Sizing presses

[Captain*Kirk]

Asuume that I know nothing about sizing/lube presses. Because what I've learned over the last couple days has me more confused than ever!
This much I know; presses are manufactured by Star, Saeco, RCBS and Lyman. I'm told Lee Precision once made ne, but it's not listed on their website...only punches.
I've heard good and bad about all of the above, from "can't live without it" to "I wouldn't take it if it was free" about ALL of them. For a newbie, looking to get into this side of casting from black powder, my main objective would be utility versus cost. I don't intend on casting thousands of bullets; perhaps a couple hundred at a time. Some people recommend heated sizers; some don't. Lee fans swear by LLA and NO sizing, others say it's hogwash. I'm more confused then when I started!
Sure, I could spend six months paging through every post here, trying to glean the information from what's been posted. But, I'm hoping you guys can save me some time by answering the following questions for me;
1) For a casual, beginner caster, what is the best buy on a sizer?
2) Heated or not? Why?
3) Does casting make sense for someone who shoots under 100 rounds a year at present?
4) Are any of the "starter kits" on the market (MidwayUSA, etc) worth the investment, or am I better off piecing it together with higher quality components?
Thanks in advance!

[HeavyMetal]

First it looks like your only going to do a hundred or so cast boolits a year, therefore big production units like the Star, are not needed.

Second the whole Lee LLA thing does work great "if" the boolit comes out of the mold the right size, "if" they make the tumble lube design in your Caliber "If" you don't exceed the velocity limits of the LLA coating you put on "if" you want to put up with the mess.....

Using LLA means a whole lot of things need to go right for you.

Heated lube sizers, the only reason you need to add a heater to a sizer is if you using a very hard lube or are in a very cold climate. Be aware that a budget heater can be made from an old, or cheap, iron, a small plate of aluminum and a dimmer switch.

When I got into casting I found an old Lyman 45 lube sizer at a gun show for $20.00 it served me well for a lot of years until I needed the production of a Star.

What I would do if I was in your shoes: Place an add in the want to buy section of this site, Haunt the e bay site and hope to get lucky, and check out both gun shows and gun shops in the area for a deal on a used lube sizer.

Things to keep in mind: RCBS and Lyman use the same sizer dies, so don't think you need to pass on one or the other because of the name.

These are pretty genaric suggestions, what are you planning to cast for? This will help in making further suggestions as to lube, hard or not, alloy soft or not, and a casting pot, ladle or bottom pour.

[Captain*Kirk]

First it looks like your only going to do a hundred or so cast boolits a year, therefore big production units like the Star, are not needed.

Second the whole Lee LLA thing does work great "if" the boolit comes out of the mold the right size, "if" they make the tumble lube design in your Caliber "If" you don't exceed the velocity limits of the LLA coating you put on "if" you want to put up with the mess.....

Using LLA means a whole lot of things need to go right for you.

Heated lube sizers, the only reason you need to add a heater to a sizer is if you using a very hard lube or are in a very cold climate. Be aware that a budget heater can be made from an old, or cheap, iron, a small plate of aluminum and a dimmer switch.

When I got into casting I found an old Lyman 45 lube sizer at a gun show for $20.00 it served me well for a lot of years until I needed the production of a Star.

What I would do if I was in your shoes: Place an add in the want to buy section of this site, Haunt the e bay site and hope to get lucky, and check out both gun shows and gun shops in the area for a deal on a used lube sizer.

Things to keep in mind: RCBS and Lyman use the same sizer dies, so don't think you need to pass on one or the other because of the name.

These are pretty genaric suggestions, what are you planning to cast for? This will help in making further suggestions as to lube, hard or not, alloy soft or not, and a casting pot, ladle or bottom pour.

Thanx for the quick response!
I load for 7mmRM (probably would not be casting much in that cal due to the velocities and useage; i.e, hunting deer-sized and larger game) .380 ACP; .44RM; .35 Rem; .45-70 Gov't (Browning High Wall). Hope this helps!

[HeavyMetal]

I agree you won't be casting much for that 7mm!

The other rounds are very do-able in a cast lead kinda world. I'd consider getting a lead pot, cast Iron, and set it on the kitchen stove and ladle cast out of it.

Depending on weight Lee has several good single cavity designs for the 45-70, again haunt e bay for a Lyman 429421 single cavity mold. Can't make a suggestion on the 35 remington, never owned one, but I think I'd want to know if it's in a rifle or contender format before I suggested a mold for it.

380 ACP Lee's got a nice little RN Boolit out for that, 356-102-1R, and it only comes as a DC mold

Find a Good used Lube sizer and your off and running!

[chuckbuster]

HM
In my experience Rifle/Contender is non-issue with .35 Rem. I get virtually same velocity (within 50FPS or so) in either. Only issue may be shape of nose for feeding from a magazine.

