.30 Remington

[Marlin Junky]

In your opinion, what is the best bolt action that can be easily adapted to the .30 Remington? My opinion of this cartridge based on a lot of work with the 30-30 (with boolits weighing 175-200 grains) is that it could be one of the finest cast boolit cartridges available for bolt actions. Brass is still available from Remington and I'm thinking about buying a bunch but need a good source of actions. My vote is for the 722 but extractors might be an issue.

MJ

[DLCTEX]

It would be extra cost, but the 722 can be machined for a Sako extractor.

[Guesser]

I'm thinking that a Savage 110 series in 223 might be the easiest, buy a bolt head and have it machined out to take the 30 Remington case head, 30 cal. barrels are cheap and fitting one to a Savage should not be prohibitive. Just guessing here, but fun!!!!!!!!!

[Char-Gar]

The 30 Remington is a find round. I am playing with an early Rem. 141 in the caliber I conned off Glen Fryxell. If I wanted a bolt action rifle in that caliber, I think I would;

1. Start with a Savage short action in .223

Or...

2. Build a bolt rifle for the 30-30. A Mauser and others can be taught to feed the rimmed case. It takes a little care in charging the magazine, but no more than any other box magazine (Winchester 95) that takes a rimmed cartridge.

[onceabull]

Maybe rebarrel a Rem 788,if one can't find a reasonably priced one in 30/30 anymore...There was Rem.model 30 in 25 Rem.being shown around this valley for a couple years,but finally disappeared..Last Seen @ $600, maybe a 90% rifle,but no extras..one in 32 Rem.only went through here once on the show circuit... Onceabull

[Marlin Junky]

What advantage would the Savage short action have over the Remington? I want to build a good handling light weight that is also very accurate so the heavy long actions based on the Enfield aren't an option.

MJ

[Marlin Junky]

Maybe rebarrel a Rem 788,if one can't find a reasonably priced one in 30/30 anymore...There was Rem.model 30 in 25 Rem.being shown around this valley for a couple years,but finally disappeared..Last Seen @ $600, maybe a 90% rifle,but no extras..one in 32 Rem.only went through here once on the show circuit... Onceabull

If I could find a 788 in 30-30, I probably wouldn't bother converting it to .30 Remington, Having said that however, I've never handled a 788 in 30-30 so I don't know how well it feeds and ejects the rimmed round.

MJ

[onceabull]

I have a rem.mdl 7 in 308 W.set up as a "Scout"rifle..So---find one set the barrel back far enough to rechamber to 30 Remmie,or ,if desired just rebarrel with a barrel length & twist made to order..??? Onceabull

[Guesser]

The one advantage I'm seeing as possible over a Remington is that I'm thinking the conversion could be done with less capital outlay in the Savage.

[HeavyMetal]

Here's my thoughts on this conversion: It's gonna be tough!

30 Remington case head is .422 diameter. this falls between the small case family (.223) with the .378 case head and the 308 case head family that has the .473 case head.

Cutting a .223 bolt could get expensive because it might need to be re heat treated after it was cut. If there was enough meat in the bolt to do it safely!

The Savage idea bears invistagating!

What I would consider to save /cut costs: purchase the Savage action in a 308 case head size. chamber a 30 cal. barrel to 30 Remington AKA 30-30 and fire form 30-06 case;'s to make this new hybrid 30 Remington with a 308 case head.

You now have the best of both worlds: easy to obtain brass ( never been to a range and not seen 06 brass!) and a case neck that works incredibley well with cast boolits.

I firmly believe that the case head dimension of the 30 remington was the cause of it's demise the same as the other two calibers in this case head family!

The second, and smartest move, would be to find a good Savage 340 in 30-30 and work with that. A barrel blank could be obtained easily enough if you wanted a longer than 20 inch barrel and they feed very well having had several of these rifles in 30-30.

They are reasonablely priced and I have seen a bunch of them for sale on gun
broker!

