but it stalked around camp for 4 hours. next morning we searched for tracks and only found ours and a single LARGE bear track in mud about 50 yds away. The branch we heard snap was about 2-3 inches across and I could stand on it without breaking it.
The thing to remember in this thread is not how animals bears included normally act but as in this case something out of the ordinary happened. It is better to buy insurance than not to have it when needed and I have used a pistol to prevent my own injury sometimes just the sight of it will do. Even most dogs will stop advancing if you pull a gun and go the other way.

[9.3X62AL]

I've only had one "bad time" with a bear, and it didn't require shots to be fired. It was still disquieting, just the same.

I carry sideiron in the back-country pretty routinely, usually the 686 x 4". There is also a Mini-14/Condition 4 behind the seat of the truck. Bears aren't the reason for the armament--I live less than a gas tank's distance from the Los Angeles/Orange County/Inland Empire megapolis, and in the mountains or desert that border that cesspool you never know what you'll stumble upon. I strive to avoid such encounters, but did have a disquieting incident with a 2-legged varmint a few years ago that came to an abrupt halt when Marie got the Mini-14 out from behind the truck's seat. G-- d--- meth freak.

I am not of the opinion that having a firearm in my possession somehow makes me larger than my environment. One of the negative outcomes of the USA's catch-and-release criminal justice system is its seeming reinforcement of violent or menacing acts by people of predatory mindset. The presence of a firearm in the possession of a potential target of such depredations is a tangible check against such activities.

If our Canadian poster has a problem with me being cautious in an uncertain environment, I submit that I have a right to access the public lands of my country for recreation and enjoyment. If some predator--2 or 4 legged--elects to attack and gets bullets installed for his trouble--maybe the aggressor shouldn't have attacked in the first place. I know this viewpoint is far too practical and way too politically-incorrect, but I hold the belief that decent people have a right to enter environments with a reasonable expectation of survival--whether it be a desert dry wash or an urban parking garage. In a sane world, the aggressor/attacker should be the one taking the greatest risks, NOT the law-abiding citizen exercising his/her rights to access facilities and areas open for that purpose. Firearms are a means to uphold those civil rights, to fight back against aggression and attack. I AM NOT A VICTIM TO BE CHOSEN AT LEISURE BY SOME CRETIN.

[Tazman1602]

Man I didn't mean to create a world debate with this post.

There is sure one in Emmet county Michigan now also about the DNR's plan to euthanise the dog gone bear.................the "gooders" are coming out of the woodwork.

Anyway my original intent was just to say in my humble opinion anyone who venture's out into the woods without proper precautions (take that how-some-ever you wish) is an idiot.

Old joke up here about two guys in the woods backpacking who see a really ticked off bear that is charging them.

First guy shucks his ruck and starts taking off his shoes and putting running shoes on. Second guy says "GET UP MAN! YOU CAN'T OUTRUN A BEAR"......

First guys says calmly "I ain't gotta outrun the bear, all I gotta do is outrun YOU..................."

Art

[Blackwater]

Back when I was 12 or 13, I read in Field & Stream's "Tap's Tips" that a man ought'a carry fire and a kinfe with him always, especially when in a car or afield. That made a lot of sense, and since then (about 1960), I've rarely put my pants on without a lighter or matches and a knife of some sort. It's amazing how often one has use for a pocket knife. Friends borrow it all the time when thay need one, especially the girls I've worked with. Here in the south, we don't have nearly as much occasion or as dire a need for fire, but there ARE some times when an emergency fire could keep a fella' alive, or signal, or whatever. There just aren't many situations that can't be survived with just fire and a knife.

Field and Stream used to be a great magazine. I sure miss ol' Tap Tappley. But then, I miss a lot of those old writers. They were a lot more than just salesman for the newest whizbang creation the mfg's can come up with. But us ol' farts just tend to think like that, I guess. My 11 yr. old grandson seems to find a lot of sense in stuff like that, though, so .... maybe it ain't ALL just bein' older????

[22to45]

I live in Canada, and usually use 500gr 45/70 brand bear spray. good for the confidence.

[hickstick_10]

I've only had one "bad time" with a bear, and it didn't require shots to be fired. It was still disquieting, just the same.

I carry sideiron in the back-country pretty routinely, usually the 686 x 4". There is also a Mini-14/Condition 4 behind the seat of the truck. Bears aren't the reason for the armament--I live less than a gas tank's distance from the Los Angeles/Orange County/Inland Empire megapolis, and in the mountains or desert that border that cesspool you never know what you'll stumble upon. I strive to avoid such encounters, but did have a disquieting incident with a 2-legged varmint a few years ago that came to an abrupt halt when Marie got the Mini-14 out from behind the truck's seat. G-- d--- meth freak.