[blikseme300]

Captain Kirk,

Considering the small volume of boolits per year you mentioned, then pan lubing and using a Lee push-through sizer is the way I would go. Yes, Lee does not have a dedicated sizer. Their sizer sets screw onto your regular press. See here for another way:

http://leeprecision.com/cgi/catalog/browse.cgi?1262444240.2305=/html/catalog/rlpress1.html

Look at the Lee Reloader Press. At one time they offered their reloading manual and this press for very little money.

Bliksem

http://bliksemseplek.com/boolits.html

[mooman76]

Lee still offers the deal for the cheap press and manual. If you do deside to get into casting, I'd start with pistol. It's more forgiving so if makes a good place to start. The 7mm is certainly doable but it will be more difficult like you thought. I' wait til you got some casting/shooting time before attempting it that way you have a better understanding of what it takes. I agree with blikseme300. With the vilume of bullets you are planning on doing, at least at this time, I'd go with pan lubing or the tumble lube for now.

[Captain*Kirk]

I agree you won't be casting much for that 7mm!

The other rounds are very do-able in a cast lead kinda world. I'd consider getting a lead pot, cast Iron, and set it on the kitchen stove and ladle cast out of it.

Depending on weight Lee has several good single cavity designs for the 45-70, again haunt e bay for a Lyman 429421 single cavity mold. Can't make a suggestion on the 35 remington, never owned one, but I think I'd want to know if it's in a rifle or contender format before I suggested a mold for it.

380 ACP Lee's got a nice little RN Boolit out for that, 356-102-1R, and it only comes as a DC mold

Find a Good used Lube sizer and your off and running!


I've already got a small Lee electric melting pot (toploader; no pour spout) and ladle for my BP moulds, so I'm good there to start. Can always move up to a production-type pot down the road.
If I can use the Lee dies in my Rock Chucker, it sounds like a place to start, and yes, the .380 sounds like a good place to begin, as I probably shoot more of that than any other round on a yearly basis.
.35 Remington; sorry-should have specified. Both, actually; Contender with 14" bbl. and Marlin 336 levergun.
Sounds like I have a starting place now, and once I get my feet wet, can decide if and when to nove up to better equipment. Thanks!

[TAWILDCATT]

all dies are made to same thread size.7/8-14.get the Lee sizers they give you a bottle of tumble lube.and the little lee press I use that. I have most all the big presses.

LEE makes most molds as double cavity now.all the 45s are except the hollow base.
I would get a lee catalog,even if just to read.:coffeecom

[budman46]

captain*kirk
two years ago i tried liquid alox and lee's push-thru sizers...then i gave away a lyman 450, lots of stick lube and retired an rcbs lubrisizer. my milsurp rifle loads are 1800-1900 fps; accuracy is good; no leading.

tumble lube bullets designs are lubed and shot as-is; my standard bullet designs are lubed, sized and relubed. i think the system is cleaner, lee's dies are cheaper and they run faster.
budman

[Captain*Kirk]

captain*kirk
two years ago i tried liquid alox and lee's push-thru sizers...then i gave away a lyman 450, lots of stick lube and retired an rcbs lubrisizer. my milsurp rifle loads are 1800-1900 fps; accuracy is good; no leading.

tumble lube bullets designs are lubed and shot as-is; my standard bullet designs are lubed, sized and relubed. i think the system is cleaner, lee's dies are cheaper and they run faster.
budman

I think, due to the huge gap in cost, the Lee system is the way to get started. I can always upgrade later, right?

[MtGun44]

I don't think it would be economic, even with the cheapest and simplest equipment
to do 100 rds per year.

Now if you just want the fun of it, no problem. But you can get 100 rounds of cast
boolits to your specs from Mt Baldy for a pretty reasonable price.

If you really want to get into it, cheapest way is a Lee mold, shoot unsized, pan lube
and cut from the lube with a cut off cartridge case. I started this way as a poor college
student, many moons ago. One mold, Coleman stove, tiny Lee pot and ladle. CHEAP and
made workable boolits for my 9mm.

Bill

[Bret4207]

The Lee sizing system will work with ANY style boolt, not just tumble lube designs. I would recommend starting with the Lee push through after determining what size die I needed. The dies are pretty easy to open up a bit if you need one a bit bigger than listed. You can use Lees Liquid Alox (Mule Snot), Johnsons Paste wax, homemade lubes, commercial lubes, what ever as long as you can get it on the boolit.

[DLCTEX]

Bret beat me to it, tumble lubing works well with all boolits. I use a mix of LLA and JPW, thinned a little. You just want a thin coat. Heavy coats will just gum up bullet seaters and be messy. I predict that if you get into casting you will be shooting much more, it's fun!

