Do Patch Lubes Really Matter?

[Maven]

Several people on the American Long Rifle forum have been extolling the virtues of using a patch lubricated only with saliva, the well-known spit patch. Since saliva is free and my "go to" patch lube is running low, I decided to try it, with very good results. I even posted those results with pics here. However, I tried this again over the last 2 days with my normally quite accurate rifles and was sorely disappointed with the results. Indeed, if I got 2 shots touching with either gun, it was an accident. In short, my shots were scattered all over the target. In the midst of yesterday's "patterning" of my Lyman Great Plains .50cal., it dawned on me that the only things I'd changed were the lube and not wiping the bore after firing and again after seating a spit soaked patch & RB. As I had my usual lube with me ("Old Slickum" from Dixie), I tried it, wiping before & after as was my habit: Voila! Accuracy returned. Just to make sure it wasn't a fluke, I reloaded using a spit patch and leaving the bore wet, or rather not wiping before & after. That shot was way out of group...again. Btw, the conditions weren't ideal (gusty winds) either day and got worse, I wasn't able to test the spit patch with the before & after wiping routine. That remains for another day.

Over the years I've tried a handful of lubes, mostly with favorable results (Winchester Sutler's Moose Milk, Wonder Lube 1000, T/C yellow Bore Butter, Young Country's 103 Lube, Old Slickum), but always wiping the bore as mentioned earlier. Maybe saliva is as effective as the others if the same routine is followed, but at this moment, I'm a bit doubtful.

[gnoahhh]

I'm a believer in spit patch, it has always worked for me. I keep a patch in my mouth ready for the next shot so it's well and truly soaked. The patching I use is .015" pillow ticking, and I wash it before using so as to remove the sizing (starch) they put in it during manufacture. I will say I only use that method when target shooting because I don't want a soaking wet patch on top of the powder charge for very long, plus it will dry out while hunting all day (after first dampening the powder). For hunting I pre-lube patches with bear grease. Having tried more commercial lubes than Carter's has little liver pills, I keep coming back to spit patch. In serious competition I'll wipe the bore between shots, but that doesn't make a big difference in accuracy for me.

Just techniques that work for me.

[pietro]

HEY ! Y'all hush up, now - 'bout spit patches ! !

My wife'll get grossed out, if she finds out I been spittin' in our venison. :bigsmyl2:

.

[RBak]

WOW! What a question!

There are probably as many answers to that question as there are shooters.

However, I'm with Maven on this....in other words, the jury is still out.

I have been shooting Muzzleloaders since sometime in the early to mid 1950's. Back in those days most Muzzleloaders were referred to as "homemade", instead of custom built, and your choice was very limited.
Some were even classed "nice homemade", while others were simply called homemade.
My first flinter cost me $45 cash. Cash that came from working all summer and was made by Bill Grady of El Paso, Texas...(Shady Grady they called him, as some may have questioned his character, but it seems there was never an unkind word about his craftsmanship.)

In the 50's I started out with the spit-patch. The spit-patch was the only "lube" as far as my grand daddy was concerned, but my Dad later heard that unsalted Lard was the way to go, so I changed....I stayed with plain old Lard, or Crisco for many years.
Then sometime in the late 60's early 70's shooting Black Powder came alive...suddenly everybody and their cousin had a Muzzleloader, and everybody had their own idea of what the perfect lube was.
This "new" hobby caught the attention of a few writers and suddenly we had things in print ... there was even a magazine with all kinds of wild stories dedicated to the sport.
And then, along with all this, there came the thought that in order to properly use these guns we had to be Period Correct or Historically Correct, and everyone started using the spit-patch again....me too!

However, after thousands of round ball being sent down range, I could never see that certain magic that was supposedly connected to the spit-patch.
By this time there was no fewer than a couple of dozen lubes on the market and I was determined that I would somehow find something that would allow me to just "stack 'em up".

Well this never happened, even to this day I can't just make it happen at will.
Today, I have a little less than two bottles left of what I once considered one of the best, ie most consistent lubes I ever tried and that is Lehigh Valley lube...old formula, or so I'm told. I'm also told you can still buy it, but it is no longer the same. I don't know if there is any truth in this or not, but I do know that this lube has performed as well, or better than any other lube I have tried in the past fifty years.

I have been told so much, for so long, about so many different lubes, that I no longer know what to believe.

The one thing I do firmly believe in is the fact that groups will change dramatically depending on the amount of pressure on the ball/patch on the powder...that and consistency in your loading technique seems to best thing you can do to maintain accuracy...even with the spit-patch.

Sorry I got so long winded. Kinda like getting it off your chest, if you know what I mean.

Russ...

[missionary5155]

Greetings
When my dad starting shooting spit was what everyone used because that was what everyone used since a patch got placed over the muzzle. So that is what I use always unless I am hunting and the bore will stay loaded all day.. then it gets olive oil and beeswax cause there just is no more bear grease or whale oil.... least that is what dad said.

[Lead Fred]

Ive been using Thompson Center's 1000+ bore butter for as long as its been out.

There is nothing better

[PAT303]

I tied spit patches but after a string it gets harder and harder to seat the ball,the last inch or two above the powder is very firm.In the desert more moisture is needed. Pat

[northmn]

I never was a fan of spit patches because quite frankly on a hot day I would run out of spit during a match. Personally I never really felt that there was some magical lube out there. A point on shooting with any of the liquid lubes. If the patch ball combination is relatively loose you get more fouling and the lube will not make a lot of difference. Those that extolled the virtues of spit patches without wiping also use a very tight ball combination. A lot of attention is paid to the barrel crown to expediite seating with a short starter. A short starter is used. I can get good accuracy without wiping for at least a 5 shot string, and have done so many times with this combination. The coned crowned barrel and thumb started ball have their place, and offer a "practical accuracy" but for optimum accuracy you will need to use a tight combination. Also you will find that those having success use a little larger ball than often recommended. A 495 in a 50 TC instead of the 490. I used to use a 445 in my 45's and a 319 in my 32. These slightly larger ball also seal the bore better.
Liquid lubes clean the bore when loading and when used in conjunction with a tight patch can offer pretty good accuracy without cleaning. However, variations in humdity can also offer problems. I have had days when the pan in the flintlock is dripping with moisture after a shot. Other days when you get a hard fouling build up. All with the same lubes. As to the alchemy of different lubes, many have their favorites which may be nothing more than dependent upon region, or individual rifle. As to not using saliva, or spit. I never cared for it either and only shoot it as an expediency. Most of the shooters that seem to know their stuff like lubes like Lehigh Valley. Some I think extol the virtues of spit becasue they somehow think it is more correct. Tallow is probably the most correct.

Northmn

[iron brigade]

the best i have found is hoppes #9 black solve. very consistent. keeping the bore consistant from shot to shot as well as the load is the key to accuracy.
weighing the lead balls to .5 grains of each other, same powder/charge, same lube and patch.
every thing has to be the same. sighting, trigger control ect. the dutch schultz method is some very good info, and i did use his dry patch lube with excellent results.

[Hanshi]

the best i have found is hoppes #9 black solve. very consistent. keeping the bore consistant from shot to shot as well as the load is the key to accuracy.
weighing the lead balls to .5 grains of each other, same powder/charge, same lube and patch.
every thing has to be the same. sighting, trigger control ect. the dutch schultz method is some very good info, and i did use his dry patch lube with excellent results.

Hoppes is also my lube of choice.

[Swampman]

In a gun with good deep rifling, spit without wiping between shots works ok. In mass produced rifles with shallow rifling like the T/C Hawken they are so hard to load that wiping between shots really helps. With spit I can barely load my T/Cs. With a good patch lube like Birddog6 or my homemade lube it's not that bad. Commerical lubes are nice but there are so many really cheap homemade choices for lube and cleaning I can't see any reason to waste the money.

Weighing balls or powder is a waste of time.