I am not of the opinion that having a firearm in my possession somehow makes me larger than my environment. One of the negative outcomes of the USA's catch-and-release criminal justice system is its seeming reinforcement of violent or menacing acts by people of predatory mindset. The presence of a firearm in the possession of a potential target of such depredations is a tangible check against such activities.

If our Canadian poster has a problem with me being cautious in an uncertain environment, I submit that I have a right to access the public lands of my country for recreation and enjoyment. If some predator--2 or 4 legged--elects to attack and gets bullets installed for his trouble--maybe the aggressor shouldn't have attacked in the first place. I know this viewpoint is far too practical and way too politically-incorrect, but I hold the belief that decent people have a right to enter environments with a reasonable expectation of survival--whether it be a desert dry wash or an urban parking garage. In a sane world, the aggressor/attacker should be the one taking the greatest risks, NOT the law-abiding citizen exercising his/her rights to access facilities and areas open for that purpose. Firearms are a means to uphold those civil rights, to fight back against aggression and attack. I AM NOT A VICTIM TO BE CHOSEN AT LEISURE BY SOME CRETIN.

We're talking about bears...........not meth heads............sheesh and I'm not anti gun so no need to the knee jerk reaction.

No one said don't carry a gun in the woods, just dont expect your pistol to save you, because in most cases it is a puny and poor excuse for a stopping weapon for bears. Carry a rifle if you must, at least you have a better chance of killing it. If you want a reasonable chance of survival leave your pea shooter at home and go pick up a marlin in 45-70 or a win 71 in 450 Alaskan.

I'm not anti handgun BTW, I'm just anti cowboy who thinks 6 slugs from his hogleg is going to drop any thing that walks. Especially people who are most likely under the impression that every walk in the woods is "condition red". You have every right to access public land, but dont expect support when you take a man stopping firearm for defense against big game. My tiny little 30-30 has more ME then buffalo bore 44 mags, its absolute lunacy to chose a pistol over a rifle.

If your really bothered by that, even us commie, gun hating Canadians have access to a better tool for bears thats legal to tote around in the bush.
http://www.wanstalls.com/Tactical-Shotguns/files/page17-1002-thumb.jpg Buddy totes one all the time when he walks his dogs, much better then a handgun in my opinion, and completely legal to own and carry in the woods.

Men have killed elephant with the 475 linabaugh, would you consider a 475 linabaugh the ideal tool to stop an elephant charge?

Don't most national parks forbid firearms in there borders (I know of some do but not sure how broad it is in the states)


Edited to add: Something really needs to be said as well, is its pretty obvious many who contributed to this board have not hunted bear ( I do not profess to being an expert either).

My question to you is.............what would you do if you DID shoot the bear and it runs away? Would you go back to your car and go home? Would you phone the game warden if you remembered? Would you tell the story at the nearest bar for a free beer?

Because you have created a big safety problem for other people in the area that you shot the bruin. Now theres a bear that can see and smell (which he wouldn't have been able to if you sprayed him) and he is also PO'd and wounded. And people may be hiking that same trail you were on. A hunter would pursue the game and make sure it has a clean and humane death, not to mention so others in the area wont be in danger.

Are you going to pursue the bear with your snubby 44 mag with 2 shots left in the cylinder? Because eny ethical hunter or gun owner will tell you its your RESPONSIBILITY to swiftly and humanely kill whatever animal you shoot, for its sake and your neighboors.

All of a sudden your side iron looks like the pea shooter that it is, might have been nice to have a good rifle. Even spray at least wouldn't have made you as potentially liable, I bring this up because suing is a big thing in the states.

If your not physically able to tote a sensible rifle and don't trust the spray, your safest choice........for you and others......... is to stay home or go to the city park.

Aren't those "self defense" types always preaching to use the right tool for the job?

[9.3X62AL]

Understood, sir. My equipage for bear country is a CZ-550 in 9.3 x 62. 286 grain NosParts at 2400 FPS should have the desired effect, if required.

Not meaning to disparage anyone from Canada, I have hunted and fished in your country and have the highest respect and affection for the nation and its people. I don't enter the back-country in "Condition Red" as you sarcastically describe, but having policed southern California for almost 28 years I am fully cognizant of the potential for hazard that exists for anyone living in this carjacker's theme park where the criminal justice system is run like a bass fishery.

