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Bent Ramrod
05-28-2006, 06:48 PM
I've always been enamored of that flintlock pistol Long John Silver gave Jim Hawkins in Disney's Treasure Island. Little ones like that are all originals and too expensive, but after some searching I found a normal sized modern replication at a gun show that fit my criteria, viz: it had to have a rifled bore and it had to look "neat." In other words, not the plain, unadorned look of the normal "kit" gun or its factory equivalent. This one has some reasonable carving around the ramrod, some brass furniture and a brass endcap. No fancy buttcap, but you can't have everything.

Having finally secured a specimen, I've been unaccountably reluctant to try it out for almost a year. All of my black powder experience has been with percussion systems, and this thing, on careful examination, looked plenty primitive. Except for the lock plate removal, it also looked extremely hard to take apart for cleaning, being pinned together with tiny brads or wires. But this, probably the last nice weekend before the desert heat really comes on, was the last chance to try it in comfort till fall, so off I went to the range with a few spare flints, a flask of Goex 3F, some .433" balls and ticking patches, a bottle of Ballistol/water mix and lots of rags.

I used the same charge (28 gr, thrown) as I use for my BP revolvers, and a little fine-ground powder in the priming pan. The patched ball went down the bore very easily, so I was less worried about how I'd pull it out when the gun refused to fire, which I fully expected. I lined up the sights on my bottom target, gritted my teeth and pulled the trigger. "Clack--Sssoooshh--BOOOMM!!"

As they used to say in North Beach in the '50's, "Man, I was sent!" Giggling insanely, I loaded it up again. And again. Never did get to the load development I was going to do with my .270.

I got 34 shots and three misfires before I ran out of powder. One misfire was probably caused by a gunked up touch-hole, the next one was the flint getting pretty ratty after 25 shots or so. I turned it upside down and got a half-dozen more shots with no trouble, but it was beginng to miss again near the end. Altogether, the reliability factor was, I thought, amazingly high.

There is a 300-to-500 millisecond hang-fire between hammer fall and the bullet launch, which teaches one the value of follow-through with a vengeance. By dint of ferocious concentration on sights and follow-through, and ignoring the distracting fireworks display just at the right-hand edge of my vision, I was able to get a 2-3/4" five shot group at 15 yards with a 2-hand hold, and to mostly hit the SASS silhouette target at 25 yards.

One-handed at 50 yards, I couldn't hit the silhouette at all in the 5 shots I tried. Those guys who fought duels with these things, firing one-handed on a count of three, were much, much better shots than the bare words imply. The odd way the pistol holds, the time to firing and the noise the gun makes while it is getting ready to go off make it difficult to stay focused and aimed. I guess practice will improve my technique.

Cleanup was surprisingly easy, at least so far. (I usually hold off judging the cleanup until a trouble-free week has passed.) I took off the lock, swabbed everything visible with damp patches, Ballistol/water and Ballistol, and put the lock back on. I didn't take the lock apart or remove the barrel. The gun wasn't nearly as dirty as a cap-and-ball revolver after a similar number of shots. If you've ever had a casual hankering for the flintlock experience, I would recommend getting one of these pistols. They're easy to manage and the flash and smoke are at arm's length, as opposed to the rifle experience where it's right next to you. As soon as I can find that instruction on flint-knapping I downloaded and put in one of my paper piles, the pistol and I will be off to the Spanish Main again.

floodgate
05-28-2006, 11:44 PM
Dave:

Those rascals are addictive, aren't they? Reminds me of an event back in the '50's, when a friend who had gotten a nice little French "Gendarme" pistol - sounds about like yours - and I went out the the Lyman Blue Trail range, me with an "India Pattern" Brown Bess and he with his 1863 Springfield rifle-musket. I was busy with the Bess and he'd been setting up the .58. I had my back turned and when he asked "How much powder should I use?" I said, "Try 60 grains or so". There was a gosh-awful BANG! and I turned around to see him with the pistol pointing straight up, a huge pall of blue smoke, and a funny look on his face. Did no permanent harm, to him or the little pistol, but he flinched a bit for the next few 20-grain shots.

floodgate

waksupi
05-29-2006, 12:10 AM
Flint pistols are fun. I put one together a year or so ago, with a .32 cal. barrel, that KCSO sent me. I set it up with a small Siler lock, and a single set trigger. With 25 grains 3f, it is a real shooter, and with a rest, will keep them in about 1.5" at 25 yards. Suspect my eyesight for that limitation.
At our spring ML shoot, while scoring rifle groups through the course, I shot the pistol for fun. Beat out some of the rifle shooters. A goodly percentage, in fact.

:Fire: [smilie=w:

Bent Ramrod
05-29-2006, 12:10 PM
Floodgate, Waksupi,

They certainly are addictive. I figured one box of Hornady balls would be all the shots I'd ever use and more, but 1/3 of them are gone already, and I'm looking through the Track of the Wolf catalog and daydreaming.

60 grains in a pistol this size would get anyone's attention all right! I used about a flask's worth of that charge in my Colt Walker replica. The gun was heavy enough so it was manageable, but the base pin loosened in the back of the frame and the front sight disappeared to parts unknown. I made a bushing with enlarged thread on the base pin and screwed it in tight, but a few more shots and it was loose again. Just not enough meat in the rear of the frame to hold the strain, I guess.

Your success with a .32 pistol (and flintlock no less) fills me with envy. I have a Pedersoli percussion .32 rifle that will barely group on a tea saucer at 50 yards. I've tried all ball sizes from .310" to .319", all powder charges from 25 to 40 grains, Goex, Elephant, Swiss and Triple Seven powders, Wonder Wads, Ox-Yoke patches and homemade linen patches (thick and thin) with everything from spit to Bore Butter.

I've gotten exactly two 1" groups using Swiss powder (out of a couple dozen). When I took the barrel out of the stock for cleaning one time, it seemed the wood was cut away too much under the tang, allowing a stress or bend if the tang screw was tightened too much. I cut a couple pieces of rubber and screwed the tang down against them. With this setup, I was able to get a few 1" groups with Goex and many more with 4 of 5 in 1" at 50 yards. However, when I took the gun apart for cleaning and put it together the same way, it was again hopeless for accuracy the next time I took it out. Do these rifles ever need glass bedding? Any ideas of what is wrong? Everybody else seems to do well with these rifles except for my shooting buddy and me, who both have these Pedersoli .32's, and have come to regard them as the bete noirs of our collections.

Dale53
05-29-2006, 06:40 PM
I have one of the Pedersoli .32's and it works fine and shoots VERY well. It sounds like yours has bedding problems. Yes, and yours is not the only one. Use plenty of release agent, of course, and bed that tang properly. Since you have already had decent accuracy, you KNOW that the barrel is ok.

My son was home on leave through the Christmas/New Years Holiday season some years ago. I took him to the muzzle loading match at my home gun club. We shoot year round with the muzzleloaders. Some REALLY good shooters here (we're only an hour away from Friendship, IN, home of the NMLRA). We had nearly fifty shooters. I did well, but my son ended up second overall in the aggregate with the Pedersoli (his first target, the small bull at fifty yards was "clean").

The funny part about all of this was he had never shot a muzzle loader until the Friday before the Sunday match. I took him out to the range, showed him how to load the rifle (of course, I had all of my loading data from previous experimenting), and he shot it well. I use 25.0 grs of Goex 3F with a Hornady ball of the appropriate size (don't have my notes here). He sure impressed the locals:mrgreen: (his ol' man was a pretty proud fellow, there, also[smilie=1: ).

At any rate, the Pedersolis will shoot and shoot well. They are not the only muzzleloaders that can benefit from proper bedding.

Dale53

Old Ironsights
05-29-2006, 09:20 PM
Heh heh heh. Next weekend I'm going to be pushing 50-60gr under a 1oz .690 ball from my Howda pistol.

Boom.

Bent Ramrod
05-31-2006, 10:41 PM
Dale53,

Thanks for the advice and encouragement. I'll out with the old inletting black and make sure the barrel is fully down in its bed and then see about the spaces under the tang.

Dave

KCSO
06-01-2006, 11:20 AM
Bent

You need to tune that lock and probably re position the flash hole as a good flinter will fire as fast as a percussion gun. No shoosh boom just boom. My egg locked flint pistol will fire upside down and I can grease the edges and dip it in a bucket, bring it out and fire it. My best score with a flinter was an 88 at 25 yards on the NMLRA slow fire bull and with a percussion I have gone as high as 92 offhand so a good flinter will do the job.

Bent Ramrod
06-02-2006, 11:23 AM
KCSO,

I've heard about tuning flintlocks. Mine has been used some, it is obvious. The cock rocks just a trifle on the square pin and, unless the flint is very long and/or upside down, the engagement on the frizzen is somewhat less than the 2/3rds up I read about. The touch hole is brass, with a screw slot across the middle; it's about in the center of the flash pan. Haven't gauged the diameter of the hole, but I would guess maybe 1/16" or less.

The guy at the gun show said it was a "---- ----" Lock, but of course, my fabulous memory for names ensured it was evaporated out of my mind by the time I'd moved on to the next table. It didn't seem to be a name that I find in catalogs, like L&R or Siler; something like "Steve Adams" or some such sounds closer. It wasn't "John" anybody, unless my memory is even worse than I thought. No name on the inside. Anyway, it seems OK for a regular lock; no waterproof flash pan or roller on the frizzen spring but everything closes tight and it has a trigger adjustment screw on the bridle.

Maybe as a first approximation I could unscrew the touchhole and make a smaller one with a dome out of a percussion nipple? Somebody recommended that.