homemade lubrisizer

[squid1230]

Any one attempt to make a homemade lubrisizer? Or perhaps simply a a lubercator ( minus the sizing)?

[Russel Nash]

there is a guy on this forum with the screenname of "jmorris".

Let me do a quick search of his posts and I will be back in a minute.

[Russel Nash]

just in general, jmorris would be kind of handy guy to have around.

;-)

Here is the link I was referring to:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=64586

jmorris has also built an automated casting machine and automated bottlenecked rifle case mouth/neck annealer.

Also, IIRC, he might have automated a Dillon 650 or 1050.

[Shiloh]

There was also a guy who repaired an out of alignment lubrisizer by boring it out and re- bushing it. Extensive photo's. There are a talented an capable bunch of folks here at the forum that are gifted with talent and machine tools.

Shiloh

[squid1230]

just in general, jmorris would be kind of handy guy to have around.

;-)

Here is the link I was referring to:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=64586

jmorris has also built an automated casting machine and automated bottlenecked rifle case mouth/neck annealer.

Also, IIRC, he might have automated a Dillon 650 or 1050.

I saw his casting machine over on the highroad forum. The man is a genius.

[357maximum]

BABore built a large saeco style lubricator from the ground up. I have actually handled it from the beginnig to the finished product.............some very talented machinist/welder/engineer folks reside here. He figured with his weldments/machining and finishing he could build me one just like it for about 1k...I decided I did not need one at that point. I always owe him enough for his gorgeous boolit mold creations as it is.

There is a pic on here somewhere of his lubesizer.


357Maximum<------------not one of them talented steel fabbers btw.

[MT Gianni]

Any one attempt to make a homemade lubrisizer? Or perhaps simply a a lubercator ( minus the sizing)?

TC had a maxi-ball lubricator that screwed on their borebutter tube. You pushed a boolit in, lined up the groove with the tube and squeezed til it filled. I imagine a similar set up could be made with a pressurized hard lube and air but IMO the dies would be expensive. You could drill out holes for the most common sizes and heat a lube to fill from 2 sides but I think a lubesizer is pretty inexpensive when you set up for multiple calibers. By the time you set up a piston to push the lube and a bleed valve to back pressure off you are in pretty deep $'s. Lee push through and liquid earwax don't fit all the shooting needs but they fit most.

[StarMetal]

BABore built a large saeco style lubricator from the ground up. I have actually handled it from the beginnig to the finished product.............some very talented machinist/welder/engineer folks reside here. He figured with his weldments/machining and finishing he could build me one just like it for about 1k...I decided I did not need one at that point. I always owe him enough for his gorgeous boolit mold creations as it is.

There is a pic on here somewhere of his lubesizer.


357Maximum<------------not one of them talented steel fabbers btw.

That's strange Mike, Bruce said he's make me one for $75. [smilie=s:

Joe

[357maximum]

That's strange Mike, Bruce said he's make me one for $75. [smilie=s:

Joe

Well than buy two of em and send me one...I will pay you $25 extra for your effort. :groner:

I wish everyone could have sen it go from a box of milled parts into the final creation....I had no idea what it takes to built certain things we all take for granted, especially when improvements are involved.

I hope the membership realizes how lucky we all are to have the talented custom mould makers we have available here and never take that service for granted. We are truly blessed to have these Vendor Sponsors here...I thank them all, as it was not that long ago the closest thing we had to getting a good fitting custom boolit involved a company that should own a casino instead of a mould factory. Personally I enjoy the fact we no longer has to roll the dice and takes our chances.

[BABore]

Hah! You mean this cheepo one I scratched together?

[SwedeNelson]

How about a sizer that uses standard neck size bushings?

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i80/swedenelson/Picture070-1.jpg

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i80/swedenelson/Picture068-1.jpg

Works great and no more bent bullets.
We hope to be offering this and a GC seating die for sale soon.

Swede Nelson

[357maximum]

Hah! You mean this cheepo one I scratched together?

Yeah..thats the one. You better get busy, sounds like you have 2 of them to build for Joe.[smilie=l:

[Beekeeper]

babore,
How much you figure you are going to charge for them?


Jim

[BABore]

babore,
How much you figure you are going to charge for them?


Jim

I won't be making any for sale. They're just too costly to make without a nice casting to work with. Something I just wanted to see if I could do. Getting the die spring pressured lube system to function well was the hardest part. I would guestimate that there was $100 in material and $2,400 in labor at our normal shop rate. Probably had another $2,000 in my design time that would be spread over "X" number of units. Even if done with CNC, they would likely cost in excess of $600. Of course I did design this to be much beefier than the normal Saeco and hold twice the lube.

[StarMetal]

I won't be making any for sale. They're just too costly to make without a nice casting to work with. Something I just wanted to see if I could do. Getting the die spring pressured lube system to function well was the hardest part. I would guestimate that there was $100 in material and $2,400 in labor at our normal shop rate. Probably had another $2,000 in my design time that would be spread over "X" number of units. Even if done with CNC, they would likely cost in excess of $600. Of course I did design this to be much beefier than the normal Saeco and hold twice the lube.

Bruce,

How about if you have them made in China? What would the cost be then? :coffee:

Joe

[BABore]

Better ask Junior about that one. This guy don't go there.

[fourarmed]

Swede, that is a neat setup. Where did you find the grease cup? Are those still available new?

[BABore]

Not Swede, but McMaster-Carr carries them.

[StarMetal]

Swede, that is a neat setup. Where did you find the grease cup? Are those still available new?

http://www.mcmaster.com/#grease-cups/=49b2yz

Joe

[lathesmith]

Not trying to be a smart a$$ here guys, but check out this pic from the "for sale" section on the hollowpointmold.com website. Interesting resemblance, don't you think?
lathesmith

[BABore]

Not trying to be a smart a$$ here guys, but check out this pic from the "for sale" section on the hollowpointmold.com website. Interesting resemblance, don't you think?
lathesmith

To what? It's an older model Saeco or it's previous name. I got another one at home just like it.

[lathesmith]

It just kinda struck me as one of those "wow, that's interesting" moments, when I saw the two presses used a nearly identical paint scheme. I had forgotten, those older Saeco's used that fairly common black crinkle paint scheme as well. On close inspection, it's obvious that BABore's is a beefier press, and is also a near-clone of the Saeco. That's pretty impressive, doing that without the benefit of a casting.

My guess is, you had one of those "I could make one of those if I wanted to" moments, and just did it, if for no other reason than to prove to yourself that you could. I've done this on occasion myself, though not to this degree. Nice work!
lathesmith

[BABore]

Not to mention that I'm cheap too. I got spoiled when I bought my first Saeco off of Flea-Bay for $50 with a die and punch. When we're slow, I gotta keep a couple machinists busy with something. I do have a design done for even a larger press so you can lube-size up to almost 12 gauge. No real need myself though.

[BCall]

How about a sizer that uses standard neck size bushings?

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i80/swedenelson/Picture070-1.jpg

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i80/swedenelson/Picture068-1.jpg

Works great and no more bent bullets.
We hope to be offering this and a GC seating die for sale soon.

Swede Nelson

What's the grease cup for exactly? Keep boolits from sticking?

Thanks, Billy

[JIMinPHX]

Building my own lube/sizer is something that's been on my to-do list for about 6 months now. I'm not going to be able to get around to actually doing anything about it until at least some time in early 2010. It's going to fit in a standard single stage press. It's going to look a lot like a Lee sizer with a small piston pump sticking out the side. One boolit is going to get pressed into the lube zone & then sit there until the next boolit pushes it out of the way. It's going to take the boolits heal first so that gas checks will seat better & more reliably. I've had problems with that on .22's occasionally. I may design it so that it will take standard Lyman type dies. I haven't decided yet.

[Bent Ramrod]

I made this one in a machine shop class a few years back. It doesn't size, just lubricates. Set up for .45 caliber boolits right now; I need to make a die and plunger for a .32 one of these days.

[MaxJon]

I have sourced some lyman parts namely the pressure screw and lube piston. I intend to make one using these parts, and to use conventional lube sticks and sizing dies of RCBS and Lyman. Sourced some hydraulic tube the can be bored out and milled to make the lube resivoir and ram guide etc.... I have an exploded view of the Lyman 4500 and have been looking at the star also to work out lube timing because i intend to make a nose first deal. Wish me luck :???::???::???::???:
BB03

[BCall]

I'm still waiting to see if Al's design will become a reality. Or if JiminPhx gets one going.

Personally I wish I could get one like Bent Ramrod has that is fitted for a Lyman 311403. That would make loading at the bench easier.

[MaxJon]

Anyone interested in posting some pics of their sizers, RCBS LAM2 or Lyman 4500?
Might get me keen to start machining!

[LatheRunner]

I have an old lyman 45 I got off of flee-bay. Works good but leaks around the tube. I realy dont like having to crank the lube ratchet for every boolet. So I decided I would build one.

[scrapcan]

KTN made one also. his is press mounted and has the double acting lube valve feature. I am not sure if his pictures are still up or not, but i would be he will share them again.

Meecham made a die similar to the one that Swede put up. Also one can look up pope bullet sizer. I think there is an old post from moons ago that several of us were part of on this topic.

[KTN]

This was one of my first projects I started when I got my lathe.

This is what it looks like now.

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o277/kainiin/IMG_3322.jpg

If anyone is interested, I can post better pictures on how it works.


Kaj

[scrapcan]

Kaj,

I would like to see the pic again. This time I will save the info!

[MaxJon]

This was one of my first projects I started when I got my lathe.

This is what it looks like now.

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o277/kainiin/IMG_3322.jpg

If anyone is interested, I can post better pictures on how it works.


Kaj

More pics please!

[LatheRunner]

KTN,Yes please post more picks. Also explain how it works. Does it fit in a reloading press. Mine works like a star except it lubes on the up stroke. LatheRunner

[MaxJon]

Dont think i can be bothered, gunna save some bikkies for an RCBS lam 2!
:groner::groner::groner:

[KTN]

Yes, this fits on reloading press with 1 1/4"-12 thread.
Here are parts to show how it works.
From left, sizer body without lube reservoir. Lubehole on back and groove around inside of die. Sizer die with lubeholes and groove on top. Base punch and sample boolits.

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o277/kainiin/IMG_3327.jpg

On this picture parts are lined up like they would be inside sizer, before lube fills groove. Next boolit pushes previous boolit out of die and correct lenght basepunch lines boolits lube groove with die lubeholes. Spring on top keeps sizerdie on place.

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o277/kainiin/IMG_3328.jpg

And here sizerdie is on top and lubeholes on both dies are lined up for lube to fill groove. When press handle is returned, spring on top will push sizerdie back down and close lube flow.

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o277/kainiin/IMG_3330.jpg

This system has it's limitations. Spring must be quite stiff and boolits can't be sized down much. But if boolit drops close to correct diameter from mold and alloy is not too hard, it works fine. [smilie=w:


Kaj

[MaxJon]

Yes, this fits on reloading press with 1 1/4"-12 thread.
Here are parts to show how it works.
From left, sizer body without lube reservoir. Lubehole on back and groove around inside of die. Sizer die with lubeholes and groove on top. Base punch and sample boolits.

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o277/kainiin/IMG_3327.jpg

On this picture parts are lined up like they would be inside sizer, before lube fills groove. Next boolit pushes previous boolit out of die and correct lenght basepunch lines boolits lube groove with die lubeholes. Spring on top keeps sizerdie on place.

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o277/kainiin/IMG_3328.jpg

And here sizerdie is on top and lubeholes on both dies are lined up for lube to fill groove. When press handle is returned, spring on top will push sizerdie back down and close lube flow.

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o277/kainiin/IMG_3330.jpg

This system has it's limitations. Spring must be quite stiff and boolits can't be sized down much. But if boolit drops close to correct diameter from mold and alloy is not too hard, it works fine. [smilie=w:


Kaj

Nice work! thanks for the photos!!
BB03

[LatheRunner]

KTN, Nice job. I like the way it fits in a reloading press.

[garandsrus]

KTN,

Do you have a picture with the lube reservoir in place and the die mounted in a press? It looks like a great design as you have elegantly solved the problem of starting/stopping the lube flow while keeping pressure on the lube.

John

[geargnasher]

KTN,

Do you have a picture with the lube reservoir in place and the die mounted in a press? It looks like a great design as you have elegantly solved the problem of starting/stopping the lube flow while keeping pressure on the lube.

John

+1, thanks for sharing that, your lube flow control method is a stroke of genius! If there are some slight issues with hardness and size, that seems like a small matter of changing spring rates or making some part of the system adjustable for a better balance. The fact that it will work in just about any press having the larger thread size is a big plus and would save costs.

Frankly, I've been wondering for years why Lee Precision hasn't come up with something similar using standard dies just like their push-through sizer system, but with a lube reservoir and valve system of some sort for lubing with stick lubes.

Watch out, you might need and international patent soon!

Gear

[KTN]

Frankly, I've been wondering for years why Lee Precision hasn't come up with something similar using standard dies just like their push-through sizer system, but with a lube reservoir and valve system of some sort for lubing with stick lubes.

Watch out, you might need and international patent soon!

Gear

So have I.
It could be made even simpler than this, I have been thinking about it for some time. Maybe someday I build it. One thing I like in this design is easy sizerdie change. Just pull out old die and push in new.

Here is old picture of sizer on press.

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o277/kainiin/IMG_0933-1.jpg

And this is what it looks like from side.

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o277/kainiin/IMG_3346.jpg


Kaj

[MtGun44]

Nice workmanship and innovative designs, guys.

In any new manufacturing enterprise you sit down and decide "Make or Buy?" for each
part. The idea is can you make it cheaper or better than somebody who is already
in the business.

For me - a used Lyman or RCBS wins over the "make" choice, and I have two lathes and
mills, just not the time to take to make a project of a lubrisizer. For those really skilled
guys that are challenged by this - I am impressed as heck. Just not gonna do it
myself! ;-)

Bill

[MaxJon]

Nice workmanship and innovative designs, guys.

In any new manufacturing enterprise you sit down and decide "Make or Buy?" for each
part. The idea is can you make it cheaper or better than somebody who is already
in the business.

For me - a used Lyman or RCBS wins over the "make" choice, and I have two lathes and
mills, just not the time to take to make a project of a lubrisizer. For those really skilled
guys that are challenged by this - I am impressed as heck. Just not gonna do it
myself! ;-)

Bill

Me too gun44, I have machines and work CNC machines everyday for a living. Coming home to machining is hard to do sometimes! I gunna buy a new RCBS lam2. I have made simpler things like dipper pot, ladle and spoon. But the more complex things take time!