Canada strikes me as a far more gentle and refined social environment than that which I've lived in for much of my life. I've had to make adjustments to those realities that I feel are measured and justified responses to my life experiences. No mall-ninja nonsense here, sir--I have been shot and shot at, have had a carjacking attempt made on me, and have a well-rounded depth of experience as a law officer and firearms trainer. That said, be so kind as to not disparage my views. I come by them honestly.

There are a variety of reasons why someone may choose to go armed in the back-country. Nasty critters are among those reasons--I just included the 2-legged variety in my remarks, since they are far more likely to pose a threat in my environment.

[hickstick_10]

No disparaging of your views were intended sir, just frank and honest conversation.

I apologize if my generalizations made you think I was refering to you, it was not intended so.


For my bear defense I drink a liter (1/4 gallon abouts) of vinegar, and hope im to sour for them to eat.

[9.3X62AL]

Now, THAT might work! Maybe Chile Rellenos could have a similar effect--MUI PICANTE, OSO!

[Recluse]

Hell, after reading all this, I now have a new strategy whenever I go into the woods.

I'm going to take some Counter Assault PLUS my handgun (.44 Magnum).

If a bear comes my way, I'm going to fan a few shots at him from the Mod 29 to give him pause. Then I'm going to quickly turn the Counter Assault spray on myself and give myself a good faceful--might even spray some inside the front of my pants.

I figure if that spray does everything everyone familiar with it says it will, then I'll be screeching, hopping, howling and dancing like a friggin' banshee on LSD and that poor bear will immediately take a dump and run for his damned life.

Y'all can be bear bait if you like. But not this ol' Texas boy. No, siree.

:coffee:

[hickstick_10]

http://www.yosemite-sam.net/Sam/Sam-Side.jpg

[waksupi]

Hell, after reading all this, I now have a new strategy whenever I go into the woods.

I'm going to take some Counter Assault PLUS my handgun (.44 Magnum).

If a bear comes my way, I'm going to fan a few shots at him from the Mod 29 to give him pause. Then I'm going to quickly turn the Counter Assault spray on myself and give myself a good faceful--might even spray some inside the front of my pants.

I figure if that spray does everything everyone familiar with it says it will, then I'll be screeching, hopping, howling and dancing like a friggin' banshee on LSD and that poor bear will immediately take a dump and run for his damned life.

Y'all can be bear bait if you like. But not this ol' Texas boy. No, siree.

:coffee:

Let me know when you are going to test this out. I want to watch. And take videos!

[oneokie]

Let me know when you are going to test this out. I want to watch. And take videos!

I'll buy a ticket to the event.

[Echo]

I have a friend that will put it on his web site...

[leftiye]

Anybody read the story (in one of E. Keith's books IIRC) about the Montana feller who went out to the road to get the mail and met a mama bear a baby bear and a papa bear?

Daddy bear charged this unfortunate, who pulled out a SAA Colt .45 and gave him one between the eyes. This upset mama bear (who had some romance in mind), and she charged this rancher too. Same result. Baby bear (the only one with any sense it seems) tried to run off, and the rancher put the last three boolits into him and went up to the house and got the dogs to chase him down. Guy just didn't like bears. Kinda went with those times.

Enough gun? (BTW, as the story read, the bears were of the grizzled presuasion).

[Old Ironsights]

...If our Canadian poster has a problem with me being cautious in an uncertain environment, I submit that I have a right to access the public lands of my country for recreation and enjoyment...
Funny(?) story about our Northern Brethren...

I was traversing the Northern Border Crossing at North of Dawson City one spring (1995) en route from AK to the Lower 48.

I was driving a soft top 4x4.

The Mountie at the crossing asked the expected "Do you have any weapons/firearms" question.

When I said "Yes" he answered.... "Good... the bears are just coming out of hibernation and they're hungry."

Somthing tells me that the Youkon Mounties are a bit more down to earth than the Lower 48 order Mounties... ;)

[shootingbuff]

Lot of grizzlies in Florida?

No one says don't go into the woods without a gun (although I can see how you may have deduced that)

Just suggesting spray may be a superior bear deterent then a pistol.

But I should have known better then to do that on a gun forum:groner::groner:

Oh my lol

[thx997303]

Ha, I think you were the only one limiting the conversation to a pistol.

My RIFLE goes with me into the woods.

My pistol too, but it aint gonna be good for bears.

Oh, and neither my pistol, nor my rifle sends blinding spray back into my eyes if the wind is wrong.

Just sayin. [smilie=1:

[hickstick_10]

Ha reading must be a great effort.

Check my posts on page 3, concealed in the writing is me saying a long gun would be nice to have.

Just saying ;-)

[shootingbuff]

Way back yester year when I was in high school we started geting a dog problem in the state. Never to be one afraid of a dog plural has me concerned. I usually carried a 22 pistol for snakes but stated carrying long guns and then to med cal center-fire pistols for the ease. Then more BGs were around with at first pot fields and then meth labs. I always carry were permitted and seldom venture were I can not.

That stated - the two best ideas I had for an attacking bear are: 1. was mentioned before and that is someone with you who runs slower! 2.The second is to have a pistol with the sights removed. With the sights removed you wont be worried about watching the front sight and when the bear takes it away it wont hurt as much when said bear shoves the pistol up high.

I would think the best medicine would be a 12 bore loaded with slugs. The problem is one hitting the target and two ensuring the bear understands that the 12 bore loaded with slugs is supposed to mean something to it.

Cold Steel has a sticky foaming spray that sounds impressive and looks good on video. I was told a long time ago that all pepper spray does is season the meat the bear is about eat ;-) This stuff from Cold Steel sounds impressive for a spray.

Everyone stay safe.

[thx997303]

Ha reading must be a great effort.

Check my posts on page 3, concealed in the writing is me saying a long gun would be nice to have.

Just saying ;-)

Actually, reading CAN be a great effort for me. It's not a problem with the reading, but when the headaches get bad enough, I often can't see straight.

Anyway, much of our disagreement was BEFORE you said anything about a rifle.

Just saying.

[shootingbuff]

wrong thread - oops

[leftiye]

Ah'm too fat to run (wouldn't werk anyways). Guess I'll hafta shoot straight or else. Cain't really believe that puckerin' up will do any good (too ugly). Anybody feel like rolling up in a fetal position with their hands behint their necks?

[thx997303]

Hard to shoot from the fetal position.

[dualsport]

I say never go unarmed. I remember when I was young and dumb and.., well, you know. It never occurred to me I should have a weapon. Went woods roaming, back country loafing, wilderness camping solo. Not a care in the world. It was great. It seems that time and cumulative experiences have caused some trepidations and a nervous twitch. Now when I'm out there alone if I hear a twig snap behing me I'm wheelin' baby and bringing the muzzle up right now. Survival instinct I guess. I've almost been 'et a couple times, don't like the thought of that at all. Go in the woods unarmed? You're kidding, right? Still, I miss that ignorant bliss.

[leftiye]

Exactly. Plus - why not have a gun anyway? I like having a gun in the woods. Isn't it part of the equipment? Like matches. Like a knife? Like a canteen? (hydration pack? whut baloney!)

[thx997303]

I personally prefer my camel bak.

Guess that's just the Army experience.

[Three-Fifty-Seven]

"Never go in the woods unarmed" . . . how about "Never go ANYWHERE unarmed"!:mrgreen:

[deerslayer]

We don't have a bear problem here. Some feral dogs and a few coyotes but I have not heard of anyone being bothered locally by them. If I am hunting I do have a gun with me.

I never worried about it when cutting wood until one day I was cutting up a tree in my Father in laws yard about dusk. The neighbors wife came over and demanded we stop as her baby was asleep. She was absolutely furious and rather argumentative and I asked if she could close the windows for about 5 minutes and i would be done with the saw. This was not gonna work for this lady and my Brother in law began to argue with her. I decided let's not argue and told her she needed to leave the property and she immediately left. I fired up the saw and went to cutting and just as I started my brother in law taps my shoulder as I look up I see her husband in a dead run like a bull with his head down headed for me. He was still out about 25 yards when i pulled the chainsaw from the cut and just held it in front of me wide open. Thankfully he stopped about 10 yards away and I did not have to gut the fella. He never said a word just turned around and ran back home the same way he came. I am 6'7" and about 280 and my brother in law is 6"3" and about 270 so we were quite a bit bigger than this fella I am not sure why he stopped or what his intentions were but now I usually have a gun with me even when cutting wood.

[9.3X62AL]

"YOU CAN HAVE MY STIHL--WHEN YOU PRY IT FROM MY COLD, DEAD FINGERS!"

That guy was a moron, and his wife was another. They sound like meth trash to me. Or a related sub-species.

[deerslayer]

"YOU CAN HAVE MY STIHL--WHEN YOU PRY IT FROM MY COLD, DEAD FINGERS!"

That guy was a moron, and his wife was another. They sound like meth trash to me. Or a related sub-species.

No they are actually middle class hard working people. He is actually a plumber just the same as I am. Not sure what happened that day and I haven't spoke to them since then. My father in law says they mentioned it to him and he suggested he get a bigger stick before he jumps on either one of us and to bring a friend if he intended to whip both of us. He then told them they were not welcome in his yard until they learned to behave themselves and they have not been back.

[BOOM BOOM]

HI,
I have seen both bear & mt. lion where I deer hunt.
It is illegal to have a handgun during bow or black powder, even in camp.
As I sleep in a tent, I say screw them & their unconstitutional rules. I sleep w/ my 44.

[BOOM BOOM]

HI,
Oh yeah I forgot, I do not go in the woods unarmed, whenever!:Fire::Fire:

[thx997303]

BOOM BOOM, the Utah legislature does NOT let the Utah DWR the authority to regulate the carry of firearms at all.

Not only are their rules unconstitutional, they're also against Utah law.

Tell that to some fish cop though. They wont listen.

[a.squibload]

In Colorado, a handgun cannot be considered concealed if you are legally hunting, CCW not required.
Haven't read about bow hunting but I don't think that changes anything.

I carry always, why would the woods make any difference?
I don't carry to make me braver, just safer.
Some people try to impose their ideas without caring about the effect on those on whom they are imposing.
Same with criminals and wild animals.
I would leave an area to avoid a serious problem, but that doesn't always work.
Swinging a 3½' rifle around to come on target doesn't always work either.
Sometimes the notorious handgun is necessary for good to prevail.
Whether you will be prepared is up to you.
Your decision has no effect on mine.
Have a nice day.

[firefly1957]

Michigan has been back and fourth on concealed carry while bow hunting the DNR (Damn Near Russians) write any rules they wish our lawmakers finally told them that If we have carry permit we can carry while bow hunting . Under Michigans laws if you do not have a carry permit and the grip of your gun is covered with a shirt or coat even though holster plainly shows you are breaking the law. Same goes for motor vehicle if you have a gun in a car it is a concealed weapon unless unloaded cased and not reachable by anyone. Things are getting better for gun owners hear I hope this trend continues as we throw the BUMS out.

[a.squibload]

Yeah, if they can't get you to turn in your gun, the least you could do is wear a big sign on your hat
"Look out, I have a gun!"
I heard you should wave it around so for sure it ain't concealed!
Can't wait to see how the voting goes tomorrow.
Er, I mean today.
Sorry, running off at the keyboard again, pay no attention...

[Mumblypeg]

If they would pass a law... disarm the bears ... ah, I mean, no claws and no teeth then they couldn't hurt you... but then I guess they would be... gummie bears!:wink:

[leftiye]

Yup, And then they swatted you? Do yuh think we could have their front legs removed too? (but whut if'n thay sat on yuh?)

[crashawk]

we only have little bears here in missouri (compared to what they have out west) but there are plenty of other animals here that are nasty. feral pigs, rabid coyotes, feral dogs and we now have cougars again, thank you mo conservation dept. I had a young cougar try to get in my deer stand a few years ago. rifle season so I wasn't exactly under armed but it's tough to aim a scoped rifle straight down. .357 pulled out of my pack and took care of said problem. some years the cougars keep the deer off our place, quickest fix is to start target shooting at the house, they don't like the shooting and the deer are used to it. and no, we don't actually shoot at the house.

Jason

[a.squibload]

Friend of mine shot a deer through the window, didn't even have his pants on.
(Glass is cheap.)
No, I don't know why the deer didn't have his pants on.

[BAGTIC]

My suspicious nature noted the young fellow was "...at a family party..." earlier in the day. That says booze to me, and booze and bears? I can picture someone, say myself 35 years back, with a load on maybe thinking it'd be bright to chase a cub and ending up treed and then coming up with a story like this to cover my stupidity.

Not saying it happened, but booze and hunting don't mix.

Booze and firearms don't mix either

[firefly1957]

He was at a family dinner and he was BOW hunting in a tree, no body mentioned booze though Michigan DNR blamed him for "smelling like food" . DNR may have a point but not yelling screaming hunters fault, bears have lost fear of man because some fool feeds them.
Last heard DNR was going to kill the bears you would not believe the number of people who think it is ok for a bear to chew on a person . Our DNR has been told by our Lawmakers that we can carry a pistol for protection while bow hunting but I do not think they like it and to get permit you must be 21 and a bunch of other restrictions.

[Down South]

I did not read all the replies to this thread but I sort of have the drift. I pack everywhere. Bow hunting, rifle hunting, it doesn't matter and to hell with with state or federal rules. I'd rather be tried by 12 than carried by 6 has been my rule for a long time. If I'm concealed then nobody knows unless I need to pull it. It doesn't get pulled unless need be so who gives a rip?
Black Bears, I have a thread here.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=98992

[captain-03]

Sorry, why would I go into the woods without a sidearm when I don't leave my house without one?

My thoughts exactly!!