Pistol For Dog Training

[alamogunr]

I have a friend that trains dogs. He is in need of a pistol to use in the process. I know nothing about training dogs but apparently they need to be acclimated to loud noise(read gunfire). The specialized pistol he found for this purpose was over $200. I suggested that he try a regular centerfire pistol w/ primer only. He has handguns that could be used. Another possibility was cornmeal over a very small charge of fast powder. This is not preferred since a projectile(the cornmeal) is ejected from the barrel. This individual is very familiar with firearms but the potential is there for someone unfamiliar to possibly discharge the handgun so loaded. Anyone have any suggestions?

John
W.TN

[45 2.1]

The fast draw competitors use a novel idea. Most of the single actions set up for fast draw i've tried are 45 Colt. They simply use an empty unprimed case and place a small pistol primer in the primer pocket. It lights off every time and makes noise, plus it has enough gas pressure to break ballons in front of the muzzle a few feet. Very easy to replace the primer also.

[Dale53]

Not to be argumentative, but .45 Colt cases use LARGE pistol primers.

It is common when using primers only to have them back out upon firing and tie up the gun. The solution for this is to drill out the flash hole in the case to a larger size. This DOES make the case unfit for regular loads (raises pressures, etc) and cases would need to be marked so they could not be mixed up with regular cases...

It might be a good idea to do a "show and tell" with a dog trainer familiar with the effect to determine if the "primer only" load is loud enough for dog training.

FWIW
Dale53

[45 2.1]

Not to be argumentative, but .45 Colt cases use LARGE pistol primers. I know that Dale.......... and I shot quite a few of the mans Small pistol primers (loose and flopping around) in the large primer pockets in his guns (No boolits either). It worked fine, try it yourself...................

[Mk42gunner]

What about a starter pistol? The ones I am thinking of look like a potmetal/zinc H&R with a solid barrel. IIRC they were available for .22 or .32 blanks.

Robert

[alamogunr]

Not to be argumentative, but .45 Colt cases use LARGE pistol primers. I know that Dale.......... and I shot quite a few of the mans Small pistol primers (loose and flopping around) in the large primer pockets in his guns (No boolits either). It worked fine, try it yourself...................

Are you saying that a large primer makes more noise than a small primer? Does a rifle primer of like size make more noise than a pistol primer? How about magnum primers? You brought up all kinds of questions I had never thought of before. Thanks.

John
W.TN

[garandsrus]

I think that 45 2.1's point is that the small primer is very easy to load and replace in the large primer pocket, yet still works fine for it's intended purpose...

I don't think that a rifle or pistol primer would be loud enough for dog training. I have seen revolvers that were modified to hold a shotgun primer using a brass insert without a cartridge case. This would be considerably louder.

John

[Echo]

George Nonte advocated black powder blanks. I don't remember what he used for wadding...

[Bert2368]

In my business I do SFX work, gun wrangling and provide prop weapons for video and stage productions. We use 8mm and 9mm blank firing only prop guns. They are fairly cheap, and ammo is available in several noise levels. They have solid barrels, no danger of shooting someone with a wad. Many of them cost less than you mentioned-

http://www.blank-guns-depot.com/blank-firing-guns-store/catalog/1873-Peacemaker-9-MM-Blank-Gun-Black-Wood-p-1549.html

http://www.blank-guns-depot.com/blank-firing-guns-store/catalog/Sig-Sauer-P229-9-MMPA-Blank-firing-gun-Black-p-1642.html

[45 2.1]

Are you saying that a large primer makes more noise than a small primer? Does a rifle primer of like size make more noise than a pistol primer? How about magnum primers? You brought up all kinds of questions I had never thought of before. Thanks.

John
W.TN

I've never did anything with this other than have a very entertaining two hours playing with a fast draw shooters guns and setup. If you ever get the chance, try it. Lots of fun. Whether a large versus small pistol primer makes more noise, I don't know. I do know a few dog trainers that use starter pistols. They make about the same noise as primers to me (different ranges and inside versus outside). The easy replacement of the primer made the exercise easy. Trying different primers this way could be fun also. Primers or blanks are hazardous in front of the muzzle at short range, so take care.

[montana_charlie]

The specialized pistol he found for this purpose was over $200.
Well, heck! If it's specialized, it's probably exactly what he needs. If he makes money training dogs, he can write off the cost as a business expense.

Probably a lot better than my idea...a tape recording of a gunshot.

CM

[wilddog45]

I start out gun training dogs (coonhounds)when they are puppies.Every morning when I go out to feed them I shoot a 22 rifle while they are eating and after a while they associate gunfire with food. After they are trained ,they associate gunfire with game and I have even called them back in to the truck with a few shots when nothing is going on.

[wistlepig1]

On puppies, I feed them and use a spoon/pot to make noise. After about a week them I go to 22 cal. starter pistol. Worked well and no gun shy dogs. FYI Martin

[oksmle]

I have a couple of "break open" revolvers that have been relegated to wax loads with small pistol primers. The primer holes in the cases have been drilled out with a 1/8" bit & don't back out upon firing. One is a .32 S&W & the other is a .38 S&W. Both have been used over beagles & bird dogs while feeding & in the field. Works great with primers only, or if you want it a bit louder plug the case with a wax/lube wad about 1/4' thick.