Why is Starline brass cheaper

[ghh3rd]

I'm going to be stuffing some 45-70 brass as soon as it and the other .45 components arrive. I was wondering why Remington and Winchester brass were so much more than the Starline brass?

Also, what the consensus on trimming 45-70 brass - necessary?

THanks - Randy

[lwknight]

Remington and Winchester have older and more American aristocratic sounding
names.
Starline is good stuff.

Trim? maybe when needed. Some folks trim all brass just for uniformity and others don't care as long as it chambers.

[Mal Paso]

If you want to pay more Cabelas has Starline at about the same price as Remington or Winchester. I'm afraid though if you buy direct you'll have to buy it Without the Markup.:smile:

[Shiloh]

I have Starline .45 auto Rim Brass. It outlasts the Remington so far, and WAS cheaper.

Shiloh

[home in oz]

Count your blessing that it IS cheaper than the big name brands.

[rintinglen]

I have had some good luck with Starline brass (including their 45-70) but I also have had some bad. I bought a box of 9 MM Largo brass that suffered over 50 percent case splits on the first firing. Their 38 specials run short and I recommend that all Starline brass be trimmed, because they are not uniform. 50 38 special cases ffrom a low of 1.138 to a high of 1.148 with most about 1.144. Given that the recommended trim length for 38's is 1.145, it makes it a little rough. I use a Lee Factory Crimp Die, so length is not quite so critical, but they should be more uniform and longer.
However, I bought some 45-70 brass that was very good and was 2.10 with a plus or minus of only .003.

[Johnch]

I have abused 50 rnds of Starline 45/70 shooting close to max loads in the H&R
So far that batch has held up better than the Rem and Win did

Other than stepping on 1 case
I have not had any problems
And I believe I have shot them 7 times , with 1 trimming to true them up

IMO Starline brass is better quality than Rem for sure and a lot cheaper when you buy 500 or 1K at a time

John

[220swiftfn]

Re the price..... company policy, definately not a lack of quality!!!


Dan

[geargnasher]

When I buy pistol brass new, I ONLY buy Starline. I don't know what alloy they use, but it lasts and lasts and lasts. I have some .45 Colt (fired only with standard loads, but not mild by any means) that has been reloaded ten times with zero splits. I keep waiting for the mouths to split where they have been roll-crimped and flared so many times, but no problems yet.

Needing a trim seems to vary by lot, some are irregular, some aren't. The only "problem" I've yet experienced was with some nickel cases that had tight primer pockets, almost had to swage them but all ok after a firing or two.

I don't have any experience with their 45/70 cases, but if I were looking to buy new, that's what I would go for.

Everyone tells me to order direct from Starline and save a bunch of money, supposedly they are a little over-cautious with their "out of stock, backorder" listings and backorders are usually filled much faster than the site predicts.

Good luck,

Gear

[captain-03]

Picked up 100 pieces of 500S&W Starline -- have been very good brass -- and cheaper!!

[mike in co]

there maybe a n evil plot to the cheaper but better starline brass.

think about thie, if you use brass, you typically need bullets too.....so what if some evil company started selling brass cheap so you would buy bullets...and maybe some of those bullets would com from another company they owned......

its all an evil plot...that works great for us......



mr owns sierra bullets, and just down the street is starline brass run by mrs......an evil plot if i ever saw one....


mike in co

[Maine1]

I love starline brass. I bought 2K 10mm brass, and i'll get 2K more when i can afford it. Good stuff. I just wish i could get 1-2K of the nickel at those prices.

[nicholst55]

A couple of things to be aware of with .45-70 brass: 1) It varies tremendously in length between the manufacturers. IIRC, Starline and Winchester are good to go; Remington and Hornady, especially their LeveRevolution brass, are short. Not a huge issue when shooting smokeless powder, but it can cause problems when shooting BPCR. 2) Starline .45-70 brass is 'harder' than other manufacturer's brass, and should be annealed before firing when using black powder. 3) Winchester brass is the thinnest of the lot, and has a measurably greater powder capacity. This is most important when loading black powder, especially for longer ranges. The .45-70 kinda runs out of gas at extended ranges. I wouldn't stand in front of the target at 1,000 yards by any means, but more powder doesn't hurt!

[missionary5155]

Good morning
No pretty labeled box. You buy it in a bag in bulk numbers. They sell tons when in stock so deal in volume.

[94Doug]

...and no bottle neck brass, IIRC.

[felix]

Olin has been making custom "slugs" from non-ferrous alloy for years. No doubt, Starline is a major customer. A slug is a cylinder of alloy sized for a specific drawing die. They are annealed to order before shipping to the drawing customer. ... felix

[cajun shooter]

Starline 45-70 comes with a small information sheet that tells you the necks are thicker than the other brands and to anneal them before use. Everything I shoot is with Starline.

[jlchucker]

Olin has been making custom "slugs" from non-ferrous alloy for years. No doubt, Starline is a major customer. A slug is a cylinder of alloy sized for a specific drawing die. They are annealed to order before shipping to the drawing customer. ... felix

Olin Brass is/was part of the same conglomerate that used to own Winchester--both ammo and arms divisions. They make more than just cartridge brass, and for lots of customers. Doorknobs, lipstick tubes, all kinds of stuff was/is made from Olin brass. They used to have a brass mill in the Winchester complex in New Haven when I worked there. Felix, you're right--they sell those slugs (called "cups" when I worked there) to lots of suppliers. What happens and in what sequence after the first-draw operation in a manufacturer's process may vary to some degree, but at the "slug" stage, it's probably all pretty much the same.

[Three44s]

Make mine .......... Starline!!


Three 44s

[101VooDoo]

When I buy pistol brass new, I ONLY buy Starline.



+1

Jim

[montana_charlie]

Also, what the consensus on trimming 45-70 brass - necessary?
That depends...are you shooting black powder?
With BP, the case will shorten when fired the first time. If you full-length resize it you will recover most of the loss, but the case will never stretch enough to need trimming.

If you shoot brass (fireformed or resized) that is shorter than the chamber, you are likely to see leading in the throat. You can prevent that by fitting the case to the chamber, or by adjusting the bullet seating depth to leave a grease groove half exposed at the rim of the case mouth.

If you try paper patching with short brass, you will get paper rings left in the chamber.

CM

[JDFuchs]

If Starline makes the caliber I need It will be the only new brass I buy. I just wish they made 7.62x54

[WARD O]

Like nicholst55 said, for 45-70 brass you pretty much need to anneal new Starline before use - especially when using black powder - so you can get consistent neck tension. There is also a noticable variation in case capacity when comparing Win, Rem, and Starline. I shoot a lot of Starline in my 45-70's and have always been pleased. I have found the most "issues" and variations with my Winchester 45-70 brass (some don't even want to fit my RCBS and Redding shell holders.)

I also shoot a LOT of 32 Mag and there it's been either buy Federal ammo or Starline brass and I don't like the factory ammo price. I have never had to throw a defective Starline 32 case for any reason and I can't say that about the few Federal brass I've acquired.

Do you shoot any odd calibers - try ordering your 50-70 govt or 50-90 Sharps brass from Win or Rem. Starline certainly helps us odd balls with our unusual toys...

Thanks Starline - I like your products.

Ward

[home in oz]

It is high quality stuff, too.

[Changeling]

There flash holes have expiration dates.

[lwknight]

I can recycle expired flash holes. They can also be traded in on lube grooves.

[mpmarty]

Bought a few hundred Starline 10mm brass and it is the nicest I've ever had the pleasure of using. Never a problem with Starline.

[Charlie Two Tracks]

Another satisfied customer here. Ordered direct from factory. That's the only brand of brass I plan on buying.

[geargnasher]

I can recycle expired flash holes. They can also be traded in on lube grooves.

:holysheep There he goes again......:bigsmyl2:

Gear

[ghh3rd]

I purchased a batch of Starline .44 mag brass about a year ago and sized and loaded it. I didn't know that I should have annealed it. And all of this time, I could have been getting 1" at 100 yds with my Ruger SBH :-)

I'll pay attention to the tips about annealing Starline beginning with the 45-70, and will search for forum about how to anneal. My .44 brass has all held up well, and I've managed to get 2" groups at 50 yds with a red dot on some days which I've been happy with. Would it still be beneficial to anneal the .44 after it's been used several times? Is annealing redone periodically? Sure I'll find out more with a search.

Thanks
Randy

[selmerfan]

I'm not a happy Starline customer! I used Starline .454 Casull brass and loved it, still have enough .357 Mag Remchester that I don't need to buy new yet, but my biggest beef with Starline is that they DON'T make .357 Maximum brass!!!!! Why not, it would sell well and I'd be a happy customer. :)

[Doby45]

Would it still be beneficial to anneal the .44 after it's been used several times? Is annealing redone periodically? Sure I'll find out more with a search.

Thanks
Randy

You can anneal any time prior to the neck splitting. ;)

[WARD O]

I've heard of the annealing being most useful on black powder cartridge shooting especially at long range. Anneal to get a more consistent neck tension which gives a more uniform bullet release. The BPCRs rainbow like trajectory can be seriously affected by variations in muzzle velocity which results from variations in neck tension.

While the same line of reasoning would apply to handgun shooting, the effect would likely be much less noticable.

I have annealed all my Starline brass that I shoot in my black powder cartridge rifles but I have not done any annealing of my Starline pistol brass.

I understand that many of those that serioudly compete in long range BPCR shooting - 800, 900, & 1,000 yards - anneal between every loading. They build special machines for this degree of annealing.

When I anneal I simply use a hand torch and a pail of water. This technique has served me well.

Ward

[ghh3rd]

Ward - since the 45-70 is known for the rainbow trajectory, perhaps annealing would help at its longest effective range. Sounds like an opportunity for an experiment -- perhaps 20 cases annealed and 20 not and see if I can find a difference.

I am going to have fun with my new toy (1895)

[WARD O]

Yes, why not? The premise is good and it's always fun to have a project to be working on with shooting and reloading along the way. Good Luck.

Ward

[Fly-guy]

I am not a happy starline user- my 380 throws their brass everywhere so I seem to loose alot of it. Outside of that, I"M HAPPY with starline brass.:bigsmyl2:

[MtGun44]

Should have ordered the 'short range brass'

:bigsmyl2:

Bill

[SierraWhiskeyMC]

Good to read so many nice comments on Starline brass.

Wasn't familiar with it at all until I found some last year that my Dad had bought for his .44 Magnums.

I was hesitating about buying some .45-70 to try out Granddad's 25-cent 1884 Trapdoor Springfield with - now it's a done deal. :D

Nice that they put the note about annealing the case necks on the website.

Note that you only want to anneal the necks - NOT anywhere close to the base, or you would create a very hazardous situation. Heating the necks evenly to 750°F and standing them up in water should do it. If you drop the heated cases in a bucket of water, you will probably make them harder. They need to cool fairly slowly.

[ghh3rd]

Heating the necks evenly to 750°F and standing them up in water should do it.

Saw an article where someone put their cases in water about 2/3 of case length deep, leaving the top exposed They said this assured that only the necks would be annealed. Has anyone here tried this method?

[BAGTIC]

I use several calibers of Starline brass and have alwats been satisfied. My only complaint is that their .41 Long Colt brass is absurdly expensive.

[9.3X62AL]

there maybe a n evil plot to the cheaper but better starline brass.

think about thie, if you use brass, you typically need bullets too.....so what if some evil company started selling brass cheap so you would buy bullets...and maybe some of those bullets would com from another company they owned......

its all an evil plot...that works great for us......



mr owns sierra bullets, and just down the street is starline brass run by mrs......an evil plot if i ever saw one....


mike in co

Yeah, Mike--a vast right-wing conspiracy, for sure! :) Just like donut shops open 24 hours a day to fatten patrol officers, draw us in on mid watch for the coffee--then feed us maple bars. Totally diabolical.

[Crash_Corrigan]

The first thing I did after I decided to get a .44 Special revolver was to order 500 new cartridge cases directly from Starline. I had cases and molds and all 500 cartridges assembled long before I ever saw the gun in my hands.

Unhappily I chose a brisk loading utilizing Unique powder, for which I do admire quite a lot, that called for 6.6 Gr under a 250 gr LWSC boolit.

Oh they worked allright. Too good. Out the the flyweight CA Bulldog Pug they flew true and hit hard. On both ends. Once I had fired two rounds I had enough fun and I declined to finish off the cylinder. My hand was numb.

Yes while much younger I agreed to fire my "friends" .44 Mag Ruger BH etc. and I had ripped the skin offa the back of my finger while firing only one shot and endured the laughing and taunts of my "friends". I never did buy one of the much bragged about big .44's and I have long ago moved away from the "friends" of my youth.

Howver I always have had a yen for a big bore revolver with some history behind it. Now I just need to go out and get a Ruger BH with a 5 inch tube to fit those other 498 rounds I have sitting around awaiting a launch.

[Fly-guy]

Should have ordered the 'short range brass'

:bigsmyl2:

Bill

Can't get much shorter (range) than a 380!

[XWrench3]

my experience with starline brass has been very good. i bought 100 nickle plated cases (because that is all they had in stock) a year and a half ago, haven't had to scrap any yet. all of them have been loaded at the very minimum of 3 times, and most much more. as for trimming, i find that is in directionatly proportionate to the load. the hotter the load, the more you have to trim. i have a couple of loads, that REQUIRE trimming after 2 loads. that is where brass "wears out", under hi pressure loads. this was my first expereince with nickle plated brass. given the choice, i will buy straight brass cases. but if i need brass, and nickle is what they have, i would buy them again. the only thing i do not like about the nickle cases is they are more dificult to resize.

[John Boy]

Also, what the consensus on trimming 45-70 brass - necessary?
Never trim any case before it is fireformed. Fireform them and you will find the cases to be shorter. Then resize the cases and you will find them to be longer. This does not continue to infinity though.

The 45-70 cases @ 2.10 then fireformed will shorten to around 2.095+. Resize they will stretch back up to 2.05+. When 45-70 case shortens below 2.095, ie 2.080 to 2.090 ... time to use a case stretcher or chuck them

[ghh3rd]

Crash - you outa write a book called "The Adventures of Crash" :)