Sheet lead- Is it pure lead ?

[cigg52]

Just starting to gather up everything to start casting. I picked up 400 lbs. of 4x2 sheets of lead. It look like it was pulled off drywall (it has some what looks like drywall paper on one side). This lead seems very soft. you can put your fingernail in it easily. Do you think this is pure lead, I am going to use it for BP bullets.
Thanks cigg52

[beagle]

That stuff should be pretty close to pure lead. May have come off the walls of an X-ray room that was being redone.

I had one batch of cable sheathing that was in about 4" diameter tubes that was tin rich.

You can never tell until you melt it. Normally, if it's close to pure, you'll get the rainbow colors depending on what trace elements are in it.

I cut wheel weights with my pure stuff as I like pistol bullets pretty soft as I use a lot of hollow point stuff.

Consider it as close to pure as you can get until you determine differently./beagle

[HTRN]

Be careful! Sheet lead comes in a coupla different chemistry's, and only one of which is close to pure lead.


HTRN

[cigg52]

HTRN If these sheets are the ones that aren't pure lead do you suppose I can still cast this for black powder bullets.? I am not set up to melt or cast yet, I just happened to come across these sheet so I bought them, .20 cents a lb.

[Bucks Owin]

Just starting to gather up everything to start casting. I picked up 400 lbs. of 4x2 sheets of lead. It look like it was pulled off drywall (it has some what looks like drywall paper on one side). This lead seems very soft. you can put your fingernail in it easily. Do you think this is pure lead, I am going to use it for BP bullets.
Thanks cigg52

If you send me 100 lbs I'll be happy to run some tests for you! (I'm running low on lead...:-D )

Welcome to the party!

Dennis

[ANeat]

You can never tell until you melt it. Normally, if it's close to pure, you'll get the rainbow colors depending on what trace elements are in it.




I agree, I got a hold of a lot of lead flashing. It checked way soft with a Lee hardness tester, Like 3.7 bhn. After melting some down into ingots it checked right at 5 bhn, pure lead.

Ive read that some of the sheet lead has other stuff in it to make it stronger as it gets quite a bit softer as it is rolled out. Lead gets softer as you work it.

Where are you located Cigg52?? While Bucks offer is very generous:roll: If you want to send me a couple pounds Ill melt it down and check the hardness for you.

Adam

[HTRN]

HTRN If these sheets are the ones that aren't pure lead do you suppose I can still cast this for black powder bullets.? I am not set up to melt or cast yet, I just happened to come across these sheet so I bought them, .20 cents a lb.

Here's the problem - lead sheet is rolled, and since lead work softens, if it heavily alloyed, it will get much, MUCH harder -

One of my data books lists 4 different chemistries for sheet lead:
"Chemical" which is all but pure lead(.05% Cu)
"4%" which is 4% Sb, .05% As, and .04% Cu
"6%" which is 6.25% Sb, .1% As and .04% Cu

Then there's "Strontium" lead sheet. Avoid it like the plague - it contains aluminum and will contaminate your whole batch.

Unless you know that it's all the same, I would suggest melting down a small piece of each sheet, and casting a boolit - you'll be able to tell how hard it is, and how well it casts.

If you're casting minie's, and it isn't dead soft, go out to you're local plumbing supply store and buy some "plumbers" lead - it's almost pure. Another (expensive) option is to order an ingot of pure lead from McMaster Carr, but that will run you some serious money - over a buck a pound.


HTRN

[cigg52]

Thanks for all the replys, and the offers to test the BHN hardness of this lead. I think I am going to get a hardness tester real soon.

Yesterday I went back to the same scrapyard and they gave me one bar of tin, well he thinks it is pure tin but does not know for sure. The bar is hex in shape and about 12" long. He told me to check it out if it is pure tin and let him know how much I wanted. How can I go about finding out if it is pure tin ?

Adam, I live in Utica Mi, about 25 miles north of Detroit.

If this lead turns out to be good for loading the scrapyard said he just got 1500lbs more of the same stuff.

[Goatlips]

cigg52,

Would you mind telling me where that scrapyard is? Utica is pretty close to me and I shoot out that way at DSC. That sheet lead sounds REAL interesting!

