Oily Rag Fires

[Char-Gar]

I learned something tonight, I want to pass on in case I am not the only one who was ignorant on this issue. My Step-son who is a Fire Marshal was in my shop and told me he investigated several fire each year caused by spontaneous combustion of folded or wadded oily rags.

Natural plant oils such as linseed, cottonseed and tung oil produce heat as they oxidize. If rags containing them are folded or wadded, the heat cannot escape and can reach a point that the rag or paper will catch one fire.

Petro oils won't do this.

Paper or cloth rags that contain such oils should be;

1. Spread out until they are dry, or
2. Placed in water, or
3. Placed in a sealed container that won't allow air to enter.

Not only gunstock finishes, but some paints and stains contain these oils. Those of us who finish gunstocks and use rags or towels for clean up should be aware of this.

Anyway... I pass this on in case I am not the only doo-doo that didn't know this.

[rwt101]

I even take my patches that I use for cleaning outside when I am finished with them. Anything with any solvent or that type of cleaner I am very careful with.
Some good advice.
Bob T

[Wayne Smith]

I grew up on a farm - my Dad trained me will in these safety issues. I've done woodwork for years, just did some this past week. Got some tung oil laden rags drying out in the garage now. Once they are stiff they go in the trash - and I don't mean frozen, either!

[3006guns]

You know what amazes me? I learned about "spontaneous combustion" in the fourth grade..........in 1958! Our fire department made a point of teaching kids about fire safety and yet for some reason I'm seeing a rash of these fires lately. I guess such basics aren't as attractive as a computer............:veryconfu

Edit: By the way, that was not a dig at you Charger. You are to be commended for making this info available.

[RayinNH]

I had heard that but never saw it happen until about 20-25 years ago. My father was refinishing a piece of furniture under a shade tree on a summer morning, and when he was finished he set his rag down on a rock and walked away for some reason or another. Later on in the day as the sun was overhead, I happened to walk by the rag and it just started burning. Ever since then I never throw oily or solvent filled rags in the trash barrel. I usually burn them in my forge, it helps to get the draft going in a cold chimney. Gun cleaning patches I store in a jar with lid until dump day...Ray

[Jim]

EXCELLENT advice! I went through petro-chemical firefighting training when I worked for Amoco Chemicals back in the 70s and have been involved in a coupla blazes, one of them I was caught in. I'm not AFRAID of fire, but I have a deep respect for it's abilities, both pro and con. Spontaneous combustion is a serious matter and can occur at the most unexpected moment. What's that old addage about an ounce of prevention?

[Shiloh]

Heard about the dangers of oily rags from dad and grand dad. Grand-dad had a painting and interior decorating business in Washington D.C. from the 1920's into the 1950's
Buying bulk linseed oil and white lead powder for making paint. Try buying that today


As stated. the history of this type of spontaneous combustion started with natural oils.
Throw in spirits of turpentine, commonly used as a cleaning solvent and you have a recipe for a conflagration. Turpentine is a lot more flammable than mineral spirits.

I was particularly careful when finishing a Krag stock with organic boiled linseed oil.

I did a brief search on this subject but didn't find what I was looking for. One of these gun-boards had a fellow who took rags with linseed oil and turpentine, balled them up tightly and put them in his charcoal grill. He checked later on and sure enough they were smoldering.

Shiloh

[BBA]

Come springtime and warmer weather, people start treating their decks. Rags and brushes get thrown in the trash. The trash bags and garbage cans left out in the sun can make for some pretty good fires especially when there stored next to the house or garage.

[HeavyMetal]

My experience with this type of combustion was when I was a kid in N. Calif. and the guy next door had bought a bunch of freshly bailed hay.

A day later I helped them un bail and spread the hay all over the yard, and any place else we could put it, to cool of and dry out!

Seems the guy who mowed and bailed it wasn't smart enough to let it dry before bailing!

Another couple hours and it would have gone up in flames!

So besides the plant oils you gotta be careful with mulch piles as well.

[docone31]

The oil reaction is called exothermic.
I have had that happen on a small scale.
I was putting linseed oil on my wood, and the two rags I used, I put in my plastic garbage can.
Well, the can was in flames, even in the downpour that had started.
It doesn't take much.

[Bert2368]

Water based house paint and synthetic varnishes have kept a lot of younger people from learning about this. We were taught in grade school (1960's) about this, and again in high school wood shop.

Modern oil finishes have various chemical "driers" added that speed up the chemical reaction and make them MORE likely to build up enough heat to go up.

Another thing to be aware of is big piles of sawdust. They'll build up enough heat from oxidizing to be dangerous too.

[Westwindmike]

What about CLP on rags? Thats all I have in my garage. Any danger there?

[MT Gianni]

What about CLP on rags? Thats all I have in my garage. Any danger there?

If you check the manufactures web sight you should be able to get an MSDS [Material Data Safety Sheet] which will let you know the properties of any compound that you store.

[Char-Gar]

I am old enough to have learned about this subject, and I probably did know it at one time. However, somewhere along the way the "delete" button was struck.

I keep my shop oil, solvent and chemical free with all bench surfaces, machine tools and floors being cleaned because my cats hang out there with me. I don't want them walking through some nasty stuff and getting sick by licking it off their paws. I almost killed "Beemer" my black cat with some break cleaner residue left on a bench top. He will also grab a dirty gun cleaning patch with solvent on it, if I let it hit the floor. Never again!

So even though I was ignorant of this issue, I keep a clean shop for other reasons. I got lucky in my ignorance.

[Hardcast416taylor]

I`ve seen and been involved with hay fires as Heavymetal said. Back then all the farmers would turn out at a fire to help. Their wives would get on the party lines and start calling everybody for help. It`s scary to feel how warmish - hot a bale of hay can get.Robert

[Russel Nash]

Chargar titled his thread like this:


Oily Rag Fires

Nancy Pelosi caught on fire! No way!

:mrgreen:

[StarMetal]

Chargar titled his thread like this:



Nancy Pelosi caught on fire! No way!

:mrgreen:

Wasn't there something on one of those weird TV shows about the human body bursting into flames?

Joe

[docone31]

They were called BlipVerts.
Spontaneous Human Combustion.

[Russel Nash]

Would it be really obvious if I stood outside the capitol building with a big, HUGE! magnifying glass in my hands?

(come on! come on! combust!)

:bigsmyl2:

[HORNET]

Wouldn't she first have to be proven to be human?

[MtGun44]

I think CLP is a petroleum base, not linseed oil.

I have used linseed oil and do worry about the rags.

Bill

[PatMarlin]

A lady built a sizable log cabin home all by herself, and completely burned it to the ground when complete as she left rags onsite from applying wood presevative.

She shook it off and built the whole thing again from scratch. It's in featured articles in Backwoods magazine. That's one tough woman. I think I would have to cry for at least a year first ...:mrgreen:

I keep oily rags in one of those round red safety rag cans from Harbor Freight. Then I park that in a safe location, but it's all petrolum. What about mineral based parafin oils like Ballistol? I've got to check the safety data sheet,.

[pmeisel]

Have experienced exothermic reactions with metal-cutting fluids, filter paper, and metal chips. Fortunately got the whole gondola outside before it got out of hand.

[lurch]

Would it be really obvious if I stood outside the capitol building with a big, HUGE! magnifying glass in my hands?

(come on! come on! combust!)

:bigsmyl2:

Nah...just get a bucket of water. Worked for Dorothy...

[Uncle R.]

In a shop that I worked in years ago they used paint spray booths with mesh filters to trap the paint and keep it out of the vent stack. I know that when they changed filters, and threw the old used filters into a pile in the scrap lugger they'd sometimes get hot enough to burst into flame. It didn't take long either - I have a clear memory of that forklift driver racing for the outside doors hauling a steel lugger full of used paint filters with smoke pouring out. Within minutes they'd be burning fiercely out in the open yard. The air pollution laws must have been more lax in those days. Of course if they just left the filters mounted in the booth frames until the paint was dry there was much less danger.

[The Double D]

Unsolved History program on the Chicago fire is on the Military channel right now. They are trying see if they can determine what really caused the fire.

They filled a bucket with cotton rags and then poured boiled linseed oil over the rags. They had fire in a little over 5 hours.

[Down South]

Nah...just get a bucket of water. Worked for Dorothy...

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/picture.php?albumid=6&pictureid=1768

[Tom308]

I can remember that type of combustion in hay barns when damp bales were stacked with the rest. Also happened with loose stacked hay. These things aren't taught in public schools these days. That safety information was taught in schools a LONG time ago. Caution first at all times.
Tom

[Shiloh]

I think CLP is a petroleum base, not linseed oil.

I have used linseed oil and do worry about the rags.

Bill

That is correct.

Common sense though. I wet down rags and let them dry. Simple procedure, sleep well at night.

Shiloh