[Three-Fifty-Seven]

[smilie=s:

[MaxJon]

Here's mine, don't mind the mess . . .
http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s220/ShawnTVT/Guns/LAMII1.jpg

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s220/ShawnTVT/Guns/LAMII2.jpg


[smilie=s:

Thanks 123 Benz

[Papa Jack]

I have seen pictures in my older loading and casting books of guys adapting old Grease Guns to bullet lubing...Back then it was common to use Lithium or Soap base grease for bullet lube. Cheap, readily available and it seemed to work fine.
A simple "stop" fitted to the gun handle worked to adjust the flow..... "PJ"

[tommygirlMT]

Thank you very much KTN --- your method just helped me crack one of my design problems --- An exact copy of your method wont work for what Im tryin to do but a modification of it will

I've been working for a while on a way to build a press mounted lube sizer that go-z in 1-1/4 thread most big iron presses have that uses big one inch diameter by two inch long die as its "native" die size --- but also has die bodies that are made to fit all of the other three major die types --- namely --- Star Dies --- Lyman/RCBS Dies --- and Saco Dies and could be put together for a raw cost figure in parts and labor if produced in a quantity of scale to match the potential demand market for such a tool in a "Vender Sponser" sales situation on this forum with a sale price including the threeadapter dies capable of it competing with the commercial Lyman RCBS Saco Star sizers --- Basically a press mounted sizer that would take any of the major die sets you already have plus its own BIG dies could handle anything up to 80 caliber and/or capable of putting lube in all the grooves of boolits with lube groove spans of up to an 1.5 inch length those bigger dies that fit in instead of the adapters being just basically a bigger diaemter longer version of a Star type die only without the flange and a snapring instead like lathesmith does his

[deltaenterprizes]

Tommy, would it be push through like a Star?

[tommygirlMT]

Yes --- push through like Star --- only press mounted like Lee

I have been thinking all along that the reservor flange goes under the press head and screws in from underneath with reservor off to side to clear head rather then mount on top and screw down into head --- loose some ram stroke length but very few boolits long enough for that to matter the slightest

As far as lube control --- and "the key" KTN just gave me --- think three position toggle switch instead of two position toggle switch --- his is like two position toggle switch --- full down = off / full up = on --- I am thinking like on/off/on tottle switch only an inverse off/on/off --- Or in other words --- full down = off / full up = off / everything inbetween = on --- and just use a very light spring that is basically just a gravity assist just strong enough to make sure it bottoms out between strokes.

So set up it should work so that:

With most boolits that need to be sized down when the boolit to be sized contacts the bottom of the sizer die and starts to get sized down the die body slides up on the boolit previous boolit which is stuck in the die in position to be lubbed gets lube pressure on it --- When the die tops out (lube pressure turned off again at top) the next boolit is pushed in and pushes the previous boolit out the top and as the ram is ratracted and the die body slips down that boolit gets lube pressure until the die bottoms out again under gravity/light-spring pressure

With a select few boolits that don't need to be sized down and are just slightly undersize for the sizing die and just slips throug it (like putting boolits that drop at .4515 through a .4520 die) when the boolit to be sized contacts the bottom of the sizer die the die body does not initually slides up due to gravity and light spring pressure on the die body acting downwards and the boolit continues upwards until it pushes the previous boolit out the top and takes its place at this point the top of the press ram makes contact with the bottom of the die body and pushes it upwards until it tops out and then as the ram is ratracted the die body slips down under gravity/light-spring pressure --- all the while the second boolit is in position to be lubed and lube pressure is applied to it

With the lube ports set up this way to be off/on/off rather then just off/on it works either way --- as an added bonus every boolit regardless of which way it happens gets lube pressure applied to it twice while it is in positon both on the down stroke and upstroke --- I dont know about you but Ive had to double cycle more then one boolit on my Lyman to get its lube grooves all the way full with no bubbles or voids --- would happen automatically every time with this kind of press mounted lube sizer if you line the ports up for off/on/off

[tommygirlMT]

And I thought of yet another way to get-err done and not have to worry about the force from sizing opening up the lube ports too soon --- doing it this way the sizing die part never moves:

http://forums.handloads.com/uploads/tommygirlMT/2011-02-21_131831_Press_Mount_Lube_Sizer_Animated.gif

Figured that animated .gif would be the best way to explain and Im getting pretty quick at building them.

[Doby45]

That is AWESOME.. I think it would have next to NOTHING in the way of smearing on the nose because there is such a small cavity that would be pressurized. The whole main cavity gets cut off on the the down stroke of the luber.

I want one, PERIOD..

[Catshooter]

That's pretty ingenious tommygirl. Not only that, but I think that that could just work!


Cat

[Grendl]

tommygirl, it is ingenious, have you given any thought to how the lube would be metered (measured and delivered)?

[Doby45]

It would need to have a spring loaded plunger kinda like a Star. It would be measured by as much lube as would fit in the boolit.

[Charlie Sometimes]

Now THAT is just so dang cool! :cool:
Great idea, and great graphics explaination! [smilie=p:

[JIMinPHX]

Post 8 in this thread shows something that I did a little while back - http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=86638

It was similar to Tommygirl's idea, except that I used a rotary valve instead of a slide valve.

[tommygirlMT]

Cant take all --- or quite frankley --- any credit at this point even though I would love too --- KTN gave me the idea of the sliding valve with his design --- havnt actually built anything yet just thinking and a doodling in .gif animator.

Here is how as I understand it KTN's setup works --- very good --- but as he mentioned if the boolit sizes hard it can lift the sizing die before the ram tops out and sqirt lube on inbetween the boolits and get all over the boolit nose:

http://forums.handloads.com/uploads/tommygirlMT/2011-02-21_213801_KTN_Animated.gif

Ass with any lubra-sizer with a valve set-up to make sure the lube die is only pressurized when a boolit is in position to be lubed --- there is no need for a pump or metering chamber --- just drop a pancake piston in and hook an air feed to top with a pressure regulator to adjust the pressure to just right

Any change of getting some closer pictures of how the rotary valve works on your setup Jimmy?

[tommygirlMT]

Hope I havn't stepped on anyones toes --- as far as scarfing ideas or such --- sometimes I do that without realizing it

I just want a reloading press mounted push through lube sizer that is highly versitile and works good --- I dont care who takes credit or who ends up building them or who makes the money off them if there is money to be made --- just trying to figure it out and put all the peices together to make something that will work and work good for almost everyone

As I stated earlier:

1 --- I think one that screws into 1-1/4x12 big thread that most big presses has from underneath would be best choice --- one that screws into top of 7/8x14 would fit a lot more presses but unfortionatly dropping down in size and putting it on top instead of under press head makes things a whole lot bigger headache for making it work and still keeping it KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) engineer.

2 --- Make it take great big dies that are basically the same as a star die but only bigger diameter and longer so they are big enough that they can be used on almost any caliber and length of boolit to fit a gun that can be shoulder fired and isnt mounted artillary --- I think 1 inch diameter by 2 inch long not including head lip or stap ring and groove would do just fine --- handle calibers up to 80 caliber and allow lube groove spacing spans of up to 1-1/2 inches long with the back front and rear reserved for riding in O-ring seals

3 --- Then make three different types of adapters in the 1x2 big die size --- one that accpts Lyman/RCBS dies --- one that accepts regular size Star dies --- and one that accepts Saico dies --- the little dies just snap or screw inside the big die body and then everyone can use all the old dies they have and if they have something that takes a really big or really long boolit then can get a custom 1x2 big size die made for that --- With a ring clip head instead of a flange head the larger size die shouldnt cost much more then a flange head star die since they both have to be cut from bigger diameter bar stock --- Lathesmith has already told me that he would be willing to cut a scaled up larger version of a star die (price to be negotiated when the time comes of course)

4 --- Last of all is the lube feed --- long story short making a lube reservor with a simple pancake piston and a 1/4" NIP tapped hole in the cap and letting the user patch together their own air pressure system allows for the simplest and I do believe as a result the lowest cost lube reservor possible --- no need to mess around with threaded rods springs and crank assemblies saving complexity time and labor both on the production end and on the user end --- The ability to use both 1x4 solid sticks and 1x4 hollow core sticks would be prefered but building the reservor for solid sticks is the simplest --- here is what I was thinking along those lines for a reservor that comes stock for solid sticks with air feed hole tapped in the top and the bottom plugged with a simple pancake piston with a bolit in its center to tie a cord to for pulling it back out when the lube is exausted that additional accessories can be added to to convert it to use hollow core sticks and even a manual spring load instead of air feed system --- go with the simplist as stock and then if someone wants to buy or build additional optional parts to convert over to hollow core air feed or hollow core manual spring feed they can:

http://forums.handloads.com/uploads/tommygirlMT/2011-02-22_011922_Lube_Res.GIF

I will continue to brainstorm on this --- and when I think Ive got it all figured out and no one else is building them --- then Ill eventually build a couple of them myself if necessary --- but with me eventually can be a long time

[jmsj]

tommygirlMT,
I think your ideas make a lot sense and show a lot of ingenuity. I think it is time someone came up w/ a new design on lubesizers. I imagine necessity is the mother of your invention, needing a sizer for your slugs and larger projectiles?
I needed a sizer to adjust the diameter of my Lee and Lyman slugs. I couldn't find one so I built them. Nothing as involved as your design, just a simple set up that works in a drill press.
I wish you luck w/ your design and development.
Good luck, jmsj

[Doby45]

I prefer your design to the one in post #58. What are you looking at as far as price point? Is this something in the $50 realm? It would need to be to make a mark on the market, but I would pay $100 for one personally.

[scrapcan]

If someone has one to show pictures of a Pitzer sizer and look at the lube control for it.
It could be adapted to the press mounted style.

here is a link to an old thread.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=17528&highlight=pitzer

[KTN]

Hope I havn't stepped on anyones toes --- as far as scarfing ideas or such --- sometimes I do that without realizing it

I will continue to brainstorm on this --- and when I think Ive got it all figured out and no one else is building them --- then Ill eventually build a couple of them myself if necessary --- but with me eventually can be a long time

tommygirlMT,

No problem, not atleast with my toes. I'm wearing my steeltoed workboots :mrgreen:.

Have I mentioned lately why I like this place ? In here ideas and knowledge are shared between members.

Your animation on my sizer working is spot on.
Keep up the good work.


Kaj

[MaxJon]

Cant take all --- or quite frankley --- any credit at this point even though I would love too --- KTN gave me the idea of the sliding valve with his design --- havnt actually built anything yet just thinking and a doodling in .gif animator.

Here is how as I understand it KTN's setup works --- very good --- but as he mentioned if the boolit sizes hard it can lift the sizing die before the ram tops out and sqirt lube on inbetween the boolits and get all over the boolit nose:

http://forums.handloads.com/uploads/tommygirlMT/2011-02-21_213801_KTN_Animated.gif

Ass with any lubra-sizer with a valve set-up to make sure the lube die is only pressurized when a boolit is in position to be lubed --- there is no need for a pump or metering chamber --- just drop a pancake piston in and hook an air feed to top with a pressure regulator to adjust the pressure to just right

Any change of getting some closer pictures of how the rotary valve works on your setup Jimmy?

Ever thought of makig one to suit Lyman/rcbs sizing dies???
BB03

[JIMinPHX]

Any change of getting some closer pictures of how the rotary valve works on your setup Jimmy?

I'm not going to be able to get into my shop until this weekend, so I can't snap any new pictures right this moment.

I do have some of my early sketches in front of me though, & I was able to chop out a few pieces that show the valve parts from the first version. Basically, it's just a cross drilled rod with a few o-rings & an exit hole in the nose. All you need is a little linkage to turn the valve 90 degrees when the ram on your press goes up.

Those GIFs you made look very nice. Would you mind letting me know where you got the software you used to generate them & how long it took you to become proficient with it?

[JIMinPHX]

My later versions use a push valve that was triggered by the handle of the press coming up & pushing on a bar that went across the front of the main housing block. I built it, but I never finished drawing it. That's what the passage above the threaded area on the base block in the drawing above was used for. A spring loaded reciprocating plunger went in there.

I have another version thought up, but not yet drawn or built. I still have a lot of improvements that I want to make & I think that I know how I want to make that happen. I just need to work out the details.

[Grendl]

concept in post #51 and reservoir in #59 make excellent sense and would be much simpler to construct. Thank you for sharing this

[KTN]

Just got an idea :idea:. What about my original idea on lube flow control turned upside down?
Lube valve is open when die is in its down position, on top weak return spring that lets die rise up before boolit sizes down. When die rises lube flow is cut off, next boolit is sized and lube groove is lined with lubeholes, previous lubed boolit is pushed up and when spring pushes die back down, lube flows to groove. With properly positioned lube holes it would be possible to lube boolits twice on single pass through sizer.


Kaj

[PatMarlin]

I drew up some ideas on something along those lines 4-5 years ago, but was trying to do it with a modified LEE sizer die, and single stage press which would be cool if you could adapt it to work with those.

[tommygirlMT]

Just got an idea :idea:. What about my original idea on lube flow control turned upside down?
Lube valve is open when die is in its down position, on top weak return spring that lets die rise up before boolit sizes down. When die rises lube flow is cut off, next boolit is sized and lube groove is lined with lubeholes, previous lubed boolit is pushed up and when spring pushes die back down, lube flows to groove. With properly positioned lube holes it would be possible to lube boolits twice on single pass through sizer.


Kaj


I was basically trying to say something like that in post #50 but was doing it with words instead of pictures --- which for me especially --- are an inferior form of communication unles I really work at the words part and take a lot of time re-reading --- proofing --- rereading --- spell check --- reread --- grammer check --- reread --- punctuation check --- reread --- check sentence structure --- reread ----------- AWWWwww Heck you get the idea!!!!

Only was thinking --- AGAIN THINK LIKE TOGGLE SWITCH DESIGNATIONS --- dont make it off/on (your original set-up) or on/off (the set-up your thinking of now) --- make it off/on/off and then unless you run into rare situation where sizing spring force and amount of force required to size a particular boolit is almost exactly the same it will work either way --- you only need to make another die and punch set with the length of the die increased and hole re-positioned to make your existing unit work as an off/on/off to cuts off the flow of lube at both all the way up and all the way down and lets it flow inbetween --- new punch to match up with new size die (repositioned lube hole) --- and mabey change spring strength on the top end or adjust clearances up there --- basically though its just a different size-die/punch set to change over

Here are two more animated .gif --- both have the exact same components making up the sizer which has an off/on/off vertical slider valve --- the first shows what happens when the spring is stronger then the force needed to size boolit --- the second shows what happens when the force needed to size boolit is more then the spring force --- EITHER WAY IT WORKS --- plus you don’t have to worry about lube leaking all over if you forget to put the first boolit in before you pressurize the lube or leave it sitting pressurized for a while sitting at the bottom of its stroke like you might have to with an on/off set-up:

http://forums.handloads.com/uploads/tommygirlMT/2011-02-23_185138_Animated_Improved_KTNa.gifhttp://forums.handloads.com/uploads/tommygirlMT/2011-02-23_185151_Animated_Improved_KTNb.gif

[JIMinPHX]

I drew up some ideas on something along those lines 4-5 years ago, but was trying to do it with a modified LEE sizer die, and single stage press which would be cool if you could adapt it to work with those.

I thought about basing my little gizmo on the Lee dies rather than the Lyman dies. That would require a hole to be drilled in the side of the Lee die. I had figured that if I included a drilling fixture with the rest of the gizmo, then I could do it.

I have mostly Lyman dies, so I went back to using them.

[JIMinPHX]

Here are two more animated .gif --- both have the exact same components making up the sizer which has an off/on/off vertical slider valve --- the first shows what happens when the spring is stronger then the force needed to size boolit --- the second shows what happens when the force needed to size boolit is more then the spring force --- EITHER WAY IT WORKS --- plus you don’t have to worry about lube leaking all over if you forget to put the first boolit in before you pressurize the lube or leave it sitting pressurized for a while sitting at the bottom of its stroke like you might have to with an on/off set-up:

http://forums.handloads.com/uploads/tommygirlMT/2011-02-23_185138_Animated_Improved_KTNa.gifhttp://forums.handloads.com/uploads/tommygirlMT/2011-02-23_185151_Animated_Improved_KTNb.gif

I think that if you moved the lube feed tube down a bit so that it lined up with the lube groove of the boolit when it was in the fully down position, then you would have a winner there. That way, the lube could flow into the lube groove the entire time that the ram was down rather than for just the 1 second when the boolit was passing the lube feed tube.

[Doby45]

I still prefer your original design. The above design does not use "standard" sizing dies and the mechanics still are not as simple and straight forward as the design Tommygirl posted in post #58.

[PatMarlin]

I tried to find my drawings but they weren't on this computer. I got them somewhere.

[KTN]

I think that if you moved the lube feed tube down a bit so that it lined up with the lube groove of the boolit when it was in the fully down position, then you would have a winner there. That way, the lube could flow into the lube groove the entire time that the ram was down rather than for just the 1 second when the boolit was passing the lube feed tube.


JIMinPHX said just what I was trying to say with my bad English.
Made paper model to show it better.

In this picture is what it looks like before next boolit is sized. Both boolits in die are lined with lubeholes and lube pressure is on.

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o277/kainiin/IMG_3393.jpg

This shows next boolit being pushed into die. Spring on top (not pictured) lets sizerdie rise up, cutting off lube flow, before boolit is sized.

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o277/kainiin/IMG_3395.jpg

Here new boolit is sized and lined up with lubeholes, lubeflow still off.

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o277/kainiin/IMG_3396.jpg

And this is what happens on down stroke. Spring pushes sizerdie back down, lube pressure on both boolits.

http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o277/kainiin/IMG_3397.jpg

Not as clear presentation as TommygirlMT's animation, but hope you all get the idea.
Would propably need to cut groove inside sizerdie, between lubeholes, to let trapped air escape from lube groove. Basepunch lenght would be easy to adjust with washers, but sizerdie would need to be made to fit specific boolit, atleast with double lube pressure idea.


Kaj

[tommygirlMT]

KTN --- I get what your saying (and did before as well) --- lube flow "on" when die is down --- lube flow "off" when die is up

I just think that if you set it up that way your going to have a leak problem --- with the pressure on continuously --- when the mechinsm is "at rest" you stop for a moment to take a drink from your beer --- and then turn back to the sizer and start again and in that time the lube leaked a little on the bottom of the boolit and a little on the top of the boolit and for the next half dozen boolits or so --- lube goop smeared all over the noses as the leakage gets worked out of the die --- even worse if you get up and walk away for a few minutes to wash your hands and get a quick snack or something else like that --- setting up any kind of machinery with a "constant on" / "momentary off" set-up is just asking for one kind of problem or another due to operator distraction or inattention

That said --- I get what your saying --- and mabey if you keep things nice and tight and keep the lube pressure low --- you wont have any leak problems

Doubt you need to set up a set-up like that to lube the boolits twice ---Me thinks they will get plenty of time with the lube pressure on at the bottom of the stroke to fill them up all the way --- as I said Im worried about leak problem not a insufficient fill out problem with that kind of set-up

For a single lube station set-up you can use everything as you have it now with just a new die with the lube holes drilled a little lower to invert the valve action and the spring at the top swapped out for a lighter spring weight one --- Id do up another animated .gif and post it since its only like a five to ten minute modification of the existing file but Ive got somewhere I've got to be at 9 and with the weather like it is right now that means I should have left at 8 and its already ten after so Ive got to scedaddle

[tommygirlMT]

KTN --- here is an animation for your sizer operating with a single set of lube holes with the lube holes spaced to turn on lube flow on the bottom of stroke and turn off lube when a boolit is pressed into the die (light spring on top) ---

http://forums.handloads.com/uploads/tommygirlMT/2011-02-28_161626_Inverse_KTN_Animated.gif











I prefer your design to the one in post #58. What are you looking at as far as price point? Is this something in the $50 realm? It would need to be to make a mark on the market, but I would pay $100 for one personally.

I was thinking something in the $100-$150 range direct to customer vender sponser type sale --- basically something that won't cost you any more then a new Lyman/RCBS but will hold its own with a star ($250) --- and is stronger and more rugged then any lube sizer commercially made because it is mounted in a reloading press like the lee dies that size only and dont lube

Your own signiture line "Good, Cheap, Fast: Pick two." pretty much explains the situation

If you were willing to give up a little bit of versatility and have something that only used star type dies --- and didn't use a bigger size die that would allow addapters to be cut allowing the use of all three main lube size die type (Star --- Lyman/RCBS --- Saco) plus allow the lube sizing of bigger diameter boolits then any commercial lube sizer will do --- and allow the lube sizing of longer boolits then a star can handle through the use of the bigger die size itself instead of just using it as an adapter socket

And were willing to give up the speed advantage of an automatic press ram activated lube valve --- and instead were willing to just use an off the shelf $10 pluming type ball valve to manually turn the lube off and on and do a little work to set up the lube reservor and the plumbing yourself --- then you could go pretty cheap --- mabey even all the way down to your $50 mark even as a "one off" project instead of a group buy quantity purchase without too much trouble having someone like Buckshot or one of the other helpful machinist goo-roos on this forum make up only these three fairly simple components for you:

http://forums.handloads.com/uploads/tommygirlMT/2011-02-28_164315_Improved_Pope_Precision_Components.GIF

That would be a 7/8x14 thread die body to hold star type push through dies underneath the press head with a simple drilled and NIP standard pipe thread tapped hole in the side for lube injection --- a simple Lee type flat punch to snap into the shell holder slot on the ram --- and a simple pancake piston with two O-ring grooves to fit into a 1" diameter iron pipe

Add to that:
--- Two O-rings to fit your pancake piston and a short bolt to attach a string too for pulling it back out to refill lube underneath
--- One 6" length of 1" black iron pipe male threads on both ends
--- Two 1" iron pipe female threaded caps
--- Drill and tap for 1/4" NIP threads
--- 1/4" NIP ball valve
--- Assorted 1/4" pipe fittings including air line type quick disconnect/connect units if desired

Make the lube reservor out of the 1" pipe length and two caps (it would take 1x4 solid lube sticks like available from white label lube that are used in Star) drilling and tapping the both caps the top one for air pressure in and the bottom one for lube out --- plum the air and lube lines so that with the addition of your air compressor and reloading press you end up with basically an improved "Pope type" lube sizer that works like this:

http://forums.handloads.com/uploads/tommygirlMT/2011-02-28_161706_Improved_Pope_Animated.gif











I also thought of a good way to set up the bottom base punch part of my own sliding lube valve design --- make the big ring that contacts the outer valve just a simple donut cut from plate steel with the center hold in that donut the same diameter as the stop ring diameter on standard Lyman top punches --- then make the part that snaps into the shell holder slot on the top of the press ram with a top diameter that is that same diameter and is center drilled the diameter of the stems on Lyman top punches --- then you can just use a simple flat end Lyman type top punch flipped upside down (like sold by acurate molds for $2 each http://www.accuratemolds.com/topPunch.php as your push through punch with the donut cut from plate steel dropping down around that whole assembly and you can add washers under the plate steel donut to reduce the effective punch length or add washers under the punch to increase the effective punch length --- plus you can drop in a regular Lyman top punch and size base first if desired which some people find helps with gas checks --- especially the PB gas checks that Pat Marlin's tool makes where people are running the boolits through the Lee push through dies base first to swag the check onto the boolit base

http://forums.handloads.com/uploads/tommygirlMT/2011-02-28_161745_Punch_Set-up.GIF











And I also did up another animation of my idea with a little more detail and clarification --- also made it a "Junior design" that just uses Star dies only and goes in the smaller 7/8x14 thread rather then the big 1-1/4x12 bushing thread with the bigger dies that can be used both to allow addaption to all other sizer dies and allow bigger and longer boolits then normal as previously discussed --- figure some would be just fine and dandy with a slightly smaller version for 7/8x14 thread that only takes star dies --- so making/offering both a Jr. and full size version model may be a good plan

http://forums.handloads.com/uploads/tommygirlMT/2011-02-28_161733_Animated_Improved_Jr_Size_Version.gif












Anyway --- that is what has been rattling around in my head since I was last on this forum a couple days ago --- lets keep the brain storm idea pool going

[Charlie Sometimes]

Now yer talking!
A Junior would suit my needs fine, and I like the last GIF idea best.

Make it so you could use a boolit catch bucket like Lee uses for their push-thru sizers and you would be done.

[Doby45]

http://forums.handloads.com/uploads/tommygirlMT/2011-02-28_161733_Animated_Improved_Jr_Size_Version.gif

This is my fav but I would go ahead with the fullsize threaded portion instead of the thinner threaded portion. I think it will just add to the durability. On a press like my breech lock I could just put it on without the breech sleeve.

[Lonerider]

Ok....Where do I add my name to the list of future pruchasers!!!!:grin:

As I get older, I am getting into; 'the simplier....the better' way of thinking.

I work with leather, repairing saddles and bridles and such. I have a cast iron 'Boss' leather, hand operated stiching machine. It will stich leather up to
3/4" thick. Works great! I am currently in the market for an Adler, hand cranck shoe patching machine, to do more intrique work and repair on hunting packs/pantiers and such.

I like the idea of not having to spend any more on electricity than I have too. May not be as fast as high volume production shops, but I like to believe my end product is just as good and maybe better, becuase of my personal labor involve. More quality control.

As I have been following this thread with interest, I would like to chime in with the idea of providing different modles at different stages.

For me, it would be the Jr. size to go on my single stage, cast iron press, with the 7/8 x 14 threads. But instead of automated using air, hydraulics, or whatever, I am in favor of just simple, easy going manual affair.

I currently use the Lee push thru sizer for 4 different calibers and I love it. What would be better, would to be able to use the push thru sizer and be able to lube the grooves. For me, whether its using a lube stick or some sort 'mush' filled in a pot and use a plunger to push thru the system would work for me and my interests.

What I like about CB, is becuase of the attitude of helping each other succeed, even if we do not benefit from the efforts personally. I see this going on in this thread and it is very encouraging to me.

If this does somehow come to fruitation.....I want to be first in line.

Lonerider

[Charlie Sometimes]

All of my single stage presses are 7/8-14; don't own anything with the larger opening or a threaded bushing. That option is unnecessary for 95% of reloaders, I'd think.

One thing that I have thought about with this design- how hard (or easy) would it be to damage or bend the unit when mounted on a press- so that it would not function? Say someone leans down on the lube chamber, or other improper or careless methods/scenerios.

Simpler is better, all things considered, but maybe a little extra metal for reinforcement here and there wouldn't hurt, JMO.

I think you have the boolit sizing whipped, and besides needing a catch basin, some method of removing the lube piston to refill the chamber really needs addressed- the idea of using "string" to pull the it back out will not be sufficient once the lube grabs it and it gets all the way to the bottom. In your design, you have the ability to use the threaded rod (like Lyman & RCBS does) to raise or lower it. Are there any better ways?

[nanuk]

Wow.

all I can say is Wow!

there are some smart Cookies on this forum

[mwohlenhaus]

how much did those push thru lube sizers that you guys made cost in materials to build and are they easy for an average knowledged lathe/mill operator to build?

[LatheRunner]

mwohlenhaus,
Sorry it took so long to respond, life has been very busy . I got all of my material from scrap parts or drops from the saw at work. Alot of my parts are recycled from other items that were going in the scrap bin. I think it would be a very good job for you to do . Let me know and I will get drawings together. And a list of materials. I would be happy to help you anyway I can,

LatheRunner

[deltaenterprizes]

I would be interested in the drawings and material list also.

[Lonerider]

I conitnue to follow this thread, because I am very, very intrested in getting one, if you all come together and make it happen. I would be very proud to have something where a bunch of folks, working together came up with a design that benefits us caster. Or at least a list/kit on how we can put one together ourselves.

However, I am a little confuse on how you would lube different cast bullets with different groves in the same caliber? I do not see any adjustment for number of groove rings or spacing of those rings.

Have BAbores 462-465GC design with 3 groove rings. The nose profile is flat. But if I used another design with a rounder nose, thus placing the first groove ring at a different space on the bullet. How will this affect the lubesizer? Could the .462 sizer I got from Bullshop be modified? Or would I to start completely over?

As mentioned before, I am not interested in a full automatic system. In fact would prefer a manual operation by pulling on the handle during resizing have it lube at the same time of pushing my boolit through the die. Meaning if I got to pump the lube into the groove by hand, while am on the up stroke, I am ok with that.

Just was wondering how will this work for bullets of the same caliber, but of different design and profiles?

I like the concept.....just need a little guidance.....not afraid to do things on my own...but a little assistance would be a good thing.

[Lonerider]

I also, am more interested to use with the standard 14 x 7/8 dies, to use on my rcbs jr.

Thanks JiminPHX, KTM and TommygirlMT, for all the encouragements in regards to this project. I for one am grateful for the excelent personal and professional attitudes.

[JIMinPHX]

I've got some improved designs drawn up. I hope to have my next prototype constructed in a few weeks. If it works out well, I'll post pictures.

[Lonerider]

Thanks Jim...

[cptkeybrd]

I am so happy that I finally got a 450 lubrisizer with white label lube and some lee push thru's that I use 45-45-10 with. My bullet lubing is a dream now, besides I spent my budget on the last 5 Mihec molds that I bought and they sure are nice. Amazing talent we have here on the board, you guys keep on keepin on. I'll just read with amazement.
Oh I gotta say my hat is off to tommygirlmt for the animations.

[JIMinPHX]

For the most part, this design seems alright. I've just got 3 issues left to deal with.

First, I need to shorten up a few parts a little bit so that I'll have room for longer rifle boolits. I had forgotten to take into account that my press has less than 4" of stroke. That shouldn't be any big deal to take care of.

Second, I need to stretch out the rectangular body block another 1/2" to make room for a heater cartridge. No big deal there either.

The third issue is a little tougher to tackle. I designed this thing to use standard Lyman style sizing dies. I'm having a problem when I try to stuff several boolits through the die, one on top of the other. The small diameter section of the die is pretty long & the pile of boolits sitting under tension puts up enough resistance to crunch the boolits at the bottom of the pile. This thing is turning my round nose boolits into RNFPs. It's also squishing down the boolits enough to increase the length of their bearing surface. I could modify the die on my lathe & everything would work out OK, but I don't want to do that. I want to end up with a design that works well with plain old standard dies that are off the shelf anywhere you look for them. I'll need to ponder that a little more.

[Lonerider]

Well, I am glad this thread has not faded away. We sure to have talented folks here.

Jim, it looks like you have gone into a different direction. I like the idea that you are using the simple little 'C' press from Lee. I have one also besides Lee's classic cast turret. I use the little press to size my .462-465 GC bullets from Bruces mold, using Buckshots excellent sizer (simliar to Lee's push thru dies), with great results.

I was hoping that you or KTN would be going in that direction and I was also hoping that someone one could design one with out having to use a heater. But instead, just a softer lube that could be squished between the grooves, as the bullet was being sized with a Buckshots sizer die.

If you have mutiple bullets of the same diameter but with different lube grooves locations, how is that going to work with yours or KTN's or anyone elses lubesizer? Is this unrealistic, will a person need to purchase a lubesizer for evey boolit style? Seems silly.

I am not a machinist or an engineer, so I do not know all the technicals 'stuff'.

Just wondering why it is so hard to to take a LEE sizer die, drill a hole on the side, mount the lube resouvoir with a plunger and call it good.

There has got to be away to keep things simple, with out having to add a heater on top of all that.


So, JIMinPHX, KTM, Tommygirl, or anyone else, could you weigh in on this, and explain to me in simple caveman terms, how this would work?

I like the concept of screwing in a unit on top of a standard 7/8 x 14 thread single stage press and to be able to size and lube, using a push thru system like lee's. Now the question is....can it be done? and can it be made affordable? and can the concept be kept as simple as possible?

Lonerider

[JIMinPHX]

Just wondering why it is so hard to to take a LEE sizer die, drill a hole on the side, mount the lube resouvoir with a plunger and call it good.
...
So, JIMinPHX, KTM, Tommygirl, or anyone else, could you weigh in on this, and explain to me in simple caveman terms, how this would work?

I like the concept of screwing in a unit on top of a standard 7/8 x 14 thread single stage press and to be able to size and lube, using a push thru system like lee's. Now the question is....can it be done? and can it be made affordable? and can the concept be kept as simple as possible?

Lonerider

Yes it is possible to drill a hole in the side of a Lee sizer & attach a lubing gizmo. It just requires that you drill the hole & not screw up the polished center bore. I thought about going in that direction & including a drill jig with the unit, but instead, I decided to flip a Lyman die upside down &make it into a push through.

Can it be done? - yes.
Can it be made affordable? - I'm working on it. My target price is $125-$150. I'm not there yet.
Can it be kept simple? - I'm working on simplifying it. I've already gotten rid of a few unnecessary features, but I'm probably not done there yet either.

The unit in the picture is just a prototype. I intended to make an adjustable ram out of a piece of thread rod. It would be adjustable in length & have different tips for different calibers.

[Lonerider]

Thanks Jim, don't mean to ruffle any feathers. I admire you and all on CB that have the talent and abilities to create 'stuff'. Sadly, I am not wired that way. I sure do enjoy tearing things apart to see what makes them tic.....its putting them back together, is where I get into trouble.

The thing I like about Castboolits is the independence as well as willing to help out a fellow member with their projects also....even if they are some waht similiar. Its the family friendly and willing to help each other with no strings attached atmosphere that I like.

For instance, this Gary Fryxell. I do not know him, but his willingness to provide a casting resource for the members here, free of charge, is huge to me.

I have also found that other members that make their products available here, treat us with upmost respect and are very fair in their dealing with other members. This is also huge.

I suspect, with the membership as big as Castboolits, there are more than one way 'to skin a cat'. Which for us that are mechanically challenged or do not have the resources to hire others, benefit from the cooperations of the various venders.

I tip my hat to all of you and say thank you, to all of those than make Castboolits what it is. An atttiude of, ' Lets make things better, improve what we have, and pass onto others, our experiences.

Haven't heard from KTN or tommygirl lately....is their project put on hold?


Lonerider

[Von Dingo]

I want to see the outcome.

[PatMarlin]

That's a great statement and point of view Lonerider. Many newcomers to CB could do well by taking a note of what you write. Sadly there are those who just do not get it.

Thanks for posting your progress Jim. It shows some folks who have no idea just how much work is truly involved in developing a product.



Thanks Jim, don't mean to ruffle any feathers. I admire you and all on CB that have the talent and abilities to create 'stuff'. Sadly, I am not wired that way. I sure do enjoy tearing things apart to see what makes them tic.....its putting them back together, is where I get into trouble.

The thing I like about Castboolits is the independence as well as willing to help out a fellow member with their projects also....even if they are some waht similiar. Its the family friendly and willing to help each other with no strings attached atmosphere that I like.

For instance, this Gary Fryxell. I do not know him, but his willingness to provide a casting resource for the members here, free of charge, is huge to me.

I have also found that other members that make their products available here, treat us with upmost respect and are very fair in their dealing with other members. This is also huge.

I suspect, with the membership as big as Castboolits, there are more than one way 'to skin a cat'. Which for us that are mechanically challenged or do not have the resources to hire others, benefit from the cooperations of the various venders.

I tip my hat to all of you and say thank you, to all of those than make Castboolits what it is. An atttiude of, ' Lets make things better, improve what we have, and pass onto others, our experiences.

Haven't heard from KTN or tommygirl lately....is their project put on hold?


Lonerider

[JIMinPHX]

Thanks Jim, don't mean to ruffle any feathers.

No feathers were ruffled. Sorry if my response gave you that impression.

[JIMinPHX]

I suspect, with the membership as big as Castboolits, there are more than one way 'to skin a cat'.