[Frank46]

Carcano actions can be converted to 7.62x39. Take carcano cases and neck up to 30 cal. Use a sprinfield bbl or buy one of the 308/7.62 nato 1919a4 mg bbls and cut off the chamber (2") and you'll still have 22" to play with. Frank

[Bent Ramrod]

i'm pretty happy with my Model 30 Express in .30 Remington. With 18 gr of 2400 it will shoot some cast boolits into 7 inches or less at 300 yards with iron sights. You could rebarrel a sporterized 1917 Enfield and bush the bolt face to get the same thing. Or check if someone offers a new bolt action in that 6.9 SPC or whatever it's called. Such a rifle could be rebarreled with a .30 caliber barrel. No bolt face work would be necessary, since the cartridge is a shortened .30 Rem to begin with, necked down to .270.

You might just get a 6.9 whatever and rebore it to .30 caliber. The reduced length case ought to still have plenty of powder capacity still for a cast boolit rifle.

[Marlin Junky]

Bent Ramrod,

If I happen across a Remington 700 short action in 6.8 SPC and it's a bargain, I'll probably just re-barrel it to .30R.

Congrats on the M30 but that's a collector and IMO is too heavy for the .30R.

MJ

[onceabull]

M.J.. there's a win 54 in 30/30 on Guns Intern. right now ..#100136089, ..price is so low that condition is suspect..but if I didn't have two already,I'd be chasing it...Onceabull

[excess650]

I would be inclined to work with a Remington 700 with the small boltface. You would need a Sako type extractor, but it can be done. The 700 would be a better choice than a Mauser in that the case head is fully encased.

I have a friend who had a 700 30-06 converted to 38-55 strictly for cast bullets. It got the Sako extractor treatment with a 1-14" Douglas barrel and shoots very well.

As for the 788 30-30, they're out there. Remington also chambered the 788 for 44 Magnum. I don't care for the rear locking lugs and rattly bolt, but 788s are shooters!

I don't like the Savage 340 at all!!! It has a split rear receiver bridge, uses one action bolt like a cheap 22, and has a piece of sheet metal wrapped around the barrel an a crew through the forend to retain it. I know, I've heard how well they shoot, but the bedding setup is terrible, and it requires a side scope mount, or scout scope setup.

Other options would include singleshots like the Ruger #1 and #3, Browning Lowall, etc.

[Harter66]

+1 for a Carcano. It is a short tweek from 7.62x39 , 6.5/7.35 Carcano , 38/357mag/max , or even 35 Rem. I've a list of Carcano swaps I've considered.

If I were going to "short case" a 30 cal I'd do a 300 Savage. Shorter than a 308 same 473 head of 308-06'and Mauser.

[AZ-Stew]

If I could find a 788 in 30-30, I probably wouldn't bother converting it to .30 Remington, Having said that however, I've never handled a 788 in 30-30 so I don't know how well it feeds and ejects the rimmed round.

MJ

I have one and it handles the rimmed case very well, as does the one I have in .44 Magnum. Now, I've never tried to run the bolts fast as if I was in danger or about to lose a wounded animal, on either rifle, but for my shooting they both work well. The only "problem" with them is finding magazines. The Gun Parts (Numrich) outfit occasionally has them and I pick up whatever I need when I see them there. I think I have at least one extra magazine for each 788 I own. The only two I don't have are the .308 and 7mm-08.

Regards,

Stew

[BulletGeek]

Rather than build your CB .30-caliber around a .30 Remington, you might consider building it around a .303 Savage. It's a fairly short, rimmed cartridge with a nice long neck that will hold lots of bullet shank. The rimmed cartridge simplifies things for you a bit. You could probably build one on a P-14 Enfield in short order (or a Remington model 30, which is nearly the same thing).

http://www.ows-ammo.com/catalog/images/303_Savage.JPG

[Marlin Junky]

M.J.. there's a win 54 in 30/30 on Guns Intern. right now ..#100136089, ..price is so low that condition is suspect..but if I didn't have two already,I'd be chasing it...Onceabull

When someone drills a hole on top of the chamber, I leaves 'em alone. Anyway, it's already found a lucky new owner.

MJ

[Marlin Junky]

I would be inclined to work with a Remington 700 with the small boltface. You would need a Sako type extractor, but it can be done. The 700 would be a better choice than a Mauser in that the case head is fully encased.

I have a friend who had a 700 30-06 converted to 38-55 strictly for cast bullets. It got the Sako extractor treatment with a 1-14" Douglas barrel and shoots very well.

How does it feed? Seems like the narrower 38-55 case would fall through or pop put of the feed rails. Does the rim drag on the feed rails?


As for the 788 30-30, they're out there. Remington also chambered the 788 for 44 Magnum. I don't care for the rear locking lugs and rattly bolt, but 788s are shooters!

I don't like the Savage 340 at all!!! It has a split rear receiver bridge, uses one action bolt like a cheap 22, and has a piece of sheet metal wrapped around the barrel an a crew through the forend to retain it. I know, I've heard how well they shoot, but the bedding setup is terrible, and it requires a side scope mount, or scout scope setup.

All negatives in my mind too. The 788 would be plenty strong for my purposes (up to 45K chamber pressures) but I don't like the detachable magazine and the ejection port angle. I say, all in all, the 788 has too many flaws to justify it's "collectable" price.


Other options would include singleshots like the Ruger #1 and #3, Browning Lowall, etc.

Yeah, for a 30-30, 30-40 or 303S, etc.

MJ

[Marlin Junky]

+1 for a Carcano. It is a short tweek from 7.62x39 , 6.5/7.35 Carcano , 38/357mag/max , or even 35 Rem. I've a list of Carcano swaps I've considered.

The Carcano is supposed to have a .450" head... too sloppy. Probably just right for the .35R but as HeavyMetal posted earlier, the .30R has a .421" head.


If I were going to "short case" a 30 cal I'd do a 300 Savage. Shorter than a 308 same 473 head of 308-06'and Mauser.

300 Savage? If I were happy with the .300 Savage, I would just settle for the ubiquitous .308W and be done with it.

MJ

[Marlin Junky]

Rather than build your CB .30-caliber around a .30 Remington, you might consider building it around a .303 Savage. It's a fairly short, rimmed cartridge with a nice long neck that will hold lots of bullet shank. The rimmed cartridge simplifies things for you a bit. You could probably build one on a P-14 Enfield in short order (or a Remington model 30, which is nearly the same thing).

http://www.ows-ammo.com/catalog/images/303_Savage.JPG

I've got a 1899 in .303. I'm looking for a slick handling bolt gun in .30R.

MJ

[BulletGeek]

I've got a 1899 in .303. I'm looking for a slick handling bolt gun in .30R.

MJ

I'm gathering that you're not a tremendous fan of rear-lug bolts, but if you could get over that I would recommend a conversion on an Enfield No. 4 action. It's got a short-throw bolt with plenty of strength for the .30 Remington cartridge, and can be worked with a great deal of speed. With some machining you can work this platform into a fair copy of a Lee Speed Sporter, a lovely little fast-handing rifle from the turn of the 20th century.

http://www.imfdb.org/images/thumb/3/3b/BSArifles.jpg/350px-BSArifles.jpg

To make this work, you will need to have a gunsmith custom-fabricate a new bolt head for you. Fortunately, you'll only need the head and not the complete bolt, thanks to the Enfield bolt system.

I don't think there's any way to get around doing some machining work no matter which way you go with it.

[GrizzLeeBear]

Since your after 30-30 performance in a bolt gun, how about a Savage 340. Nice little bolt action 30-30. Then you wouldn't have to worry about finding brass, etc. and there seems to be a fair number of them available at fairly low prices. Just a thought.

[GabbyM]

Over on the savage forum there are guys who have made 6.8 SPC by machining a 223 bolt head. NO extractor work mentioned. Just open up the bolt face. Then they get to the magazine. You bend out a 223 mag lips or bend in 308 sized mag lips. All the new rifles are center feed and I'd think a 308 mag would work well. At a glance I'd think the longer length of the 30 Rem would make for better feeding from a 308 mag but who knows.

In one of the threads a man mentioned that if you machine the bolt out a tad larger you can also use Russian .447” cases. Which got me thinking you could re-barrel any bolt action 7.62 x 39 to 30 Rem.
I think machining a Savage 223 bolt head would be a five minute job. Start with a $300 Stevens 200 in 223. If the 223 mag doesn't conform get a 308 mag. At 6 ½ pounds the Stevens 200 is in your light and handy category. With a Savage there is a ready market for take off barrels to those whom wish to go the switch barrel route.

The Ruger 6.8 SPC is a youth length stock with short barrel. With it's purchase price then a barrel and stock you'd have a high price rifle. Same with any of the 7.62 x 39 mm bolt guns.

[GabbyM]

Since your after 30-30 performance in a bolt gun, how about a Savage 340. Nice little bolt action 30-30. Then you wouldn't have to worry about finding brass, etc. and there seems to be a fair number of them available at fairly low prices. Just a thought.

I think MJ has a great plan here with the 30 Rem. Finding brass will take a few mouse clicks.

I know 30-30 brass doesn't last long when loaded up to potential. I'd guess the 30 rem brass would hold up much better to full house loads and probably exceed 30-30 ballistics while doing so. All totaled I see this as a very efficient set up.

[BulletGeek]

Going the Savage 110-series route is a very good idea, and requires less gunsmithing than the Lee Enfield I mentioned earlier. Plus, if you get the Savage rather than the Stevens, you get the Accu-Trigger... a very nice accessory for accuracy.

[Marlin Junky]

30-30 brass in a bolt gun would probably hold up just as well as .30R brass (sans any manufacturing flaws) and the .30R has only a hair more capacity than the 30-30 (a hair longer body with a 23 degree shoulder). The major difference here is that in a lever gun, 45K loads will require more frequent FL sizing than when used in bolt guns (I have no experience with the rear lock-up bolt guns). To make the 30-30 work in a bolt gun there needs to be mod's and probably concessions made... and I don't like the idea of removable magazines on guns that have long been discontinued. I know at least for the time being, it's easier to buy inexpensive .30R brass than it is .303S (the latter is rimmed, so that's a mute point). If worse came to worse, I would imagine the rim can be turned down on the ubiquitous 30-30 to make perfectly fine .30R cases.

I also like the idea of a modern receiver from Savage (or Remington) because they come drilled and tapped for scope mounts and have good triggers installed. The availability of good aftermarket synthetic stocks is also a plus; though, I like to try a Savage factory equipped "AccuStock". I doubt I'll ever run into an M7 or M700 short action in 6.8 SPC so I'll see if I can locate a bargain on a shot out .204!

MJ

P.S. I've attached thumbnails below that link to larger files for those not familiar with the difference between the 30-30 and the .30 Remington.

[HORNET]

MJ,
There are a couple other options that haven't been mentioned.
IIRC, Pacific Tool & Gauge sells bolt bodies for Rem. 700 actions set for whatever case head size you want.
The bolts on Savage 110's have a bolt head that can be changed for different head sizes ( PT&G may sell those as well, I haven't checked) or you could buy an entire spare bolt from Savage.
When you change the barrel, you're going to need to reset the headspace anyhow.
You could also form your .30R cases from .225 Win. brass and use the standard .30R chamber with a .473 bolt face (it has a very small rim) instead of turning down .30-30 rims.

[Marlin Junky]

Hornet,

Yup, I've got it narrowed down to either a Savage or a Remington. Here's a thought though. Given that the way a round cycles through the action is effected by changing the diameter of the cartridge without altering the feed rails, it nevertheless would be cool to have one accurate 6.5-7.0# bolt gun that could be switched back and forth from a .223 to a .30 Remington. Given that the .30 Remington is about 12% larger in diameter than the .223, I have no idea how well this will work but I need a Savage in .223 to get started anyway!

[Ben]

Ever price any 303 Savage loaded ammo or brass ? ?

Pretty expensive and not very easy to find !

[Marlin Junky]

So what do you guys think of Savage detachable box magazines for the 110 family of short actions? Would a .223 box magazine work for a .30R?

MJ

[hansumtoad]

For what its worth.... no better factory trigger ever graced a rifle than the 721/722/725. I'd be all over a 722 for a 30 Rem. 21" #3 coutour barrel, banded front sight with a quarter rib.... YOWSAH!!!

[HORNET]

MJ, that .223 box magazine might work as it is for the .30 Rem or you might have to open things up just a tad. The 6.8 SPC is based on that case and sometimes works well out of stock .223 magazines. It's one of those where tolerance stackups come into play. It shouldn't take much to modify the magazine to work well with both the .223 and the .30 Rem. Then you can add more barrels for the 6.8 SPC and 7 TC/U and .25/.222 Copperhead and .30 Apache and .300 Whisper and......

[Marlin Junky]

Are the action rails configured differently on Savage rifles with detachable box magazines vs. those with hinged floor plates or blind magazines?

MJ

[JeffinNZ]

+1 on the Carcano idea. Go buy a Budda'd Carcano, drop a .30cal tube on it, ream and shoot.

[Rockydog]

Since your after 30-30 performance in a bolt gun, how about a Savage 340. Nice little bolt action 30-30. Then you wouldn't have to worry about finding brass, etc. and there seems to be a fair number of them available at fairly low prices. Just a thought.

GrizzLeeBear's got the right idea. I think I read back in this thread that you wrote that a 30-30 bolt gun would do if you could find one. The old Savage 340s are nice little light weight guns. They come plain and fancy depending on the letter designation, 340E etc. Normally pretty decently priced too. An example of a cheapy. RD

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=177791533

[DLCTEX]

For what its worth.... no better factory trigger ever graced a rifle than the 721/722/725. I'd be all over a 722 for a 30 Rem. 21" #3 coutour barrel, banded front sight with a quarter rib.... YOWSAH!!!

I think the Savage Accu trigger beats the Rem. factory triggers easily. Throw in the ease of barrel swapping and bolt head swapping and to me it's a no brainer. Oh yeah, the availability and cost of the Savage bolt heads compared to Rem. bolts thrown into the mix.

[Marlin Junky]

I think the Savage Accu trigger beats the Rem. factory triggers easily. Throw in the ease of barrel swapping and bolt head swapping and to me it's a no brainer. Oh yeah, the availability and cost of the Savage bolt heads compared to Rem. bolts thrown into the mix.

Agreed... I'm still confused about the magazine and action rail config's on the Savage though.

MJ

[uscra112]

How about a Krag? Not capable of high pressures, but the base diameter of the rimmed Krag round is pretty close, so it ought to cycle through the magazine. It would take welding a new tip on the extractor, which has been done to my .22-3000 Lovell Krag with no trouble. Extractor pops over the rim just fine.

No bolt-gun works slicker than a Krag. You might even get away with setting the Krag barrel back and rechambering, although it's tough to find an original Krag barrel that I'd bother doing that with. Better a new one.

[Marlin Junky]

I won't consider any collectible rifles for this project. The right candidate is modular and plentiful with the possibility of switching barrels without the need of a lathe. I just need to decide whether a detachable magazine would be better suited than a box or blind magazine.

MJ