sizing die for 40 cal

[targetshootr]

Got the Starline brass and the new 6 cavity should be here this week so it's time to order a sizer die for the Star. When I called the last time she asked too many questions and since my limit is one or two I told her I'd find out and call back which is where you guys come in. Since l may wind up with more than one gun in 38-40 what would be the best size in general, .401?

[9.3X62AL]

I use .401" for both 10mm and 40 Short & Weak. The 38-40 sometimes requires a thousandth or 2 more to match throats, from what I have read. A friend's New Service in 38-40 runs .402" throats, for example.

[targetshootr]

Thanks Deputy. My mold came today and it looks like I used the specs on his website which were .401 RNPB boolits which should drop at 185-190 gr with a single lube groove.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b233/targetshootr/Im002660.jpg

[45 2.1]

I'm using a 0.401" sizer in a "Buckeye" like yours with the RCBS 180gr boolit.

[9.3X62AL]

I'm sure the Buckeye/Ruger revolver throats run closer to .400" than the older Colt throats. If anything, Ruger is known in their 44-40 and 45 Colt throats to leave a little excess metal in the throat to enable the end user to open them up to meet the grooves in the barrel--whether he wants to or not.

38-40.......The First 10mm (in the rifle), The First 40 S&W (in the revolver).

[targetshootr]

Good to hear that about Rugers. I bought the Buckeye cylinder a few months ago to use on a large frame old model Ruger conversion. The mid-frame flat top conversion (http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b233/targetshootr/Im002584.jpg) came a few weeks ago and so far only shot a box of Black Hill through it. The resurgence of this caliber is interesting to watch. I read somewhere the 38-40 is "the new 44 spl".

[9.3X62AL]

[QUOTE=targetshootr]Good to hear that about Rugers.

Not so good if the throats are at .449" and the grooves run .452", as a 45 Colt in my safe used to be like. If an owner is willing to finish building them, it's all good.

I would be keenly interested in reading more about 38-40's being run through both rifles and revolvers. There's tons of stuff about 45 Colts, and some about the other small-sized WCF hyphenated rounds--but not a lot said about the 38-40. Having examples in 25-20, 32-20, and 44-40, maybe I should take the plunge and fill the void with a replica in this caliber, and learn things first-hand.

[targetshootr]

I stuck a 40 cal jacketed in the wrong end of the Buckeye cylinder and noticed a difference between em which means the throats may vary. I have reamers and pilots to fix 44 and 45 throats but not 40 cal so when it goes to be fitted I'll ask him to check. I was a little hesitant to set up for this caliber after ruining a lot of 44-40 cases in the Dillon but I think I'm gonna like shooting this one a lot more.

[DOUBLEJK]

I just aquired a Ruger 38-40 10MM convertible for my birthday....its in transit and I am eagerly awaitin' its arrival...
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v256/DOUBLEJK/38-40Ruger.jpg

Lookin' at sizin' dies none of the Lyman er RCBS are bigger than .401
It seems they jump to .406 as the next biggest size....so if the Ruger needs a bit more it looks like a lappin' project to get one the right size...

[targetshootr]

Nice looking gun. l heard the 10mm has more zip than the 40. Kinda wish my extry cyl was 10mm.

[9.3X62AL]

The 10mm Auto gains about 200-250 FPS over the 40 S&W in a given bullet weight. I run RCBS 200 grain TC's to 1100 FPS in my 10mm, while the 40 S&W runs 180 TC's at about 900-925 FPS.

In SMG's, the Winchester Silvertip 10mm (175 grain) goes about 1400 FPS, while in the 5" pistol barrel they hit about 1290 FPS.

[targetshootr]

Now it's official, shoulda got 10mm. But I've got 14 boxes of 40 cal in the garage and had nothing to shoot it in...and I bet it would work fine in a 10mm cyl too, eh.

[9.3X62AL]

The only fly in the ointment I can surmise in using 40 S&W rounds in the Ruger 10mm cylinder is absence of a headspacing reference. In the Blackhawk convertibles in 9mm/357 and 45 ACP/45 Colt, the cylinders built for the autopistol rounds have a sharp chamber end that the case mouth lodges against to enable proper headspacing. Having not examined one of the 10mm/38-40 Rugers, I don't know for certain that the same arrangement is used--but I'll bet that is what's on board.

The 10mm is about .140" longer than is the 40 S&W. Getting good firng pin strikes on 40 S&W rounds in the 10mm revolver chamber might be problematic. The only alternative I can dream up would be adaptation of the 1/3 moon or full moon clips by Ranch Products (Malinta, OH) usually found in S&W revolvers like the M-610. THAT is pure speculation, and it would be a lot less work to just get some 10mm cases.

One real benefit of the Ruger system is the strength of the Blackhawk platform compared to most handguns chambering either the 38-40 or the 10mm. I would think that Winchester 1892/Marlin 1894 load intensities would be quite safe in the Blackhawks, while the SAA and New Service in 38-40 are pretty much limited to 1880's load levels. As far as the 10mm goes, the touted "200 grain bullets at 1200 FPS" isn't a good steady diet for either Colt or S&W 10mm self-loaders--I limit the 200 grain slugs to 1100 FPS to extend my pistol's service life, based on reports of receiver cracks to Colt pistols using full-tilt load ratings. The Ruger would again be able to maximize performance and exploit all that the 10mm has to offer without much worry about platform stresses.

[45 2.1]

The "Buckeye" 10 mm cylinder headspaces on the case mouth and hasn't got any taper in the leade. You need the 10mm cases if you got one and the boolits need to be seated where very little of the bearing surface shows.

[targetshootr]

Back to glad it's 40 cal. Something else I've wondered is if jacketed will shorten the life of an old model Ruger barrel which is what I like to use in conversions. Brian Pearce said as much about his older 29s in Handloader.

[9.3X62AL]

I'd like to be able to wear out a revolver barrel with j-words, or have the time and money to dedicate to the effort anyway. Using any mechanism causes wear, and I suspect j-words cause more wear than boolits do.

I don't liken a Ruger Blackhawk or a S&W D/A to a Win 70 in 264 WM, where just getting loads developed allegedly causes throat erosion. I would think a S&W D/A would develop end-shake and advancing hand/locking bolt wear before barrel erosion became an issue. The Blackhawk's advancing hand disengages from cylinder ratchet contact as the hammer falls, so it is largely unstressed by firing.

Shoot that critter and enjoy it.