45 colt molds for 45 automatic pistols

[plaz]

I am new at this.

I own a sig 45 automatic 220 pistol for which I set out to buy a bullet mold.

I looked at the Lyman molds and instead of buying one listed in the 45 automatic column I bought one listed in the 45 colt column. I bought a Lyman mold # 454190 which is a 250 grain 454 inch diameter mold. I sized it down to a 452 inches 250 grain bullet.

A little late I am now asking the question. Is this sized bullet OK to use in my 45 caliber Sig 220 automatic pistol even though its mold was not listed in the 45 automatic column?

I can't seem to find a recipe for it?

[DLCTEX]

It will work fine, although it is a little heavy for the 45 ACP. You will have to find acceptable loads for the heavier boolit. I have used the 454-255 boolit in mine, but it may require a heavier recoil spring to prevent hammering of the frame. I also installed Shok-Buffs in my 1911. The Sig may be different, as I am not familiar with it. Pay attention and do not reduce the powder space in the case by seating the boolit too deep to get it to chamber,as this will cause pressure spikes.

[geargnasher]

Yes, I fully second everything DLC said. Unfortunately, you may have to seat that boolit a bit deep to allow it to function in the Sig, so work up your loads carefully. Also, you'll find that most .45ACP brass starts to thicken in the case wall area just south of where a normal 230-grain bullet base would be when seated, so when you go deeper with the 454190 it can bulge the case and swage the boolit base a bit. Winchester (W-W headstamp) brass was the most user-friendly with these heavy-for-caliber boolits.

I've run the gamut of 250-ish grainers through the 1911 platform, and the 454190 is my favorite. I wish I had another mould exactly like it but shortened to 230 grain, it feeds better than any other cast boolit I've tried, even better than the 452374.

Gear

[HeavyMetal]

Check out the Speer number 12 loading manual.

In the 45 auto section it shows loads for a 260 Hp bullet, jacketed of course!

Looks like that bad boy really sets down in the case but that should get you a start load or two to begin with.

Never been a fan of heavy boolits for the caliber idea, although I think you just ordered wrong in this case.

Hope the info helps you out.

[Shiloh]

That is a heavy boolit. My heaviest is a LEE TCTL boolit that drops at 238 gr.
I really like the LEE 200 TLSWC. Accurate and feeds flawlessly

Shiloh

[Heavy lead]

I shoot a lot of these boolits out of the colt, always wanted to try them out of an auto, just haven't I have run 150 grain boolits, but a bigger meplat, might have to try a few. I do think a spring change is prudent, and a shok buffer (I use the buff in all my 1911's) as one earlier poster said. I always thought a hollow point 454190 would be a dandy. Wonder how it would feed.

[mroliver77]

Good info above. Onlky thing I could add is I use a slower power for caliber when doing this Unique or even Blue Dot will soften the "thump" some in my most humble opinion.
Jay

[Dale53]

plaz;
I hate to throw water on your purchase of the .45 Colt bullet for your .45 ACP Sig but in my opinion it is NOT a good idea. Heavy bullets for the caliber can batter the frame of your auto pistol. Autos need balanced loads for long life. While it can be done, it is not advisable.

The Lyman 452374 round nose bullet is the cast bullet "standard" for the .45 ACP if you want a round nose. It weighs 225-230 grs and the gun is regulated for that bullet weight.

If you want a light target load, then the Lyman 200 gr SWC's are a good choice (my personal favorite is the MiHec clone of the H&G #68). It shoots EXTREMELY well in my 1911's as well as my S&W 625's, cuts a clean hole in the target and reduces recoil if shot at target velocities. It will also feed well in modern .45 autos. In fact, it feeds reliably in my Kimber 3" barreled CDP Ultra II!

Dale53

[gray wolf]

If all this is new to you and you insist on using that bullet please listen to what has been said about it. You can get hurt, or your pistol can get hurt if you mess up.
There is a little ( big ) learning curve in this reloading game.
I have seen it before--some folks just think some other bullet is cooler looking than the recommend ones.
If it were me I would #1 sell or trade the mold for a proper 45 ACP mold.
#2 I would shelf this mold until a latter date and get a proper 45 ACP mold.
There are many things for new casters and re loaders to get past --without starting in a gray area.
Just my thoughts, but like said, if you insist on going with it listen to what has been said in the other posts.
The only Dog we have in the fight is your good health.

Sam

[cajun shooter]

You should if you have the funds buy the RCBS 45-201-swc It is a good weight for 45's and worked in everything I put it in. That 454190 was the original bullett for the 45 Colt and I have owned about three of the molds. They all dropped bullets in the 454-455 range and weigh about 255-260 with lube. Your performace will be poor at best. Stay in the 200 range with a tc type of bullet for your best results. I would try to have my bullets at 452 in lead as the correct 45 bbl will be in the 451 area.

[plaz]

If it means anything I took some measurements with my calipers as best I could and found the following. After installing the 45 colt bullet into tjhe 45 acp winchester case I have a space between the bullet and the w231 powder of only 0.164 inches. The overall col is the same as the col with the jacketed bullet.

I would appreciate any comments about these findings?

[exile]

"Handloader" magazine no. 240, April 2006 has an article by Bob Campbell entitled "Super Heavy Bullets in the .45 Auto". As I don't own anything in that caiber I won't comment, but it looks like he is loading bullets as heavy as 300 grains in the article.

exile

[Texasflyboy]

A little late I am now asking the question. Is this sized bullet OK to use in my 45 caliber Sig 220 automatic pistol even though its mold was not listed in the 45 automatic column? I can't seem to find a recipe for it?


Here is the essentially the same bullet but in hollow point form. My current recipe for my cast bullets which drop at ~225 grains is 5.0 of W231.

http://hgmould.gunloads.com/molds/22/22_10.jpg

It is my go to load for all my 1911's in .45ACP.

You may find that you have to seat this bullet a bit deeper than other .45 designs when used in .45ACP cases. You will note that there is a bit more full size OD ahead of the first lube grove where it meets the curve of the ogive coming back. Most .45ACP ball designs have the Ogive curve meet the first band at a point, this one does not so the effect is it has a bit more bullet diameter sticking out of the case when loaded to normal .45ACP overall lengths. Seating the bullet deeper solves this problem but you need to watch pressures.

Note than mine is lighter than yours due to the hollow point cavity. Yours @ 250 grains will have more pressure concerns.

Hensley & Gibbs #22 Hollow Point Conversion (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=67967&referrerid=559)

[GBertolet]

A lot of shooters use the 250 gr bullet in the 45ACP for IPSC competition. At the 165 power factor ( about 660 fps ). The load is real gentile recoil wise, and easy on the gun at the 165 power factor, which is the reason it's popular in this sport. But for general use in shooting full power loads, the recoil is brutal and really beats up the gun. I would not use this bullet weight for general use. Stick with the 200 - 230 gr bullets. You will be glad you did.

[sourdough44]

I went with a 45 acp mold to use the bullets in the 45 Colt & Schofield also. The mold is a Lee .452 200 grn 'TL'. So far I have loaded them in the Colt & Schofield, not acp yet. I think my favorite match with these bullets are an upper charge(listed data) of Titegroup in the Schofield.

[bigboredad]

plaz

I'm sure if you wanted to sell that mold or trade it you could find someone on here that would. Heck I have a lee truncated con tumble mold that I hate if you want it you can have it for postage just send me a pm

[plaz]

A lot of shooters use the 250 gr bullet in the 45ACP for IPSC competition. At the 165 power factor ( about 660 fps ). The load is real gentile recoil wise, and easy on the gun at the 165 power factor, which is the reason it's popular in this sport. But for general use in shooting full power loads, the recoil is brutal and really beats up the gun. I would not use this bullet weight for general use. Stick with the 200 - 230 gr bullets. You will be glad you did.

You folks convinced me to buy a 45 colt gun which I wanted anyway.
The gun I would like to buy is a 45 colt Ruger Bisley Vaquero.

The trouble is that I have read all sorts of forums about the different Ruger Blackhawks and Vaqueros:
- Some say Blackhawks are better than Vaqueros.
- There are new and old versions of Blackhawk and Vaqueros. Each have their own supporters.
- There is some mention of using only Ruger loads in some cases.

All these conflicting inputs are very confusing to me when trying to arrive at the best gun to buy.

I would appreciate some inputs from you folks with your recommendations for a 45 colt stainless Ruger single action gun and why? I prefer to buy a new gun.

Thank you very much.

[Dale53]

I have both a Ruger Bisley Vaquero in .45 Colt and a Ruger SS Bisley .45 Colt/.45 ACP Convertible. Both are excellent in their own right.

However, the Vaquero requires that you settle on one bullet and one load. You are not apt to be able to regulate the fixed sights for more than one load. As a general purpose revolver, that is VERY limiting.

The Blackhawk has adjustable sights that will allow you to EASILY adjust the sights for most any reasonable load and bullet. Mine, being a convertible, allows the use of .45 ACP's in the second cylinder. For me, that is a real treasure. For some one else, maybe not so much...

If you want to use the revolver for a variety of different tasks, then, by all means, get the adjustable sighted revolver. I shoot a LOT (5000-7500 centerfire shots a year) and I sure would not want to be limited to a single fixed sighted gun.

Keep in mind, that fixed sights are great if all you are going to be doing with your 1911 .45 Auto is shooting IPSC, or with your revolver shooting Cowboy but these are typically "one bullet, one load" games. If you want to target shoot AND hunt - that normally calls for a light load and a heavy load. They shoot to different points of impact and can only be done efficiently with adjustable sights.

We see a lot of people that are big on "tradition" with fixed sights but many of them don't really shoot that much.

One more thing - most of the Ruger Revolvers in .45 Colt in recent years are shipped with undersize cylinder throats (they shoot ok with jacketed ammo but do NOT work well with cast bullets). Both of my revolvers required reaming for best performance. Cylindersmith.com will do the job for very reasonable charges if you are not equipped to do yourself (you only have to ship the cylinder) and that together with a trigger job will give you an absolutely EXCELLENT revolver.

Dale53

[frankenfab]

I would get the Bisley Blackhawk (RB45W) and ream the throats if needed. I agree with those that said to shy away from using that boolit in the .45 ACP.

[plaz]

I would get the Bisley Blackhawk (RB45W) and ream the throats if needed. I agree with those that said to shy away from using that boolit in the .45 ACP.

Wow the Blackhawk sounds like the gun I should buy. I appreciate that input.[/I]
The news that current Blackhawks require reaming of the cylinder throats is disappointing news. I don't like buying a new gun that requires rework for proper operation. I expect a new gun to be ready in all respects. Do all the Blackhawks require this rework of the cylinder? How can I tell which Blackhawks require this rework?

[shooterg]

I think y'all have the right idea - buy a mold, any mold, then you have justification to buy a gun it will work with !

[bigboredad]

not all blackhawks need to be reamed I have 3 rugers .45's 1 has .453 throats one has .452 and the last one is kind of all over the place however it was made during the early nineties and for some reason that was a troublesome time for ruger throats however my point they all shoot good 2 shoot great the third is just so so but still not bad. You wont know til you get and shoot it

[NickSS]

I have tried your bullet in my Ruger P90 and it worked fine but I now use a lee 200 gr RF 45 colt bullet in both the 45 colt and the 45 ACP. It works great in the colt for SAS shooting and plinking and in the 45 acp it shoots accurately and I love the big flat nose on it. I started using it when I wanted to load a couple boxes of 45 acp for an upcoming match at my club and did not have enough SWC bullets and I had several hundred of the colt bullets cast and lubed. So I loaded them and found that they fed very well in both my 1911 and P90 and shot as well as the SWC I had been using in it. Now that the only bullet I use in my autos which is good as I have a six cavity mold in it.

[geargnasher]

Wow the Blackhawk sounds like the gun I should buy. I appreciate that input.[/I]
The news that current Blackhawks require reaming of the cylinder throats is disappointing news. I don't like buying a new gun that requires rework for proper operation. I expect a new gun to be ready in all respects. Do all the Blackhawks require this rework of the cylinder? How can I tell which Blackhawks require this rework?

When you look at what you'll pay for a new Ruger of any kind vs. an equivalent in another brand, you'll understand why we wouldn't hesitate to recommend a gun that may require some touch-up work.

The SBH is a little heavier and not quite as streamlined as the classic-looking SAA-styled New Vaquero or the Bisley. You will be well served by any of them, but keep in mind that the small frame New Vaquero is rated for standard pressure loads, where as the SBH can handle +p loadings should you have masochistic tendencies.

Gear