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AZPaul
01-02-2010, 04:51 PM
I have access to solder bars 63/37 which is the lead/ tin ratio. Are they good for molding bullets?
I would appreciate your expert opinion.

deltaenterprizes
01-02-2010, 04:59 PM
It is the tin/lead ratio. No good for bullets send me all you have, I will even pay postage!LOL!
Excellent source of tin(63%)! Mixed in WW to achieve a 2-3% mix it will cast pretty bullets.

MtGun44
01-02-2010, 05:05 PM
While this alloy will cast a beautiful boolit, it is a bit like casting of 50-50 gold-silver
alloy. Would work, but really expensive.

Your alloy is 37% tin, and tin is far more expensive than lead, plus you only
need about 2% (or even a bit less in some cases) of tin to get good mold fill out.

So - depending on the price per pound, you should buy up a bunch of this (as a
matter of fact, I'll buy some from you if you are selling at a reasonable price) to use
as an addition to wheel weight alloy, or pure lead to make it cast better.

Tin doesn't harden the alloy very much, so you need a whole lot of it to get a
harder alloy, and even then there is a limit to how hard you get.

An alloy that is considered "ideal" is around 2% tin with about 4-6% antimony,
a touch of arsenic (maybe 1/2 to 2%) and the rest lead. This gives reasonable
hardness (in the higher ends of antimony and arsenic, maybe too hard for some
uses), good castability and reasonable cost. Straight 63/37 mixed with about
5 parts of pure lead will give you Elmer Keith's favorite alloy for the .44 mag. This
is still considered wasteful of tin nowdays, but is apparently a wonderful alloy to
cast and shoot. I've never used it, too tin-rich for me to afford.

I use wheel wts with about 1" of 50-50 bar solder added per pot for my normal
casting, and 50-50 Linotype-lead for some other applications.

Hope this helps.

I'll buy all you got for $2 per pound. :-)

Bill

AZPaul
01-02-2010, 05:11 PM
While this alloy will cast a beautiful boolit, it is a bit like casting of 50-50 gold-silver
alloy. Would work, but really expensive.

Your alloy is 37% tin, and tin is far more expensive than lead, plus you only
need about 2% (or even a bit less in some cases) of tin to get good mold fill out.

So - depending on the price per pound, you should buy up a bunch of this (as a
matter of fact, I'll buy some from you if you are selling at a reasonable price) to use
as an addition to wheel weight alloy, or pure lead to make it cast better.

Tin doesn't harden the alloy very much, so you need a whole lot of it to get a
harder alloy, and even then there is a limit to how hard you get.

An alloy that is considered "ideal" is around 2% tin with about 4-6% antimony,
a touch of arsenic (maybe 1/2 to 2%) and the rest lead. This gives reasonable
hardness (in the higher ends of antimony and arsenic, maybe too hard for some
uses), good castability and reasonable cost. Straight 63/37 mixed with about
5 parts of pure lead will give you Elmer Keith's favorite alloy for the .44 mag. This
is still considered wasteful of tin nowdays, but is apparently a wonderful alloy to
cast and shoot. I've never used it, too tin-rich for me to afford.

I use wheel wts with about 1" of 50-50 bar solder added per pot for my normal
casting, and 50-50 Linotype-lead for some other applications.

Hope this helps.

I'll buy all you got for $1 per pound. :-)

Bill
It does thanks.

It may mix them with wheel weights to "thin" them down. What ratio would be best do you think?
They may not cost me much at all so cost is not a factor.

243winxb
01-02-2010, 05:14 PM
A more normal alloy would be 2 % tin, 6% antimony, 92% pure lead. Or a BHN of 15. Lead & tin can also be used 10 to 1 Click photo for larger view. http://i338.photobucket.com/albums/n420/joe1944usa/th_Alloy_20090610_1.jpg (http://i338.photobucket.com/albums/n420/joe1944usa/Alloy_20090610_1.jpg)

AZPaul
01-02-2010, 05:26 PM
A more normal alloy would be 2 % tin, 6% antimony, 92% pure lead. Or a BHN of 15. Lead & tin can also be used 10 to 1 Click photo for larger view. http://i338.photobucket.com/albums/n420/joe1944usa/th_Alloy_20090610_1.jpg (http://i338.photobucket.com/albums/n420/joe1944usa/Alloy_20090610_1.jpg)

Wow wheel weights are way down there, I thought they would be better.

rob45
01-02-2010, 07:48 PM
I have access to solder bars 63/37 which is the lead/ tin ratio.

Hello, if your solder says 63/37, then that is the tin/lead ratio, not the other way around (lead/tin). So your solder should be 63% tin and 37% lead if it is labeled 63/37. As far as solder goes, in anything I have ever come across, the tin percentage is the first number.

