general question on boolits

[Charlie Two Tracks]

Let me see if I have some of this right. The first thing you want to do is make sure that your boolit is 1-2 thousandths larger than your bore. The next thing is to match your powder to the hardness of your booit. So if I have a boolit, say 12BHN I can get leading by pushing it too slow and also too fast or is leading just caused by improper size and withing reason, it doesn't matter how hard or fast ( or slow) I push the boolit? Right now I have 60 lbs of smelted wheel weights, 60 of range lead and 60 of isotope lead. It makes me wonder if I should mix all the stuff together and have just one mix..... ramblings of someone new to this art.:veryconfu

[sergeant69]

damn good questions and i am looking forward to the answers too! c'mon gear, where are you?

[mooman76]

There is no one thing that causes leading. There are many that can cause it. You have the biggest factor pegged though. Getting the correct size. That's what you need to do is get the correct size and go from there.

[runfiverun]

gonna confuse you some here.
my higher/highest [rifle] velocity boolits match the bore diameter.
for general stuff oversized is the way to go.
starting the boolit easy helps softer alloy go along better.
i'd have no problem mixing what you got into one big batch of alloy.
then adjust the tin as needed and keep the consistency.

[geargnasher]

Based on experience, not Richard Lee's ramblings, I too have found high-velocity rifle (2200+ fps) gets best performance from 20+ bhn, water-dropped WW sized right to the groove diameter or maybe a few tenths over. Of course that's 40-45k c.u.p., and it WILL make the boolits seal.

Now on to the question: It depends.

1. WW probably has the most antimony, but little tin. AC = 12-14 bhn IME, WD 23bhn.

2. Range scrap is anywhere from 8-12 depending on how much "hard-cast" stuff is in the mix, shotgun slugs, buckshot, .22lr, and almost all j-word lead cores are almost pure. (5-6 bhn).

3. I understand that isotope containers are about 10.5 bhn with some tin in them, and are about perfect for handgun and low-medium pressure rifle.

Depending on your use, I would mix equal parts of each to make about 30 lbs of alloy, and see how it does based on the above. If you need harder stuff, save the wheel weights for that because they heat-treat well. Otherswise, it should be about perfect for general use all mixed together in approximately equal amounts.

Gear

[Charlie Two Tracks]

Thanks guys. That's what I needed to know to get a good start.

[454PB]

My advise would be to never mix large batches of alloy. It's easier to reproduce one you like than it is to "un-alloy" a ton of lead.

[Bret4207]

Let me see if I have some of this right. The first thing you want to do is make sure that your boolit is 1-2 thousandths larger than your bore. The next thing is to match your powder to the hardness of your booit. So if I have a boolit, say 12BHN I can get leading by pushing it too slow and also too fast or is leading just caused by improper size and withing reason, it doesn't matter how hard or fast ( or slow) I push the boolit? Right now I have 60 lbs of smelted wheel weights, 60 of range lead and 60 of isotope lead. It makes me wonder if I should mix all the stuff together and have just one mix..... ramblings of someone new to this art.:veryconfu

Well, fit comes first. As a general rule a larger boolit has more chance for successful shooting than a skinnier one at normal cast velocity/pressure. When you get up in pressure bad things can happen. IMO as you go up in pressure a softer launch helps things, a lot.

I've never seen a properly fitted boolit lead at slow velocity. I have seen them blow nearly apart by high pressure/speed. I'm not a big fan of the obturation idea. It can go too far sometimes.

I like to mix big batches. Then you can juice the resulting alloy in a smaller batch if needed.

[sergeant69]

Based on experience, not Richard Lee's ramblings, I too have found high-velocity rifle (2200+ fps) gets best performance from 20+ bhn, water-dropped WW sized right to the groove diameter or maybe a few tenths over. Of course that's 40-45k c.u.p., and it WILL make the boolits seal.

Now on to the question: It depends.

1. WW probably has the most antimony, but little tin. AC = 12-14 bhn IME, WD 23bhn.

2. Range scrap is anywhere from 8-12 depending on how much "hard-cast" stuff is in the mix, shotgun slugs, buckshot, .22lr, and almost all j-word lead cores are almost pure. (5-6 bhn).

3. I understand that isotope containers are about 10.5 bhn with some tin in them, and are about perfect for handgun and low-medium pressure rifle.

Depending on your use, I would mix equal parts of each to make about 30 lbs of alloy, and see how it does based on the above. If you need harder stuff, save the wheel weights for that because they heat-treat well. Otherswise, it should be about perfect for general use all mixed together in approximately equal amounts.

Gear

first of all, whos RICHARD LEE?
second, heres my game plan......whaddya think? i'm going to cast for 30-06, 30-30, .44mag, .40cal, 45acp-so far. all will be shot at med. velocity. so i am slugging all the bbls and sizing one/two thousand oversize. i am casting WW, adding a little solder for tin, temp. a tad frosty and dropping into cold water straight out of the mold. thanks

[MtGun44]

Fit first.

Undersized is tons more likely to cause problems than oversized. Start .001 to .002 oversized
and work from there.

For moderate pistol loads fast powders work great, accy is usually good. If accy is poor with
soft alloy and fast powder, try a slower powder for a gentler launch you may be deforming
the whole boolit.

Harder seems to be useful for rifle, but I am no rifle expert and have had good results the
few times I have done it with AC wwts and GC and 16 gr or so of 2400, or 10 gr Unique in
4 or 5 different bottleneck milsurp cartridges and a few old standards.

Good design and good lube are important. Tumble lube Lee designs and mule snot lube is good
for some, terrible for others. I recommend conventional designs for highest likelihood of
success, but the cost of a lubrisizer puts many off. Pan lube and shooting as cast is a
viable option without a lubrisizer.

Bill

[Echo]

Richard Lee owns a company that makes reloading equipment, and publishes books for same.

(Someone HAD to say it...)

[sergeant69]

oh............THAT richard lee. duh. i thought he was talking a gun hack guest columnist in guns and ammo or something. i HAVE read some of his ramblings where he says his equipment is superior to the more pricey stuff. i have also thrown some some of his "finest" into the trash straight out of the box. not talking about his molds.

[Bret4207]

I have far more faith in Lees equipment than his opinions on cast.

[sergeant69]

I have far more faith in Lees equipment than his opinions on cast.

no doubt. i bought one of his balance scales (low end) to have as a back up and immediately had fun destroying it. was pure garbage. but i own and use his molds.

[grouch]

I'd do 2 mixes: 20-1 lead and tin and a harder mix the equivalent of ww + 2% tin. Some guns show a distinct preference for one or the other. Also, I think you should try small batches first - as an earlier poster said it's easier than trying to unmix them
Grouch

[82nd airborne]

charlie, did you ever say what you were casting for? if not, what are you casting for? and thanks for your service.

[Crash_Corrigan]

I have been smelting ww's and using the alloy produced for pretty much all my casting needs. The only exception is for my Buffalo Gun. It is a Winchester Model 1885 BPCR in 50-90 Sharps and I use 40-1 alloy from Rotometals for it.

The mold throws out a 695 gr Creedmoor style boolit of .511 diameter and I pan lube it and I do not size it all. So far it is getting the job done. Over 102 gr of Swiss #1 blackpowder it will put 5 rounds into an inch or less at 100 and I am getting hand sized groups at 365 yds on a steel man sized plate with a very satisfying CLANG!

I am thinking about making a bullet trap using ground rubber to recycle my alloy boolits. WW's are becoming an endangered species and are harder and harder to come by as more folks are out there competing with me for the same amount of ww's.

Of course this will have to be a very robust trap as I will allow my shooting buddies also to contribute to my lead collecting. They have in the past pretty done much everything they could to destroy any target I have ever put out there. You would think that a wooden frame of 2" x 2" sticks enclosing an area of 24" x 24" would be safe from being destroyed at a range of 15 yds.

We are talking here of a target comprised of a piece of 11.5 x 8.5 piece of paper in the center of a two foot by two foot backboard. Do you expect to at least hit the paper most of the time at 45 feet with an accurate pistol?

No...some of these couch Rambos want to blast from the hip as fast as possible and spray and pray the rounds to the target. I cannot tell you how many target frames I have made only to have my SHOOTING BUDDIES blow to smithereens.

I have made some new friends. They shoot better. The dragged me into the Holy Black and I have spent thousands of my dollars because they have hooked me into this.

I figure I can recoup some of my expenditures by making a decent bullet recovery device that I can drag out of the back of my pickup and place on the hundred yard line and recover some lead. It will however need a channel iron frame on the front to protect the 2" x 2" wooden frame. Then a piece of cardboard to hold the target within the 18" square end of the target. Then some thin plywood for the sides and bottom and top of the container and it will have to be at least 40" long and then filled with rubber mulch. If I put an axle on the end away from the front and a pair of wheels then I can drag it out rather than carry it. Of course I hope nobody decides to shoot holes in my wheels.....