cast for the 32 acp?

[Nora]

Does anyone do any cast loading with the 32 acp? I've been entertaining the thought, but am at a loss for any useful information. The "normal" factory loads use a bullet between 60-71 gr. Wile the molds for .311 boolits range between 75-100 gn. The only thing I have in this flavor is a CZ-50, and will just be looking for some cheap plinking rounds. Any thoughts? What saids the masses?

Thanks in advance

Nora

[Bullshop Junior]

I know my dad shoots them in a Revolver, but I don't know if his loads would work a auto.

[jdgabbard]

There is always the Lyman 311252... 77g, and max velocity is around 850 - 950 fps with this one, depending on powder selection...

[Harry O]

The Lyman 77gr RN works for me, too. I use up to 2.3gr of Red Dot or 2.1gr of Bullseye. That is the upper end for .32ACP, but not excessive. Works well in my Walther PPK and Mauser Hsc.

One trick that works for me is to slighly roll crimp the .32ACP. It is semi-rimmed and will work with a crimp. That seems to give better accuracy (I think because of more uniform pull when fired) for me in my guns. The only problem is the small size of the cases. It is easy to pinch fingers. I don't even want to think about trying to load the .25ACP.

[primersp]

i use lyman 313249 83grs bullet sized at 310 in ppk

[45 2.1]

The RCBS 77 gr. cast RN with 1.9 gr. of Bullseye is excellent.

[Trapshooter]

I've had pretty good results with Green Dot, the charge weight is a little larger, so variations are a smaller percent of the total. I use the 313249 in mine too.

Trapshooter

[gray wolf]

Funny you should ask! Hand loading is not new to me but the little 32 auto is.
I have loaded about 200 so far and Like everyone else I try to be safety orientated.
So I wondered about the heavy bullets also. I have loaded about 200 so far with some bullets that were given to me from folks on the board. The weight is around 75 to 78 grains.
I believe most were from the Lyman mold. # 311252.
I have bulls eye and tite group powder. The load in my book list 2 to 2.2 grains for the tite group with a 71 grain bullet.
My first test was in my shed with ear plugs and eye protection shot into a bucket of sand
was 1.9 of tite group. Soft load , extracted well and dropped brass next to me. next was 2 grains of tite group, also a nice load to shoot and the brass stayed in my State. the factory loads
need to have a string attached to the brass in order to find them Ha,Ha,
If the 1.9 load hits to a good point of aim at about 10 yards that will be my load, and I think my wife will be happy.
There is information out there for heavier bullets but I have not tried them yet. I must get a mold and can't afford one at this time. At the time I do I think I will start with the 70 to 80 grain weight.
About reloading--My Lee dies allow for a taper crimp so I use a light one and it has worked well. I took the expander die apart and polished the stem that goes into the case, Just that part and not the part that flares the case mouth. The cases load a little easier and the bullet grip is a tiny bit tighter. So I don't need such a heavy crimp. I am not a heavy crimp advocate anyway, specialy on a taper crimp. Just enough to remove the flare and snug up the case mouth.
My cases were all mixed brass and that caused the bullets to seat different in the cases.
some deeper and some out of the case a little more than others. The pistol is a Beretta tom cat and they all shot and extracted with no problems. I did notice a slight difference in the report of some rounds and attributed it to the difference in case volume do to the seating depth. So I separated some cases of the same head stamp that were very close to the same length and the bullets seated to just about all the same distance into the case. This seem to give more consistent ignition as it should.
All the powder was checked on the balance beam for consistent powder weight.
I plan on getting a case holder for my Wilson trimmer and trim the cases to as close to same length as I can. I will stay with the tite group powder for now.
The little 32 auto is a small round and it seems everything you do is magnified so I feel that consistency is important.--bullet weight, case length,and powder weight.
Sorry for all the info it's just the way I do things.
Hope it helps.

[jonk]

I use an 85 gr Lyman bullet and 1.5 gr (max) of bullseye. I modified a Lee dipper (.3cc) with some hot glue to dip this teeny tiny amount.

Can't say accuracy is great but then, for a gun with a 2 inch barrel I don't expect much past 25 feet and it's fine out to there.

I have a PPK, Beretta M1934, CZ70, Browning 1910/22, Ortgies, I swear something else I'm forgetting...

I use the same in my .32 smith and wesson and sw longs, and in my Nagant revolver.

[zardoz]

Nora:

A few months ago, I posted a thread on how I modified one the less expensive Lee moulds, to make a workable boolit for the 32 ACP. It gave me a 74 grain RN, which was perfect. I have cast, loaded, and fired a few dozen of these so far.

Here is a link to the thread, with all the details, photos, chrono results, with comparison to factory rounds.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=49925&highlight=lee+32acp

Maybe this might give you an alternative.

[Nora]

A few months ago, I posted a thread on how I modified one the less expensive Lee moulds.
Maybe this might give you an alternative.

I'm now having an "I could have had a V-8 moment." That is excactly what I was looking for. In stead of thinking outside the box, ya just make the box smaller. :smile:

Nora

[gray wolf]

Now that was a great piece of work and your article was so nicely done.
I love the creativity.
Now that is sharing.

Thank yo

[michiganflyer]

I have been reloading for my Beretta Tomcat for a couple years. I use 78 g cast (I got from a guy on here), with 1.9g bullseye. Works great for me.
I am toying with getting a mold but I haven't so far. I cast for just about everything I shoot, rifle, and a zillion pistols, just not the .32 acp. Here is a question for you guys, do any of the guys ever go in a mold and then share them? I see the group buys, but I assumed those are a number of guys all buying molds at the same time to get a better price. I guess 200 or so .32 bullets last me a year or more, so didn't figure a mold would be worthwhile.
Ron

[EMC45]

Great article Zardoz! I must have missed that last year.

[kywoodwrkr]

Lee made a 32 ACP mold early on in their history.
I have one of them.
Problem I have run into with the 32 ACP is the case sidewall taper.
Boolits greater than the 71 gr sometimes create a bulge at the base of the boolit.
I've loaded both a bunch of 25 and 32 ACP for the little guys.
I will tell you a pound of powder does go a long way!
Have/had a small drum powder measure with inserts for the critters.
Will cut a Lee down though when and if I get one.
But that's behind a whole lot of other projects right now.

[Willbird]

Somebody or other somewhere was using the Lee 358-105-SWC and it was working just fine for them.

Bill

[rbuck351]

I've been using a Lyman 313226 at 93 grs with 2.7gr Unique for 858fps.

[beagle]

Good article. You need to consolidate that when you finish and send it to Wiljen to put on Castpics so that it be there for others to use. Don't think there's anything on there about the .32 Autos./beagle


Nora:

A few months ago, I posted a thread on how I modified one the less expensive Lee moulds, to make a workable boolit for the 32 ACP. It gave me a 74 grain RN, which was perfect. I have cast, loaded, and fired a few dozen of these so far.

Here is a link to the thread, with all the details, photos, chrono results, with comparison to factory rounds.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=49925&highlight=lee+32acp

Maybe this might give you an alternative.

[JIMinPHX]

I messed with that caliber for a short time, many years ago. All I really remember was that it was VERY sensitive to the powder charge being exactly the same each time. A 0.1 grain difference makes a huge difference in that tiny little thing.

[beemer]

I have used the Lee 100 gr. round nose in my CZ-50. Sometimes you do get a case bulge and the heavy boolit makes the powder charge even more sensitive.

1 gr. of Bullseye cycled the pistol almost all the time and was about 550 fps, I went up to 1.1 grs and it made a difference, anything over that starts to get hot fast. S&B shoots about 4 to 5 in. high in my pistol, the reloads are closer to POA.

I think the 100 gr. is too heavy for the 32 ACP but I had one borrowed for my 32 S&W Long and thought I would try it. If the mould was mine I would cut it down. I did take a Lee 30 cal. soupcan and cut the gas check off and made a 100 gr FN for my Colt PP Special.

Dave

[Outpost75]

I've reloaded for the .32 ACP for over thirty years. The Speer No. 13 handbook states that 3-4" groups at 25 yards are the best you can hope for. This agrees with my experience. My Beretta Model 3031 Tomcat barely does this with good ammo when I do everything right. Typical 25-yard eight-shot groups are more like six inches. More traditional "full-sized" .32 police pistols with barrels of 3-1/2" or longer do much better and are more useful as field guns for small game within 50 feet or so.

My experience with many .32 ACP pistols over the years suggests the most accurate pocket guns are the Walther PP (not the PPK - it little better than the mouseguns), Beretta M70, Colt 1903 Pocket Hammerless and the CZ Models 27 and 50. Any of these reliably group 2-1/2” at 50 feet, with good ammo. The best .32 Automatics with tweaked handloads can do 2 inches at 50 feet over a series of groups without excluding any "called shots" or fliers. Any pocket pistol which does so should be considered a “keeper.” This is reality.

In testing, WWII-era .32 autos, typical results are 4 inch group averages for a series of 8-shot groups at 25 yards, firing full magazines off sandbags with European CIP specification RWS, Privi Partisan, Sellier & Bellot or Fioccho Ball ammo. This compares to what typical 2-inch .38 Special snubbies do for five or six shots off sandbags at the same range with +P service ammo, a good benchmark. The overwhelming limiting factor in accuracy of these small handguns is their short sight radius.

A personal defense gun is used from near-contact distance to about 10 meters. Sight radius is less important because recommended CQB technique is "target focussed" watching the bad guy's hands, firing "burst on target" double- and triple taps in 2 seconds or less, moving to cover, shoot and scoot, rather than being deliberately "sight focussed," for carefully aimed single rounds, as when engaging targets beyond ten meters, such as the grouse or rabbit you want to eat tonite.

My favorite cast bullet handloads in .32 ACP use either the 98-grain Saeco #325 semi-wadcutter, or 88-gr. NEI #82 flatnose. If you do not cast your own bullets, buy 94-grain Meisters and load 1.7 grains of Bullseye, seating bullets to 0.955-0.975" overall cartridge length. If you cast your own, use the RCBS 32-90CM and use wheelweights, tumble-lubricate as-cast bullets with Lee Liquid Alox, and load as-cast and unsized with 1.8 grains of Bullseye. The 98-grain Saeco #325 SWC bullet can be crimped in the normal revolver crimp groove and be loaded with 1.7 of Bullseye. Do not load NEI or Meister bullets shorter than 0.95 inch. Taper crimp using a custom Lee Factory Crimp Die which has a carbide full length sizer to removes any bulges caused by mis-match of bullet diameter with case wall taper. This profiles loaded rounds for easy chambering and size the bullet by compression inside the case. A custom Lee FCD costs $30 and I recommend one for anyone who is serious about loading the .32 ACP.

The 88-grain NEI #82 bullet with 2 grains of Bullseye is a full charge load which should not be exceeded. Do not exceed 1.8 grains of Bullseye with any cast bullets over 90 grains.

WW2 era European pistols vary all over the map with respect to barrel bore and groove dimensions, twist rate and chamber dimensions. Colts, Berettas and Walthers have 16 inch twist, FNs, CZs and Mausers have 10 inch twists. FN, Mauser and Walther pistols in my collection typically have groove diameters of .307-.309, Berettas, CZs and Colts run .310-.312. I have not seen chamber throats smaller than .311, but have seen WWI and WWII era Spanish, French and and Italian pistols as with throats as large as .316. This wide variation in bore sizes coupled with factory jacketed bullet diameters from .308 to .312 explains alot of the accuracy problems people experience with the .32 ACP.

In my experience European Sellier & Bellot, Sako, Lapua, and RWS ammo having the smaller bullet diameter works best in Walthers, Mausers, MABs and FNs, while larger Privi-Partisan, Fiocchi and handload using Magtech, Remington Hornady and Speer jacketed bullets are more accurate in Kel Tec, Beretta, Colt, Astra, Unique, Star, Llama and CZ.

My 1935 Beretta wartime pistol had an oversized .315 throat with .313 groove diameter barrel and produced six inch-plus groups at 25 yards with its original WWII salt and pepper barrel. After fitting a new barrel machined from a 14 inch twist Hart .308 blank with chamber which headspaces on the case mouth, using the front portion of a .30 M1 Carbine reamer groups shrunk to 3 inches and under at 25 yards with good ammo, using iron sights.

Don't ask what it costs to machine a chunk of Hart barrel and have custom chambering reamers and headspaces gages ground. If you need to ask, you cannot afford it. Figure seven hours of machine time, plus the cost of barrel blanks and tooling. Ahh...what we do for science~!

European CIP throat dimensions specify 7.9 + .05mm - 0.0 mm. or .311-.313", so for most pistols a .313 bullet is correct, but wartime pistols may need .314 bullets, if they will chamber safely without resistance. If your chamber is tight, but the throat is large, good results can be obtained by loading the bullet as-cast and unsized, leaving a portion of the driving shoulder exposed ahead of the case mouth to fill the throat, and using a custom Lee Factory Crimp die to profile the loaded rounds to within max. cartridge dimensions, eliminating any case bulges caused by mis-match of bullet diameter to internal case wall taper.
My standard v.32 ACP bullet is the NEI#82 shortened to 88 grains, with 2 grains of Alliant Bullseye, the charge is varied slightly depending upon case weight. RWS and Fiocchi brass weigh 40 +/- 1 grain and get a 0.1 grain lighter charge. Remington brass weigh 36 +/- grains and gets a 0.1 grain heavier charge. Either load gives about 850 f.p.s. in a 10cm barrel such as the Walther PP. In guns which feed SWCs, I use the 98-gr. Saeco #325 with 1.7 grains of Bullseye, and crimp in the normal revolver crimp groove. Its large flat nose is very effective on small game.

Do not shoot a great many heavy bullet .32 ACPs in Kel Tecs or others having light aluminum alloy frames, because they are "frame crackers" and harder on the gun. I use these loads only insteel-framed European guns balanced for heavier bullet 73-74-gr. ammo. WWII-era pistols won't at all with typical US 71-gr. commercial ammo or 60-gr, JHPs.

In my chronograph testing Remington, Winchester, Federal and Magtech 71-gr. FMJ ammo average only about 850 f.p.s. from a full sized pistol such as the Walther PP, Beretta M70 or FN M1922. CIP specificiation 73-gr. ammo such as RWS, Geco, Fiocchi or Sellier & Bellot goes 900-950 f.p.s. American 60-gr. JHPs typically give about 900 f.p.s. but because of their light bullet, may not have enough recoil impulse to reliably operate older European pistols.

[Outpost75]

75923 75925 75928 75929

[mikeym1a]

I know my dad shoots them in a Revolver, but I don't know if his loads would work a auto.
which revolter shoots the .32ACP?:veryconfu

[Outpost75]

Any revolver chambered for the .32 ACP will set off .32 ACPs, but you should be advised that frequent and continued use is not recommended, because the thinner .32 ACP rim produces a condition akin to excessive headspace, and that firing .32 ACPs in a long term and continuous basis results in the case head slamming against the firing pin bushing in the frame, and may set back and loosening it, necessitating a costly factory repair.

Firing .32 ACP ammo in the .32 S&W Long chamber also results in significant gas leakage which might cause a bullet to be lodged in the barrel, so I would consider this as an emergency expedient only. I have tried it, but accuracy is degraded and there is significant velocity loss, so I cannot recommend it as a normal practice, but for "extremis" conditions only.

[10mmShooter]

In my 1910 Mauser, I load a 78g RCBS bullet 32-077-RN, with 1.6 g of WW231, charge is reduced since I have to deep seat to .910 inches. cycles great and shoots good too for a 100 year gun.

[mikeym1a]

Any revolver chambered for the .32 ACP will set off .32 ACPs, but you should be advised that frequent and continued use is not recommended, because the thinner .32 ACP rim produces a condition akin to excessive headspace, and that firing .32 ACPs in a long term and continuous basis results in the case head slamming against the firing pin bushing in the frame, and may set back and loosening it, necessitating a costly factory repair.

Firing .32 ACP ammo in the .32 S&W Long chamber also results in significant gas leakage which might cause a bullet to be lodged in the barrel, so I would consider this as an emergency expedient only. I have tried it, but accuracy is degraded and there is significant velocity loss, so I cannot recommend it as a normal practice, but for "extremis" conditions only.

Okay, but what revolvers are chambered for the .32ACP??

[Outpost75]

I gave seen some "no name" French, Italian and Belgian, folding trigger revolvers of low quality, made in the period from WW1 to the late 1920s, which were chambered in 7.65mm Browning, similar in design to the Velo Dog revolver.

[mikeym1a]

I gave seen some "no name" French, Italian and Belgian, folding trigger revolvers of low quality, made in the period from WW1 to the late 1920s, which were chambered in 7.65mm Browning, similar in design to the Velo Dog revolver.

Yeah, but nothing recent, I would guess. In point of fact, the 32acp was merely a modernized version of the 32S&W Long, designed to be used in a small, modern (at the time) semi-auto pistol. It offers no ballistic advantage over the .32 S&W L, and merely operates in a different platform. Actually, I have both, and prefer the .32 long. I can load it faster, with heavier boolits, in a more accurate platform.

[quasi]

Ranch Dog sold a 6 cavity made to his spec's by Lee. I have one but have not used it.

[Outpost75]

Yeah, but nothing recent, I would guess. In point of fact, the 32acp was merely a modernized version of the 32S&W Long, designed to be used in a small, modern (at the time) semi-auto pistol. It offers no ballistic advantage over the .32 S&W L, and merely operates in a different platform. Actually, I have both, and prefer the .32 long. I can load it faster, with heavier boolits, in a more accurate platform.

Absolutely in a sturdy revolver the. 32 S&W Long is the best balanced small game carteidge going.

I se no advantage to a .32 ACP revolver except to exploit a ready supply of ammo. I have seen some conversion cylinders for the USSR 7.62 Nagant gas seal revolvers, but have no idea how well they work. The 7.62 Nagant isn't exactly my cup of tea, but if that were the only gun I had, having a .32 ACP cylinder for it might make sense.

I'd much rather have my S&W 1903 Hand Ejector in.32 S&W Long.

[Rangefinder]

I did about the exact same thing as Zardoz a few years ago using the Lee 93gr. mold and love the way the little bugger shoots. One variation I did was after using Red Dot for a while I tried 2gr. Longshot and had success. It's a tad snappier but I have never chron'd it.

[mikeym1a]

I did about the exact same thing as Zardoz a few years ago using the Lee 93gr. mold and love the way the little bugger shoots. One variation I did was after using Red Dot for a while I tried 2gr. Longshot and had success. It's a tad snappier but I have never chron'd it.

I'd have to get out my book and check and see what I used. Seems it was 2.2grs of Red Dot, but I can't be sure without checking. Never chronographed the load, but, the factory load goes 'Pop', or 'Pow', while my handload goes 'CRACK'. No signs of overpressure; normal primer, no cratering, absolutely no case sticking. I've got a 1st model hand ejector, and it is a really nice little gun. I'm at least it's 3rd owner. Got it from a former trucker who got it for his wife for when he was on the road. Lots of blue wear, but, nice and tight. And like most smith's, I can pull the D/A trigger up to just the breaking point, and hold it there. So nice and smooth. It's a pleasure to shoot.:D

[NoZombies]

I'd have to get out my book and check and see what I used. Seems it was 2.2grs of Red Dot, but I can't be sure without checking. Never chronographed the load, but, the factory load goes 'Pop', or 'Pow', while my handload goes 'CRACK'. No signs of overpressure; normal primer, no cratering, absolutely no case sticking. I've got a 1st model hand ejector, and it is a really nice little gun. I'm at least it's 3rd owner. Got it from a former trucker who got it for his wife for when he was on the road. Lots of blue wear, but, nice and tight. And like most smith's, I can pull the D/A trigger up to just the breaking point, and hold it there. So nice and smooth. It's a pleasure to shoot.:D

Please clarify this info if you could.

A first model hand ejector isn't a .32 ACP, and while the .32 ACP cartridge will chamber, and probably fire, it's not the best idea.

I assume you mean that load in a .32 long case?

[mikeym1a]

Please clarify this info if you could.

A first model hand ejector isn't a .32 ACP, and while the .32 ACP cartridge will chamber, and probably fire, it's not the best idea.

I assume you mean that load in a .32 long case?

Yes, I guess we got off topic a little. And yes, we were talking of the .32 S&W long cartridge. The original topic was the .32ACP. Sorry if we caused any confusion.:D

[NoZombies]

Yes, I guess we got off topic a little. And yes, we were talking of the .32 S&W long cartridge. The original topic was the .32ACP. Sorry if we caused any confusion.:D

No problem at all! Thanks for sharing, just wanted to reduce confusion if someone else saw the load. :)