That's one reason why I usually try not to look at too much that other people have done before scratching out a new design of my own. If I look at what others have already done, it may sway me towards only refining an existing design & prevent me from coming up with new ideas.

[JIMinPHX]

If you have mutiple bullets of the same diameter but with different lube grooves locations, how is that going to work with yours or KTN's or anyone elses lubesizer?

This would be one option

[shooterg]

Lonerider right on - "more than one way to skin a cat" . Otherwise we'd all be just using George Herter's "Perfect" tools, no need for them stinkin, blue, red,green machines all over the place !

I have only used a Lee sizer to date, but have many molds now, very interested in this sizer project that may only cost half of a Star.

[Lonerider]

You guys and gals are so GREAT!!!! 8-):-):wink::D

[tommygirlMT]

I think I have a solution to the nose damage issue --- figured out a way to make a mechanical stroke action where it is a two stage stroke with a conistent stop point on the short stroke --- unfortionatly it would have to be a non-press mounted lube sizer:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/imagehosting/51104debbb9090a85.gif

Each rotation gives first a short stroke and then a long stroke --- as drawn and timed

--- 6" diameter wheel
--- 1/2" diameter wheel hub and bearing rods
--- slightly over 4" total stroke
--- first (short) stroke is a little over 2"

I just drew and animated the mechanism for now --- but --- it could be set up so first (short) stroke puts the boolit into the die in position to be lubed --- then there is about a 1/3 rotation where it just sits in that position --- a cam could be used to time a lube valve to open during that portion of the rotation and/or activate a lube pump --- then the full lenth stroke pushes the boolit out the bottom of the die completely before the cycle repeats for the next boolit

Obviously --- rotory motion makes motorization a very easy upgrade --- along those lines a second cam could also be rigged to activate a boolit feeding assembly of some sort --- but simple hand crank operation is certainly posible with boolits fed one at a time by hand

[JIMinPHX]

Tommygirl, that's interesting. I had thought about having a stop block that pivots in & out on the ram to limit travel to two different stop positions. Your idea would lend itself better to an automated design.

[tommygirlMT]

Yah --- I kinda got the automation bug now --- my man has been building an automated casting machine and although I raised an eyebrow (as in singular) one he first told me he was going to do so --- it has been looking pretty good and I am pleasently supprized at what he has come up with and I am starting to see the wisdom in the basic idea --- as he puts it he doesnt want a machine that is fast or anything just one that casts excellent quality and can handle HP and HB molds even if it runs slow and methodically --- because he can just let it run and "baby sit" it while he is doing something else like lubing or loading and thus although he might be able to cast faster by hand it will still save him because he can work on other stuff while it is running

So Ive been thinking along the same lines --- thought about the special three position air cyliners that Bimba sells that have a positive stop part way through the stroke but they are like $100+ for just the cylinder so Ive been a doodling on this for a while trying to figure out how to do a three position stroke that would not only put the boolit in the die but also punch it all the way through after it got lubed --- my first though was a planetary gear crank set-up with a gear half the size of the outer ring inner tooth hub running inside that outer hub and the crank attached to the smaller gear with the larger inner tooth hub gear being the drive gear and the inner smaller gear being the driven gear which in a 2/1 drive ratio with a crank and rod would produce a double stroke short and long --- But such would be a smooth running set-up it wouldnt be cheap either --- gears arnt cheap especially if they are custom --- Now a metal disk with a couple holes punched in it and a couple bearing rods pressed into the holes --- that is cheap and easy --- some impact and sliding wear but shouldnt be a problem provided it is run at slow speeds --- motorization would probaby be a cheap very lowe end RPM range output worm gear drive gear box --- something in the 10 RPM range --- which would still mean 600 boolits an hour sized and lubed which if your doing something else and just letting it run with a little bit of baby sitting aint bad at all

As for your design you posted a picture of on the previous page --- I love the way you made the valve just a simple push button that is positioned to be right next to the press handle when it is raised --- pure genius of simplicity

[JIMinPHX]

Yah --- I kinda got the automation bug now ---

So Ive been thinking along the same lines --- thought about the special three position air cyliners that Bimba sells that have a positive stop part way through the stroke but they are like $100+ for just the cylinder

My day job is factory automation related. I'm pretty deep into that stuff on the high end. If you have a big budget, anything can be made to work well. Trying to do more with less can be a bit of a challenge at times.

If you want an economy version of a 3 position air cylinder, try piggy-backing two air cylinders together. You can fire just #1, or just #2 or #1 & #2 at the same time. If the two stroke lengths are different, that gives you 4 possible positions.

[LatheRunner]

I finished the drawings and the materials list for the lubesizer I built. Like I said

before, I used scrap material, drops from the saw, material left over from other

jobs, and parts that were going to go in the trash to build this. So I built this for

nothing, 0$. I have included the part numbers from some of the parts and the

page numbers in the McMasterCarr catalog. I used a DESTA CO hold down clamp

for the ram. You may be able to find something else to use. I did not show the

bolt holes for the handle I made. They just go thru the handle on the desta

clamp. My handle is 1" Dia. x 11" alum bar. I guess you will have to look at the

drawings and decide if this little project is worth doing for you. I had fun building

it and it works real good. If you have any questions please feel free to ask. I will

be happy to help.

LatheRunner

[LatheRunner]

Sorry there is no drawing file. It was to big to post. I will have to make it two files on monday.

LatheRunner

[Catshooter]

How about some pics of your machine?


Cat

[LatheRunner]

3 pdf files. Any questions or if you need more pics just ask.

LatheRunner

[Catshooter]

Quite the machine LatheRunner, thanks.

Welcome to the site too by the way.


Cat

[LatheRunner]

Thanks for the complament Catshooter. Now I have to find the time to shoot all the boolits I lubed with it.

LatheRunner

[JIMinPHX]

It looks like you have quite a bit going on there. Would you care to elaborate on how exactly it is that she functions?

[LatheRunner]

Hello JIMinPHX. Well lets see. Lube in the tube, air cylinder for pressure, to push lube to the center of the base. The hold down clamp is the ram. Push boolit into die . When you raise the handle to add another boolit the bar on the top pushes the pivot toward the die. There is a plunger in the base that puts pressure on the lube in the die. 4 holes in die. When you add a boolit it pushes the one the die out. I have a Alum. plate between the base plate and the mounting plate. I use a iron for heat. Works pretty good for a first try.

LatheRunner

[Blublister]

Yet another project for my ever growing list of things to build.

[gunoholic]

Well I'm just happy that that SOB out bid me on the rcbs lube sizer I was bidding on the other week. As my home built one works so good and fast that I'll have to build a boolit feeder to feed it as my fingers can't keep up.:rolleyes:

[Kawriverrat]

What happened here there were some great ideas regarding a press mounted lube & sizer. Did any one come up with something final that worked well ? ....Jeff

[Jim Flinchbaugh]

What happened here there were some great ideas regarding a press mounted lube & sizer. Did any one come up with something final that worked well ? ....Jeff

I home cloned a Star last winter. Worked till I broke it lol
Re-desiging the weak point i uncovered
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v313/James64/P2235581_zpsmvcdbp1q.jpg

[dverna]

Jim, that is an impressive job.

[Jim Flinchbaugh]

you think casting lead is fun, wait till you start casting aluminum!
My small home foundry is a blast,
Dream it up and make it!

[Kawriverrat]

Jim, your work there dies look very nice....Jeff