Unique 45-70 Load Data

[BIG45-70]

Hey all, I've put together a nice load using unique with a 405gr cast boolit. I'm running 14.7grs of powder with a kleenex filler.

I've been thinking about putting together some 350gr and 420gr or 450gr loads with this powder and not really sure where to start. I'd like to keep the velocity's in the 1200fps with the heavier stuff and a little faster with the 350s range with a Marlin 1895 22inch barrel. Looking for something I can target shoot and hunt game with. There really isn't much data out there for caliber and unique. Thanks for your input.

[sagacious]

Do you have a handloading manual? Lyman #47 lists Unique data for 45-70 400gr, 420gr and other weights up to 500grs in the velocity range you indicate.

[35remington]

This is in excess of what Trapdoor pressures are held to, only appropriate for Marlins and stronger:

16.0 Unique 405 Lee cast flatbase sized .460, 22 inch Marlin, 1260 fps. FWIW.

Skip the filler with Unique. It is not needed as in these charge weights in this 45-70 case as it is not that position sensitive

[BIG45-70]

Do you have a handloading manual? Lyman #47 lists Unique data for 45-70 400gr, 420gr and other weights up to 500grs in the velocity range you indicate.

That's interesting, I have the lastest Lyman manual and there isn't any data listed. I have to look for Lyman #47.

[35remington]

Lyman's 45th lists this load for an even heavier bullet, but in the interest of prudence and current data (see the other edition's pressure tested data before the 49th edition) 405 grain cast bullets are most relevant.

Although velocities are fairly low, pressures are not as low as some of those loads obtaining similar velocities with powders like 4198 and RL 7.

The 45-70 behaves most like an overgrown pistol cartridge when loaded with Unique and the 405. Pressures peak when the bullet is still partially within the case, most likely.

[BIG45-70]

Any of you guys willing to take a picture of the load data in these manuals?

[sagacious]

Here's some Unique data. Source: Lyman #47
45-70 data for 1886 Winchester and 1895 Marlin only.
400gr #2 alloy
Unique 13.7grs start 1154fps 17100cup
Unique 16.5grs MAX 1286fps 27300cup
No fiber wad or filler is designated for this recipe.

420gr #2 alloy
Unique 11.0grs start 1006fps 16800cup
Unique 13.5grs MAX 1163fps 27200cup
Use 1/2gr polyester fiber wad 5/8"square x 1/4" thick over the powder.

.................................................. ...................

45-70 data for Ruger No.1 and No.3 only.
385gr #2 alloy
Unique 10.0grs start 939fps 10300cup
Unique 17.5grs MAX 1411fps 38500cup
Use 1/2gr polyester fiber wad 5/8"square x 1/4" thick over the powder.

420gr #2 alloy
Unique 13.5grs start 1113fps 22800cup
Unique 16.5grs MAX 1275fps 38200cup
Use 1/2gr polyester fiber wad 5/8"square x 1/4" thick over the powder.

451gr #2 alloy
Unique 11.0grs start 950fps 17100cup
Unique 15.2grs MAX 1209fps 40000cup
Use 1/2gr polyester fiber wad 5/8"square x 1/4" thick over the powder.

Don't bother looking for Lyman #48, Lyman #47 has much more cast bullet data.
Hope this helps, good luck.

[BIG45-70]

thanks brother, that helps a ton!

[BrianB]

I'm with 35Remington on the position sensitivity. I shot some 45-70's using round balls and 9 grains of Unique and had consistent ignition and excellent accuracy.

[steg]

anyone have any data using any of the Lee cast boolits and unique, or 3031.............steg

[BIG45-70]

Something very strange I've been experiencing with my load of 14.7grs unique and 405 cast bullet is key holing. The even stranger part is with a key holing bullet its still flying the same flight path as the bullets that don't keyhole. Anyone have any ideas?

[Maven]

BIG45-70, The late Frank Marshall, Jr. of the CBA recommended a charge of 13 grs. of Unique with any of the CB's you mentioned. I tried it in my Marlin #336/1895 and was very pleased with its performance.

[steg]

Big45-70, did you weigh the boolits before loading them? possible inclusions in them that you don't see. Does this ever happen with any of your other loadings, ie different weights, different powders. When you say the same flight path do you mean that their grouping with the other rounds, or kind of in the same vicinity?.................steg

[Volowner]

I don't know if you're stuck on using Unique. If not, try Trail Boss. I load a 355 gr boolit under 14 gr of Trail Boss, no filler. Gives me 1200 fps with an extreme spread of 17 fps. Great powder for cowboy style loads, or duplicating black powder loads.