[dragonrider]

#1, Lee sizing dies, made to be used in a single station press. Used with Lee Alox for lube. Least expensive way to get started in sizing
#2, Only if using a Lubrisizer like Lyman, RCBS, Saeco, or Star, and depends on lube being used. Hard lube generaly need heat, soft lubes do not.
#3, No,
#4, Have no answer for that one, I don't remember any kits being available when I started reloading and casting.

[RKJ]

Captain*Kirk, Forgive me for piggybacking onto your thread but I'm in the same place as you and I was reading this (and other posts) and I have the same questions. I found on Midway's site a Lyman kit (you might be interested in it also) http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=573247 and figure that is the way I'd like to go. I also figure LEE moulds (at least to get started) but after that I'm at a loss. My question is is this a good starting point and what else do I need? I wont hijack your thread any further and again I apologize for doing so. I'll try to just sit back and learn. Good Luck.

[HangFireW8]

As a long-time reloader and recent cast beginner, I'll give you my take on your questions.



1) For a casual, beginner caster, what is the best buy on a sizer?

For the one or two caliber shooter, Lee's push-thru sizers, that mount on conventional reloading presses, are the cheapest. They don't HAVE to be used with Lee Liquid Alox
or equivalent tumble lube, you could use them in conjunction with a pan lube, say.

That's the best buy, but a bit messier then a nice lube and sizer setup. Done in large batches, pan lubing can meet or beat press lubing for production time, but you can't beat a lubrisizer for the versatility of just doing a few at a time, and then changing your mind and doing a lot.



2) Heated or not? Why?'

You only need a heater if you are using a hard lube, which is usually used for Rifle or fast Magnum Handgun bullets, especially if you are reloading in a cold place (garage in Winter for example). Even then, a simple reading lamp will do the same job of warming the lubrisizer, and take about the same amount of time.

I've gotten my worst leading with hard lubes, and am not pushing max velocities (for lead), so I haven't needed a heater.


3) Does casting make sense for someone who shoots under 100 rounds a year at present?

The key words I see here are "at present". How much would you shoot if a.) your barrel didn't quickly heat up to sizzling, b.) your ammo was plentiful and cheap? One hundred shots per year is a lot with a rifle like 7mmRemMag and magnum loads of jacketed bullets. Its just getting warmed up once you are casting.


4) Are any of the "starter kits" on the market (MidwayUSA, etc) worth the investment, or am I better off piecing it together with higher quality components?

You can get the Lyman kit from Midsouth and discard the little melter for less than the price of the 4500, ingot mold and ladle separately. I consider this a pretty good deal. A Star, though very nice, would be overkill for your needs. I have the RCBS Lube-A-Matic II but I'm thinking of adding a 45, 450 or 4500 when I get the chance. That would allow me to keep two different lubes set up at all times.

Hope that helps.
-HF

[Bret4207]

Captain*Kirk, Forgive me for piggybacking onto your thread but I'm in the same place as you and I was reading this (and other posts) and I have the same questions. I found on Midway's site a Lyman kit (you might be interested in it also) http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=573247 and figure that is the way I'd like to go. I also figure LEE moulds (at least to get started) but after that I'm at a loss. My question is is this a good starting point and what else do I need? I wont hijack your thread any further and again I apologize for doing so. I'll try to just sit back and learn. Good Luck.

Lets put it this way- I've been casting for 30+ years and use both the traditional RCBS/Lyman sizers and the Lee system. Both have their place. Both work fine, both can drive you nuts. I HATE sizing. I DESPISE applying GC's. But if I've got to do it, I want it as efficient as possible.

Start with the Lee and go from there. That particular kit isn't a bad price but you can cast with a Lee sizer, hot plate and stainless pan and dipper with a Lee mould for under $50.00 all bought new. Your choice. Most of my casting is done with a large stainless maesuring cup I found that holds about 35-40 lbs lead alloy full up, a Walmart $8.00 1100 open coil hot plate and a ladle.

[Wayne Smith]

First of all, Lee liquid frog snot DOES NOT WORK WITH ALL LOADS! Keep it well away from your BP loads.

Second, because of the above, you will be working with two lubes at any time. I also started this because of BPCR shooting and quickly shifted to other loads. I picked up a Lyman sizer off eBay and about a month later picked up an RCBS the same way. The Lyman is loaded with my BP lube, a modified Emmerts, that I use with almost all pistol/revolver loads as well. The RCBS is loaded with Speed Green for my smokeless rifle loads and pistol loads over about 1200fps.

Actually, I started pan lubing and bought the sizers 'cause I quickly got sick of that.

The Lee system is good for sizing but has no lube component. You will need to find some other way to lube your boolits. If I was only sizing I'd be using the Lee system today. Since I'm shooting BP cartridge and smokeless, I'm more interested in lubeing all those boolits.

[TAWILDCATT]

in yard sale get electric fryer.I got mine for $5.dip base in melted lube and set on alum foil. when hard,size in lee die.:coffee: