Wild shooting in the heat of the day

[PAT303]

I've been doing alot of shooting lately as our National titles are in April and the one thing going wrong is the shooting during the hot part of the day,my rifles are fine in the morning and then they go off,my Pat 61 muskatoon was going great guns,5 shots inside 2'' at 100 and then 2 very wide and then shot point of aim instead of center bull with 6o'clock hold,funny thing was it still shot well just low.Does the lube cause this type of thing?,I'm keeping it simple and using olive oil and beeswax and it is quite soft.The conditions,sunny all day,no wind just hot. Pat

[missionary5155]

Good morning
I have found as temps increase I had to change my Oliveoil / beeswax mix so it stayed to the same thickness. I use about 5% less olive oil on the HOT days. I would think some oil could be leeching into the load.
Another factor could be the humidity. On a HOT DRY day fouling will get harder. As you load IF you are feeling more resistence than you know the fouling is dryer. You may need a moist patch run down the bore first. I do know fellers who always run a moist patch before reloading.

[357maximum]

Pure Lanolin and or pure glycerin added to your current lube to make it softer will likely help. Lanolin just makes it softer and slicker...glycerin makes the lube very hydroscopic. On the few days here where it is both hot and dry the glycerin added to my normal lube really seemed to help keep fouling consistant. We do not get many days like that because when it gets hot here it normally gets wet (humid) also so my testing has been limited but the glycerin sure seemed to help.

A glycerin rich lube is not LONG term stable so only make up what you need for the immediate future use. Do not go nutsy cuckoo and make up a big batch as glycerin loves to grab water from the air and your lube will not last in the form in which you intended.

[oldhickory]

Crisco and bees wax is what I've used for years on Minies with little or no variance as to temp. I just melt 8oz of bees wax in a pie pan and add about 3-4oz of Crisco. When hardened you should just get a light film on your fingers by rubbing them across the lube.

I pan lube my Minies and run them through a push through sizer .001" smaller than land dia. of the musket's rifling. .577 land dia.=.576 Minies.

[rhbrink]

All the above sounds like good advice. How hot and how much humidity or lack of are you shooting in? I'd bet it's a tempurature, moisture, lube breakdown, problem I haven't shot many Minies but have spent a lot of time shooting big lead boolits and 90 to 100 grains of 2FF in the 100* dry and windy summertime heat and it does become a problem to keep enough moisture in the barrel to keep the fouling soft. A pretty simple lube is Emmerts with lanolin added works ok but I have had better luck with the store bought stuff those guys just seem to know some things that us normal folks don't. You probably don't want to buy lube but it might be best to buy some and just use it in the tough conditions and use your lube in the more favorable times. Hope this helps.

[PAT303]

I have lanolin so will make up a small batch and try it,357max were do you buy glycerin?. Pat

[357maximum]

Any pharmacy should have it. It is actually $ucked out of $oap during $oap production and I think I got mine at a RIGHTAID last time. It is a main ingredient in them hand creme$ that makes your hands all $oft and womanly.

I really wish I could do more in depth testing...but being down wind of LK. Michigan I do not get many hot/dry days.

[webfoot10]

Hi Guys; Take the crisco and olive oil and throw it out. Get some venison or sheep tallow
mix it with pure lard and beeswax to the thickness you like, and lube your bullets or patches
and go shooting. I have been shooting black powder for 30 plus yrs. and have tried all the
lubes and find that the animal fat and beeswax lubes work best. If you shoot in the cold plain
unsalted lard works best as it will melt with the heat of your fingers. Use the tallow and beeswax for hot weather, as it is a harder lube. I see all these lube recipes that may or maynot work. The animal fat and beeswax lubes work. Most of my shooting is in the New
England area, ( Maine) mostly. Most of the guys I shoot with use my ( Duck Lube as they call
it) in all their black powder guns. So go with the tallow and beeswax lubes you won't be
sorry. webfoot

[357maximum]

Hot/Dry conditions are the hardest to make work(I read that). Those of us who have humidity have it easy compared to those in the western US or Australia perhaps. I too use soft animal tallow(deer, sheep) based lubes, but HOT/DRY is a whole other shooting match entirely. Hot/Dry is what seperates the haves and have nots in the lube department with BP according to all the BP sites and all the books I have read.

When I was doing my testing I was trying to make a universal BP lube...it soon became apparent that I do not live in the right climate to create such a critter........almost all the softer bp lubes I created "worked". In theory the glycerin should be a good lube component for those that live in hot/dry areas......I tried to prove that theory and saw some hope...but conditions here simply would not allow a long term PROOF test.

I even consulted Felix before taking my short quest/journey to see if I was theorizing correctly, but for now I am gonna hand the ball over to Pat to do the rest of the testing. I read it in a book and theory about should works, only gets you so far with you live in a temperate rainforest. I simply do not have enough hot/dry days to do the research to settle them little voices in my head once and for all.

I hope some of you desert dwellers can answer the question once and for all.

[PAT303]

Bloody hell mate put some preesure on me!!.I shot today,still very hot with beeswax,olive oil,lanolin lube and it was very buttery and in my swiss federal rifle it did finally group well,3P 4prone,3 kneeling,3 offhand and it didn't shoot outside the 8 ring,I shot well because of the confidence factor.Tomorrow I'll chase up some glycerin as 6 months of the year here it's warm to hot si I need it.I've got next week off so I'll do some testing and let you know how I go. Pat

[rhbrink]

Sounds like you are on PAT303 keep us informed. Don't know how hot and dry you are talking about but my experience was in Western Kansas July and August temps easily reach 100* humidity don't really know but it'll suck the mositure right out of you. I experimented with a lot of my own lubes and a number of store bought stuff and actually there wasn't much store bought lube that held up all day. A lot of them would melt off the boolits if you didn't keep them in the shade, most would were workable in the mornings until the sun started bearing down and the wind picked. My home range had a log chain with a chunk of log hanging on it for a wind gauge, that tell you any thing about the wind. I would dearly love to be able to make my own lube that works under all conditions but so far have failed and did work a little with beef tallow maybe try some sheep or deer next. One thing good though I now have enough boot dubbing to last a life time. Good Luck and keep shootin'.

[northmn]

I have heard that BPC lubes like SPG might work in very hot weather? when it got hot and I could feel the fouling getting hard I used to just swab more, but that would defeat the purpose of a Minnie.

Northmn

[PAT303]

Sounds like you are on PAT303 keep us informed. Don't know how hot and dry you are talking about but my experience was in Western Kansas July and August temps easily reach 100* humidity don't really know but it'll suck the mositure right out of you. I experimented with a lot of my own lubes and a number of store bought stuff and actually there wasn't much store bought lube that held up all day. A lot of them would melt off the boolits if you didn't keep them in the shade, most would were workable in the mornings until the sun started bearing down and the wind picked. My home range had a log chain with a chunk of log hanging on it for a wind gauge, that tell you any thing about the wind. I would dearly love to be able to make my own lube that works under all conditions but so far have failed and did work a little with beef tallow maybe try some sheep or deer next. One thing good though I now have enough boot dubbing to last a life time. Good Luck and keep shootin'.

Thats the conditions I shoot in.I've got some pears soap which according to my sources is the oldest glycerin soap so now the question is how much do I use?.The lube I made today is 200grams of beeswax,200grams of lanolin grease and 6 table spoons of olive oil,I'll take a small amount and add half a table spoon of soap shavings and try it for size,unless some one has a better idea. Pat

[357maximum]

Pat

The soap will require a fair amount of heat to get it into the melt. This amount of heat can ruin lanolin. I suggest you add the soap to the beeswax first at high heat, back the heat down a bit then add the OO. Then turn off the heat and add the lanolin lastly as things are cooling down.


I have done similar with Murphy's oil soap/beeswax mixes and while it worked as a summer lube additive the lube will get the "crumblies" over time as the moisture intentionally left in the lube dries out and the beeswax oxidizes.

Most beeswax rich/based lubes will also get the "crumblies" over time as the beeswax never stops "blooming and oxidizing"...........that is the main reason I went to a microwax base.....it does not "bloom" as beeswax does and I can prelube my conicals a year or more in advance.............but I have alot more forgiving shooting conditions than you are facing...not sure if the micro would work in a super dry environment.

My current "best" lube for BP conicals is a simple mix of 50% 160 degree(farenheit) melt temp soft microwax and 50% home rendered deer tallow. I have been testing shooting accuracy as well as for "crumblies" on stored maxihunters. It shoots good and so far so good on the "crumblies"....this mix is looking to be quite oxidation proof. I am very happy with it and it is dead simple to make.


Good Luck

[PAT303]

Thanks mate,will it still go off if I store it in an airtight container?,I have my pan lube trays in tupperware containers to keep them clean and find it's good for them.The soap,beeswax,lanolin lube would make a good pistol lube too I think. Pat

[357maximum]

The only way I know of to keep beeswax from blooming is to totally evacuate all oxygen in a container. I have not persued that quest...I changed waxes instead.

I use bp lubes on 38spcl/45LC boolits all the time...it works well.

[runnin lead]

Hot & dry try wiping between shots with a damp patch , not WET just damp well squeezed
out patch with Ballistol & water or antifreeze, It works for BPCR

[PAT303]

Well had another go today with lanolin in the lube and it's made a very big difference,the lube now is not dirty or runny and the bores seem alot cleaner.I have not used 2F in my musketoon as it always fouled badly but today I shot 40/3F at 100 and it was OK so I shot 5 shots with 50/2F and all 5 were in the 10 ring,the lanolin has for sure made the lube alot smoother and the fouling is softer,my swiss federal rifle needed a wet then dry patch but today only needed dry ones and it is shooting very well,it does have white coloured muck in the lands after shooting though but it doesn't bother it.It is still hot here,my earmuffs have sweat dribbling out of them and my jacket is giving me crotch rot but the lube is working. Pat

[Hellgate]

Pat303,
Where do you get lanolin and if I may be so bold, what is your lube recipe? Right now I am using deer tallow and beeswax in a 50/50 mix by volume (melted). I was using 50/50 BW and lard but it is a little soft. I haven't shot any BW/tallow loads for accuracy yet.

[PAT303]

Mate it's readily available from auto stores,bearing suppliers,general engineering suppliers.My lube is equal amounts of beeswax and lanolin grease with olive oil added to get a nice buttery feel about it.As I said above it has totally changed the way the lube works,I always felt that a wet patch and dry patch after each shot was doing more harm than good as consistancy is the name of the game,I also always shoot a fouler if for any reason I have to stop for more than a few minutes. Pat

[357maximum]

Hellgate

Here in the States you can find it in most hippie/health food stores in a purple tub with the NOW brand on it. Normally about 4 bucks for 7ozs....that will make alot of charcoal lube. There is also liquid lanolin available...a thinner cut of the paste...I use that with 90% alcohol for case lube (shake and bake in a baggie).

[PAT303]

I've mixed up a small batch with glycerin soap that I'll try at the end of the week. Pat