Working up a load

[Mk42gunner]

How many rounds do you load when working up a load? In my pre-chronograph days I would load 5 or 10 of each graduation, then shoot groups. The tightest group or groups would get reshot. Once I decided on a load I would then load the rest of the box of jacketed to the same recipe.

Of course I was well praticed then, Uncle Sam bought me a lot of practice ammo.

Now I am starting to load for a Husqvarna in 25-20 WCF and I decided to give it a better chance. I am thinking twenty rounds would be a good place to start. Five rounds for initial sight verification and group, five for chronographing, and ten for a more thorough group testing. Assuming there is no signs of excessive pressure, or outlandish velocity with the first rounds.

Does this sound reasonable?

Thanks for the advice,

Robert

[Bass Ackward]

You must be a wealthy man. I can't afford to blow rifle ammo like that. And it would be too slow for me.

My gun and brass would be worn out before I found something. I chrono and move the sights ONLY when I settle on a load. I assume we are talking lead.

I use three shot groups to start out and then come up in charge in what ever gradient case size and powder speed warranted until the lead let go. I can see the groups open and close. I record the closures (sweet spots) and the best one. Then I will go back and try more at those points. Sight movement and chrono work comes once the decision is close to final.

But it takes me 365 days to settle on "a load" here unless it is a single purpose load like for hunting because most hunting is seasonal. I do shoot year round regardless of the cold but most of that anymore is handgun where I do go through some components.

[Czech_too]

Recently I came across a new to me process called the ladder method where you would load say 20 rounds, one each in increments of .2 grains. Shoot each round, out of a cold barrel, keeping track of where each round hit on the target. The shots which grouped closest to each other would give you the relative area where that powder/bullet combination performs best out of that barrel. From that point you would do further developement.

I may give it a try the next time around. Prior to reading this, I would load 5 rounds each in either .2 or .5 grain increments, depending on case size, and determine based on group size which loading was worth going with if any.

[sundog]

Having confidence in your ability and equipment is important. Like Bass, I can generally tell within three rounds if a load will work. Run it through some velocity range to find sweet spot(s). Then shoot the best groups under varying conditions. My last excursion in doing this was with a .308 and 5744 with the RCBS 30-180-SP. No reason for any more detail as it may be of no use to anyone else, and we are talking procedure here. That load was verified over several months in different conditions and proved good. It's marked in the book as a 'go-to' for that rifle. A chronograph is a very handy tool to have while working loads.

[thegreatdane]

It seems like the ladder method would take forever to load said 20 rounds (unless you have one of those fancy powder dispensers). that's twenty different powder throws followed by twenty scale verifications.

For those of us with cheap gear, I believe a handfull of each measurement is more efficient.

But I sure would love to use one of those electronic wonders.

[BABore]

I've shot several ladder tests at 300 yards. It's time consuming for sure. What it really tells you is where the barrel harmonic nodes or nulls are. It can tell you where a potential accuracy point may be, but not always. You have to be very patient and have extreme confidence in each and every shot.

I use a similar method as Bass's. 3 shots at each increment for rifles and 5 for pistol. When I get a warm-fuzzy for a particular charge, I load more rounds and test further as well as at longer ranges. Sometimes it works out, sometimes it don't. Anytime I switch powders or primers during a test, I will load at least 3-5 extra rounds at the starting load for foulers. If a lube is changed, it will be 5-10 starting load foulers. Most all my guns will just hit paper and that's fine. I only sight them in dead on when it's hunting time. I found it important to not muck with the sights as long as they hit paper. I shoot a large 24 x 36 target with 3 rows of targets, 5 per row. The paper has 1 inch grid lines. I shoot them in order from left to right. Keeping track of group shape as well as impact position from starting load on up can tell you alot on what's going on. The same POI shifts that you see in a ladder test can be seen here as well.

[Mk42gunner]

Hi Guys,

Thanks for your input. Like Sundog stated, I am just looking for different views on procedure here.

Bass, I am but a poor, (I could even make a good case for broke) retired sailor. I am shooting Lead. In this case the Lyman 257420 at 71 grains the gas check is the most expensive part or the load.

I like BABore's idea of using a large target to capture all of the groups. I have been using a foam cored poster board from Walmart to staple targets to; I believe ai will get a new one to start testing this rifle.

My normal targets lately have been a sheet of copier paper with a black target paster in the center for an aiming point.

I may have miscommunicated in my earlier post, I do not intend to move the sights until I find a good load; I just want to know that when I finally put rounds over the chrono that I have a good chance of missing it.


Robert

[fredj338]

It's diff for me w/ rifle or pistol/ For rifle, I'll start 5% below max & load one round each in 0.2gr increments & shoot them on one target o/ the chrono. I am looking for practical max loadings. Then I will load 3rds of at the vel level I am seeking, looking for accuracy & adjust up or down 0.2gr, so 9rds.
For pistols, I start w/ middle data & work up in 0.1gr increments for small cases/faster powders & 0.2gr for larger cases/slower powders. I load 5rds & shoot them for accuracy/reliability.

[hoosierlogger]

I usually load 5 rounds of each charge (because a factory ammo box tray holds 5 in each row and it has 10 rows.) and go up from the starting point in .2 grain increments. If I hit a sweet spot early on in the game and the rest of the higher charges start to fall off I pull the boolits and dump the powder to save powder and primer.

[303Guy]

I like to find a load that is least sensitive to variations - in theory. I start out by finding a load that produces enough pressure to burn the powder efficiently without too much pressure (and recoil) and use that as a starting point. I look for things like unburned powder. All this takes place in my shed in the 'test tube'. Unfortunately I don't get out to the range enough to do the final developement properly - oh well!

[mike in co]

Recently I came across a new to me process called the ladder method where you would load say 20 rounds, one each in increments of .2 grains. Shoot each round, out of a cold barrel, keeping track of where each round hit on the target. The shots which grouped closest to each other would give you the relative area where that powder/bullet combination performs best out of that barrel. From that point you would do further developement.

I may give it a try the next time around. Prior to reading this, I would load 5 rounds each in either .2 or .5 grain increments, depending on case size, and determine based on group size which loading was worth going with if any.


ladder is more like 10-12 at 1/100 of case capacity steps.......30 gr case vol/0/3 steps, longest useable range for the caliber......200 or more for rifle, with the best sighting tool you have for the gun., 50/25 for iron sight pistols.

load 2 or three of the middle. use them to zero and foul the bore.

shoot the 10 and mark each one's location as you shoot.

circle shots 1,2/ 2,3,4/3,4,5/4,5,6/5,6,7/6,7,8/7,8,9/8,9,10/9,10.

look for nice round small groups.
reshoot what looks good in 5 or 10 shot strings.

now start adjusting oal and see what happens.