What are the Lymans like?

[Four Fingers of Death]

I have never owned a muzzleloader, but am currently getting into BP shooting and am learning to drive a few Cap and Ball pistols. I also intend to convert to full BP for cowboy shooting and am interested in hunting with my 45/70 cowboy with Gould HP boolits in front of BP.

My eldest son (yeahhhhhhhhhhh, 35 and still lives at home :( ) has expressed an interest in muzzle loading and I have always been planning to get one for the odd bit of hunting and range plinking.

The Lymans sell here for about $AU900 new. This one is owned by a friend, he bought it off another friend, it is well looked after and has a swag of accessories, including a nylon (or brass, I can't remember) ramrod as well as the standard one. It is in 45 cal, which will match up nicely with my Ruger Old Armys (I think :) )

I'm never going to get into serious competition and it seems to me that if it is a Lyman, it will be a good unit. I have used and trusted Lyman products for 45 years.

I think it is a Hawken, but the only difference in these is the stocks (and maybe sights) as far as I can see.

Am I on the right track here?
Will this do the job?

[405]

Lyman MLs.
A long time ago I built a couple of their Great Plains Rifles from kits. At a distance they look similar to a two barrel wedge "real" Hawken rifle. But the closer you get the details aren't exactly right. That's the cosmetics. The components are Italian. Not the best quality but also not the worst. The 900 AU seems high to me. I don't know how much choice you have there but I'd take an older TC Hawken or Renegade over the Lyman- even though neither of them look like a real Hawken (they look more like some other type Plains or trade rifle). I've owned a few TCs over the years and the quality has always been very good. While the TCs are neither fish nor fowl with their in-between twist rate... I think they are the better of the more common mass produced factory MLs. If you can find a beater Thompson Center..... very good drop-in barrels are available for them with the better round ball twist option.
Just my opinion. But, sure to stir up opposing absolute, no debate, anecdotal opinions about the superior qualities of the Lyman MLs. :)

[Maven]

"I think it is a Hawken, but the only difference in these is the stocks (and maybe sights) as far as I can see."

FFoD, The traditional Lyman BP rifles are made by Investarms. The Hawken types (brass forend cap & patch box) have a 28" bbl. and can be had in a fast (1:30"?) or slower (1:48") twist. The Great Plains model (no brass anywhere) has a 32" bbl. and has either the 1:66" twist or 1:30"? twist for conicals, etc. They are accurate, well-constructed rifles with decent fit and finish. I have a .50cal. Great Plains caplock in the 1:66" twist and am quite pleased with its balance, accuracy, and reliability (In the 2 years I've owned it, it has NEVER misfired.) Lyman will stand by its warranty on them as well, which is something to bear in mind. Btw, if you remove the lock and polish its inner surfaces, you'll be rewarded with a better trigger pull, both set and unset. Hope this helps!

[JeffinNZ]

I am babysitting a .54cal GPR for a friend in Alaska. The only thing I really don't like about it the sub calibre chamber. Bore is .54cal, chamber is about .38cal. A right PITA to clean. Stupid idea in my opinion. Other than that it is OK.

[Maven]

Jeff, Yes the chamber IS undersized (on Pedersoli's as well), but it hasn't been a problem at the range. When I get home, I pull the wedges, nipple, and set screw (on the snail) and put the breach end into a [plastic] container of warm soapy water and have at it with a tight patch on my range rod. All the fouling is dissolved in maybe 5 mins. In fact, it takes longer to reassemble the piece (I remove the lock as well.) than to clean it.

FFoD, The T/C's are nice rifles (I owned 2): well made, accurate, reliable, excellent warranty (except on kit rifles). However, the stock configuration, i.e., drop, isn't for everyone. I need more drop than T/C Hawken stocks afford and thus found myself craning my neck way over to get the right sight picture when shooting offhand.

[Four Fingers of Death]

Thanks, I'll think I'll hang out for a flinter, which is what my son really is interested in.

[JeffinNZ]

OK Mick, here is the bad news then. The only good flinter is one with a premium lock. I don't rate flink locks made in Italy or Spain. My Isaac Haines I built a few years ago has a deluxe Siler by Chambers and I honed all the bearing surfaces until they were like mirrors. It is fast as a cap lock easy.

[Four Fingers of Death]

think I need to wander off to the muzzle loading club and sus out the scene.

[Maven]

FFoD, What Jeff said about the actual flint lock is true. Moreover, more than a few ML forum posters have downgraded the Lyman/Investarms [flint]locks for poor touchhole placement and lock geometry. Part of the fix is quite simple. One either replaces the Lyman cock//hammer with one from Thompson/Center or places a 1/8" shim under the flint so as to elevate the striking point on the frizzen to a more advantageous, if not perfect, position.

[Four Fingers of Death]

Thanks for that, one of the guys I used to work with is a muzzle loading whiz, I'll have a talk to him. I'm not really committed to getting one just now, but this one came up.

[pietro]

[My eldest son (yeahhhhhhhhhhh, 35 and still lives at home)]

Yer not alone. My eldest, a son, just moved out & bought a house last Fall - and he was then 44 y.o. :drinks:

(His sisters cleared out about 3 minutes after they turned "of-age" [smilie=s: )

.

[Four Fingers of Death]

It used to be the way of things, as soon as I working and had almost enough cash in hand, I was goneeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!