There's data on Hodgdon's website for boolits up to 485 grains.

[BIG45-70]

Big45-70, did you weigh the boolits before loading them? possible inclusions in them that you don't see. Does this ever happen with any of your other loadings, ie different weights, different powders. When you say the same flight path do you mean that their grouping with the other rounds, or kind of in the same vicinity?.................steg

I haven't weighed the bullets, I do get them from bulletbarn.com (good guys and very reputable up here in canada) The key holes are grouping with my other shots (within 2 inches and 100 yards)

I don't recall ever getting a keyhole before, I've used imr4198, varget and Reloader 7 and nothing in the past. I like unique mainly for cost, I've ran through about 300 rounds with my1lb container and its still have full, I do plan on giving trailboss a try when I can find it.

[sixpointfive]

ANy data for unique and a 340 grain bullet?

[Wally]

I use 15.0 ~18.0 grains of Unique with a 340 grain cast bullet--very accurate in my Marlin

[sixpointfive]

Please tell me what the diameter of the bullet and whether you use fillers or not on top of powder.

[sixpointfive]

Also what type of lube? I usually use the lee tumble lube

[Maven]

sixpointfive, 13gr. Unique (no filler or dacron tuft) + Felix Lube on the 340gr. CB sized to .459" for my Marlin.

[mpmarty]

.460 UNSIZED lubed with lla/jpw mix in my 95 and no leading with 15gr of Unique and no fillers using LP primers. These are Ranch Dog 350 grain boolits cast from ac ww.

[adrians]

trailboss all the way for my 1873 trap ,easy on the old shoulder:twisted::mrgreen::evil:

[steg]

Big45/70 is the backing on your target holder all torn up? possibly causing it to look like it is keyholing when a boolit hits a torn up spot and making an uneven hole, Just grasping at straws here, seems like if a boolit is keyholing it wouldn't group with the others...........................steg

[BIG45-70]

This is an old thread but I'll post an update. When I was doing was not expanding the cause mouth enough and shaving some lead when I was seating the bullet. I believe this was causing the key-holing and leading. Since I started expanding the case mouth a little more I haven't had any key-holing or leading.

[Tom-ADC]

Any of you guys willing to take a picture of the load data in these manuals?

I have the 1973 edtion of Lymans cast bullets, it list a bunch of different wieghts using Unique powder I'll scan the pages when I get back from coffee.

[BIG45-70]

I have the 1973 edtion of Lymans cast bullets, it list a bunch of different wieghts using Unique powder I'll scan the pages when I get back from coffee.

that would be awesome:drinks:

[Tom-ADC]

Hope this works if not PM me your email and I'll send it to you.

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL174/1021972/3058943/393948475.jpg

[BIG45-70]

It worked but the text is VERY small, even my laser vision eyes are having a tough time.

[sixpointfive]

WHAT IS FELIX LUBE? Also what is the best target to use with the factory open sights? perhaps you could attach a target I could copy and print.

Thanks all.

Matt

[sixpointfive]

One more thing guys...do you guys full length the cases after firing? Or do you partial size. May be a dumb question considering this similiar to a pistol case. Thanks for all info and merry christmas.

Matt

[BIG45-70]

I full length size but you can only next size as long as your shooting them in the same rifle.

[sixpointfive]

Range report using unique groups at 50 yards were all consistent at 2.5" using the factory open sights
:
Fired15.2 graings =1240 fps
17.2= 1340
18= 1400

[pls1911]

15 grains Unique , any gas checked cast bullet to 300- 400 grains.
Not for trap doors probably, but crazy accurate on Pedersoli sharps, Roller, Ruger #1 and Marlin GG..
In a 34" barreled Sharps, it's relatively quiet as well.

[Dutch4122]

Anybody try Unique with a 500 grn boolit? I'm thinking 10-12 grns of Unique. Just looking for confirmation on that load range.

Thanks,

[NHlever]

The only loads I have for Unique, and a 500 grain 45-70 Boolit are from the Lyman #47 manual and are for the "Ruger No.1 ONLY". They list 10.0 grains with a filler at 14,100 CUP, and 888 fps. and 14.8 grains MAX. with a filler at 33,700 CUP, and 1153 fps.. You are on your own beyond that. I would move up to a slightly slower powder for a boolit that heavy unless you are looking for a "Whisper" load, or something to poke through windshield glass without fuss. :D