Goatlips

[454PB]

Short of a metal analysis, I don't know of a certain test for tin. Years ago I bought some at a gun show, and had heard that tin made a special ringing sound when tapped or dropped. The stuff I bought did that, it rang like a bell when tapped. I melted the 5 pound ingot down into 1/2 pound ingots and alloyed it with some wheelweights. It was pretty obvious from the resulting boolits that it improved casting. I still don't know for sure if it is pure tin.

[garandsrus]

cigg52 -

What is he charging for the sheet lead and tin?

The scrap yard I go to which is in SE Michigan has a tester that can tell you what the alloy is. I'll tell you where my scrap yard is if you tell me where yours is... [smilie=1:

Where do you shoot?

John

[cigg52]

garandsus-

The scard yard is on the east side of mound south of 18 mile. I bought 400 lbs. for $100.00

[garandsrus]

cigg52,

That is the scrap yard I go to also, Admiralty Metals. You did better than me price wise! I bought 200 lbs of the rolled stuff today for $60. I asked the owner (dark hair, glasses, moustache) to analyze it with his "gun", which he did. It is 94% Lead and 6% Bismuth. He said that he just got about 3000 lbs of it!

I didn't ask about the tin since I didn't know it was the same place when I went. What did he charge for that?

I was surprised at the amount of Bismuth since it's a much more expensive metal than lead at over $8 per lb. I have also seen it in most other samples of lead that I have had analysed. Bismuth is next to lead on the periodic table, and is actually heavier.

Here's an interesting tidbit I found on an eBay ad: Bismuth expands 3.32% on solidification. This property makes bismuth alloys particularly suited to the making of sharp castings of objects subject to damage by high temperatures.

Sounds like boolits to me!

Does anybody have experience with Bismuth? Unless someone suggests differently, I am going to treat the lead I bought as 100% lead.

John

[cigg52]

garanadsrus-


The guy with the dark hair and glasses I don't think he is the owner, when I aksed if he would take $100 for 400 lbs. we went up front to ask the guy in the office wearing clean blue work outfit.

The tin is up front by the office a they gave me (no charge) one bar to test, but I have no idea how to test it. So I don't know if they have the equipment to test it or not. As far as a price for the tin he said he would check in to it.

These sheets of lead were in the shed next to the main building,is this the lead with the Bismuth in it and could I cast BP bullets with thes sheets ?

[garandsrus]

Cigg52,

I am sure of my description of the owner. I have talked to him several times. He is the only one with a key to the "magic gun". He is also the person the other guys talk to about price, as you mentioned. He does have a dark full moustache, which wasn't in your description. I am sure there could be another person with dark hair and glasses....

Were the sheets you got rolled up nicely with a partial brown paper backing? Your initial posting said that you got sheets. I didn't unroll mine, so I may have gotten sheets also, just rolled up.

He got about 3000 pounds of the lead so he probably has it scattered around. Mine were on a pallet outside near the front door. I got two rolls that were about 100 lbs each. They are very soft and the lead bends very easily.

Short of going back and asking him to analyze the suspected tin, your best bet is probably to check the specific gravity of Tin. This will only determine whether or not you probably have pure tin. If you don't have pure tin, it will not tell you what you have. Send me a PM with your email address and I will send you an article I found about measuring the specific gravity.

In summary: You accurately weigh a small sample (somewhere around 100-200 grains?) of the metal and then suspend the same sample in water using a very light thread/fishing line. Don't let anything touch the container with water in it. Re-weigh the suspended sample while it is suspended. It will weigh less than it did outside of the water. Then, determine the weight difference.

To calculate the specific gravity, divide the weight of sample in air by the weight of the water displaced by the sample (sample wt in air - sample wt in water = weight of water displaced)

The specific gravity for pure tin is between 7.2 and 7.5.

For example:
Weight in air - 200 gr
Weight in water - 190 gr
Difference 10 gr
Specific gravity = 200/10 = 20

You could also melt the metal by itself and determine the melting point. I don't know what temp tin melts at, but it would be easy to find. I would think the specific gravity would be more accurate since I don't think the thermometers we use are "precise" instruments.

John