For example,
40/60 is 40% tin
60/40 is 60% tin
63/37 is 63% tin
5/95 is 5% tin
95/5 is 95% tin

Hope this helps, and of course, I could be wrong, too.[smilie=l:

AZPaul
01-02-2010, 08:13 PM
Hello, if your solder says 63/37, then that is the tin/lead ratio, not the other way around (lead/tin). So your solder should be 63% tin and 37% lead if it is labeled 63/37. As far as solder goes, in anything I have ever come across, the tin percentage is the first number.

For example,
40/60 is 40% tin
60/40 is 60% tin
63/37 is 63% tin
5/95 is 5% tin
95/5 is 95% tin

Hope this helps, and of course, I could be wrong, too.[smilie=l:

I think your right. I'll have to use them accordingly.

DGV
01-03-2010, 01:27 AM
Lead comes first in the Lead/Tin Ratio 60/40 is a 60% lead 40% tin mix.

runfiverun
01-03-2010, 01:33 AM
one of those 63/37 bars is how much i add to 100 lbs of ww's i mark it in thirds and set out 32 lbs of ww ingots i know the math comes out a bit off but none of my molds or guns cares.
and the ratio is always the same.
if you have a 20 lb pot you might wanna mark it in 6ths. and 16 lbs.

Echo
01-03-2010, 03:03 AM
Lead comes first in the Lead/Tin Ratio 60/40 is a 60% lead 40% tin mix.

Well, maybe that is the way it is NOW, but historically 60/40 solder was 60% tin, 40% lead.

(I believe that is still true...)

I have some 63/37 solder in ingots and use them to sweeten the pot when it wants to sulk. I grab one with channel-locks and dip it into the pot until about 1/2 inch has melted into the pot.

deltaenterprizes
01-03-2010, 04:10 AM
Lead comes first in the Lead/Tin Ratio 60/40 is a 60% lead 40% tin mix.

So I guess 95/5 has 5% tin?

winelover
01-03-2010, 08:57 AM
So I guess 95/5 has 5% tin?

Why not do a simple test? Try bending it! The greater the percentage of lead, the easier it will bend. The 95/5 would be brittle and probably snap.

Winelover:coffee:

Urny
01-03-2010, 09:47 AM
Look at rotometals.com. Their alloys are tin/lead, not the other way around.

cajun shooter
01-03-2010, 10:07 AM
It is now always has been that the tin is listed first. The 63/37 is a good solder bar to have for bullet casting.Later David

AZPaul
01-03-2010, 09:26 PM
Why not do a simple test? Try bending it! The greater the percentage of lead, the easier it will bend. The 95/5 would be brittle and probably snap.

Winelover:coffee:

These things are rock hard.

AZPaul
01-03-2010, 09:27 PM
Would more tin mean less leading?

alamogunr
01-03-2010, 11:10 PM
Lead comes first in the Lead/Tin Ratio 60/40 is a 60% lead 40% tin mix.

Everything I have ever seen indicates that industry standard is to show the ratio of Tin to Lead. Therefore if the identification on the solder bars in the OP is 63/37, then the tin content is 63%. That particular ratio is a eutectic alloy and was common in the electronic industry.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solder

John
W.TN

Amazing how many posts can show up if you leave the computer for awhile.

Muskrat Mike
01-03-2010, 11:22 PM
Everything I have ever seen indicates that industry standard is to show the ratio of Tin to Lead. Therefore if the identification on the solder bars in the OP is 63/37, then the tin content is 63%. That particular ratio is a eutectic alloy and was common in the electronic industry.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solder

John
W.TN

Amazing how many posts can show up if you leave the computer for awhile.

That's why it nicer to have 50/50 bars!:veryconfu

HammerMTB
01-04-2010, 12:38 AM
That's why it nicer to have 50/50 bars!:veryconfu

But then comes the confusion-
which 50 is lead and which is tin? :bigsmyl2:

runfiverun
01-04-2010, 01:43 AM
thats why you melt in only half what you want then turn the bar over to make sure.
and the tin content always comes first.
the kester bars will leave no doubt they are stamped whats what and their catalogue and webite will flat tell you also.
the bars are wiping solder.

220swiftfn
01-04-2010, 02:58 AM
hmmm.... the ones I deal with have the lead first 80/20 is 80% lead. But YMMV, I think the *easiest* way to tell is to ask what the price is! If they tell you that 80/20 is $2 and 60/40 is $6, then they're putting the lead first (tin being pricy and all.... :)

Dan

lylejb
01-04-2010, 03:12 AM
The 95/5 would be brittle and probably snap

Nope.

I'm using some 95/5 lead free solder, It's 95% tin, 5% antimony and does not snap. It is more stiff than lead solder, but I still have to cut it.

alamogunr
01-04-2010, 10:16 AM
I don't have a problem with identification. A few years ago I saved my former employer a lot of money by hauling off about 800 # of a mix of 40/60 and 50/50 wire solder. They were going to pay a hazardous waste outfit to dispose of it. I graciously offered to take it off their hands. About 200 lbs is ingots that were removed from a large solder pot. It was originally 50/50 but since I don't know how long it had been in the pot, I just consider it 40/60. Most of this will be passed to my sons someday. If I had paid $10-15 per pound for it, I would be a lot more careful of tin content.
John
W.TN

Ozark Shiner
01-04-2010, 12:23 PM
Me personally, I'd just read the bars. Gotta' be a stamping on them somewhere. Something like 63Sn37Pb.... "Least that's what mine say.

I reccon they put them on there for a reason. Sure is hard to just look at a bar of solder and tell what it is if it ain't marked.

Seems like a lot of fussin' about nothing. Man asked if they would make good bullets. Short answer - throw some in with some wheel weights and you got Lyman #2.

Ozark Shiner.

bgokk
01-04-2010, 01:40 PM
Mine has the tin content stammped at both ends.

243winxb
01-04-2010, 02:29 PM
Would more tin mean less leading? Tin up to 5% would be ok as in the Lyman #2 alloy. 10 parts lead to 1 part Tin is whats posted. Tin will harden the alloy some, but nothing like antimony. Mix your bars with WW. From Lyman >
While antimony is used to harden the bullet, the mixture of tin is critical, for while antimony mixes with lead in its molten state, it will not remain mixed when it solidifies. If tin were not added, we would have pure antimony crystals surrounded by pure lead. A bullet of this type , while it feels hard , would certainly lead the bore and eliminate all potential for accuracy.. In a lead-tin-antimony mixture, the antimony crystals will be present just the same, but they will be imbedded in a lead-tin mixutre. As the bullet cools the tin will form around the antimony-lead keeping your bullets from leading the bore.

fourdollarbill
01-04-2010, 04:08 PM
Also figure out what bullet your making and how your going to use it. It would be a shame to waste that 63/37 if a certain BHN was not needed.

trk
01-04-2010, 07:59 PM
FWIW
When I cast my scrap 96.5% tin, 3% silver and 0.5% copper (electronic solder scrap) it MEASURES the same hardness as copper jacketed bullets - 42-43 on Rockwell B scale.

AZPaul
01-04-2010, 09:17 PM
[QUOTE=trk;767678]FWIW
When I cast my scrap 96.5% tin, 3% silver and 0.5% copper (electronic solder scrap) it MEASURES the same hardness as copper jacketed bullets - 42-43 on Rockwell B scale.[/QUOI]

I can get all the electronic scrap I need, including gold pins.

docone31
01-04-2010, 09:20 PM
You can seperate the gold from the pins with HCL and chlorox bleach.
One cup of bleach to one gallon of Muriatic acid. Let sit for a couple of days.
The gold seperates from the pin.
It is still in the karat it was, but it is by itself.
From there, it can be melted down in a crucible.

AZPaul
01-04-2010, 09:26 PM
You can seperate the gold from the pins with HCL and chlorox bleach.
One cup of bleach to one gallon of Muriatic acid. Let sit for a couple of days.
The gold seperates from the pin.
It is still in the karat it was, but it is by itself.
From there, it can be melted down in a crucible.

To bad I've trashed millions of them.

MtGun44
01-04-2010, 10:36 PM
You want to sell some of that "costs me almost nothing" solder bars?

With wheel wts you need about 2% or 3% max tin. So if you take 10 lbs of
wheel wts you need to add about 3.5 ounces of tin. Since you solder is 63% tin,
you will need to use 5 ounces of your solder to get that much tin. Of course you
also added bit of extra lead, but it is no big deal.

So for every 10 lbs of wwts, add 5 ounces of 63 Sn/37 Pb solder to get about
2% + tin content (ignoring the small existing tin content of the wwt alloy). This tin
is to help the alloy fill out the mold well, not to stop leading. Leading is usually
a boolit fit issue, or design issue or lubricant issue much more than hardness
or alloy issue (within reasonable bounds, of course). Using more than 2-3%
tin does not help reduce leading just due to the difference in the alloy.

It will cast beautifully. I am serious about purchasing some of this if you have
"lots of it'.

Bill

Eutectic
01-04-2010, 10:53 PM
That particular ratio is a eutectic alloy


Yep.... sure is!

Eutectic

AZPaul
01-06-2010, 04:23 PM
But then comes the confusion-
which 50 is lead and which is tin? :bigsmyl2:

:groner: [smilie=l: